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Why Tomlin isn't the problem...

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by steelersfan35, Dec 23, 2018.

  1. Wardismvp

    Wardismvp Well-Known Member

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    He has failed to meet expectations with a franchise QB playing for him. Shame on Mike.
     
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  2. steelersfan35

    steelersfan35 Well-Known Member

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    And he just signed another extension with the Steelers...
     
  3. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    upload_2021-4-21_15-0-55.jpeg

    How do you even remember posting something from 2 years ago.
     
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  4. S.T.D

    S.T.D Well-Known Member

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    It was the only time he was right.
    Know way he's going 2 forget.
    Disclaimer: this is just a joke. I don't even know this poster. :smiley1:
    Also dig that pic Blast. 2 funny.
     
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  5. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    A franchise QB who isnt Brady....now name someone who has done better with their own franchise QB?? I'll wait...
     
  6. Thor

    Thor Well-Known Member

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    The 2001-10 Colts with Manning. It can't really be compared straight up though because Tomlin/Ben have been together longer.
     
  7. jeh1856

    jeh1856 Still working on the training

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    Cheerios, I think I had Cheerios for breakfast.
     
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  8. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    How did the Colts do better?...they only won one championship with him and then didnt think he was good enough to finish his career with them. Probably would have been better off saying Eli since at least he won it twice while playing for the same coach...the point being the only other franchise QB with more than one ring under the same coach is 1 besides Brady. Manning did with the Broncos but it was his last two seasons in the league. They were stacked but I'm not going to hold that against him.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
  9. Steel Hog

    Steel Hog Well-Known Member

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    Walsh, Landry, Johnson, Noll
     
  10. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    I thought we were talking since Tomlin became coach or at least since Brady's run started?? but since you want to up the ante by going into the archives. I mean is that what it takes? You bring up coaches from a period before free agency started to break up teams???? I think we need to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges. You'll only be able to find a couple of coaches if we do that and thats Tom Coughlin and Mike Shanahan....whether people on here consider those two to be actual better coaches than Tomlin I don't know.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
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  11. Thor

    Thor Well-Known Member

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    You need to quit shifting the parameters. One minute you're asking which coach has done better with a franchise QB, then it's team, then it's which franchise QB has won more. Then you're arguing one franchise QB was better than another so that changes the results, etc.

    As for the Colts, check my reply to you in the other Tomlin thread. In the ten year span with Manning they had more wins, division championships, and playoff appearances. Tomlin and the Steelers have the same amount of SB appearances and wins, which is notable. But in terms of overall success, the Colts won more, and it could be argued that the Steelers had more talent through their offensive/defensive rankings year-to-year. You can focus on Eli and the Giants if you want. I just opted to remain in the AFC.

    Of course, at some point it would be nice if you did your own research instead of throwing blank claims around and then shifting the variables you think should be included in supporting them.
     
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  12. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    If at the end of the day all anybody cares about at the end of the day is the Lombardi trophy then everything you just said is for shhhhh and I still remain correct that only one combo coach/QB has done better. I thought Manning/Shanahan had with the Broncos but I stand corrected.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
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  13. Maddog78

    Maddog78 Well-Known Member

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  14. Maddog78

    Maddog78 Well-Known Member

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    Also, by the time they got Maddox, he was a bust retread from the XFL. By 2001, Kordell had already been benched for Jim Miller, Mike Tomczak, and Jeff Graham. He was close to being out of the league and Cowher squeezed his best year out of him, going 13-3 and reaching the AFCC.
     
  15. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    I honestly dont know why anymore people get so caught up in playoff wins. I'd be curious to know how many of those teams over that time went on to win the SB? If they didn't win the SB what difference does it make??

    As one other person said in response to the second tweet...they may all be facts but they are irrelevant facts.
     
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  16. Thor

    Thor Well-Known Member

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    So are SB wins your final parameter? Because you've been flailing around with which you want based upon which you seem to approve, that still support your claim.

    Tomlin has won one SB. There are ten other coaches that have hoisted the Lombardi since 2001, the year the 'Brady era' started:

    Billick
    Gruden
    Dungy
    Coughlin
    Payton
    McCarthy
    Carroll
    Kubiak
    Peterson
    Reid

    By your rationale, these coaches (and their respective QBs, if you're insisting on the combo) are all equal to Tomlin. Including multiple years with the same QB as a qualifier doesn't help your argument - we can agree teams without a franchise QB have a harder path than those that do. (Similar to when you initially defended your stance against the accomplishments of the Colts in the other thread by saying that Ben was one step below Manning, and two below Brady.)

    Moreover, wins represent only one side of the equation. Your view discounts the talent level of the teams involved, which of course plays a significant role when evaluating the performance of the coaches leading them to victory.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
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  17. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    Classic case of a guy that has lost an argument, but can't admit it so he keeps moving the target.
     
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  18. KnoxVegasSteel

    KnoxVegasSteel Well-Known Member

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    WTF is this bullsh!ttery? Since this thread died 3 years ago, all Tomlin has done is missed the postseason twice and gotten embarrassed by little brother brownies and went 1 and done in postseason. But Tomlin isn't the problem... umm OK. You probably blame yourself for your wife cheating on you too.
     
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  19. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    Refer to my last post to you in the Tomlin thread. I don't feel like repeating myself.
     
  20. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    What argument was lost???
     
  21. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    When Thor Gave you the Indianapolis Colts and Peyton Manning as an example. Then you went and changed the rules of the debate by add a bunch of other stipulations after the fact. Jesus Christ Dude this isn’t that hard ,give it up already.
     
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  22. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    Give up what? The question was name a coach that had done a better job with a franchise QB. I never laid out any parameters. THE OP HAD ALREADY DONE THAT...but if the topic is Tomlin I shouldn't have to explain that. The answer (aside from the obvious) was Coughlin/Manning....that's the only answer. There is no answer other than that. I cant help it if he decided to go off on this tangent and find irrelevant facts when the answer was obvious and didnt require all the Google searching he did and I'm sorry you decided to have a coniption over a back and forth that really doesnt concern you. You should take a break from the board before you soil and fudge your pants if you're that uptight about it. If there was a misunderstanding that's on you and your bf, not me.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
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  23. Steel Hog

    Steel Hog Well-Known Member

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    That's right, no parameters but then you criticized my response above because some were from before Brady. You asked a question and I answered it as it was written.
     
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  24. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    I didnt criticize it because it was wrong...I criticized it because essentially its apples to oranges with your answer. I mean you're not going to have the same results prior to free agency that you have since (I'm throwing out the Patriots as an isolated case. I mean you have to. Its 9 SB appearances in like a 19-20 yr timeframe). You have to encompass the whole team at that point not just the QB if you're going to compare the two periods. I think that's a fair assessment and anybody who is willing to be objective would agree. I will concede that Shanahan/Elway should be included in the mix with Coughlin/Manning if we're going back to the start of free agency (94?), but that wasnt one of your choices.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
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  25. Marvology

    Marvology Well-Known Member

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    The irony of your avatar and blaming Tomlin for the Browns blowout :hmm:
     

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