Crucify me if you wish, but I've changed my mind...

That first PI call on Lewis was BS!!! That penalty on Ryan Clark was BS!!!

That fumble call on Ben...I've seen the replay now probably 40 times and I now think that it might have been the right call. At the very least it's a judgement call so I can see how it wouldn't be overturned.

The ball never came out of his hand, but while his hand was still behind his body, it definitely shifted and partly came out. Did he lose control of it or did it just shift? Only Ben knows, we'll never know and neither will the refs, but I can now see the other side and I get how they called it like that.

The other calls were still terrible.

Anyway, crucify me now. I just made myself an easy target.

 

now that I've seen it several times I think I agree it could be called either way really

 

You've been an easy target since the beginning of time, now you're just starting to realize it .

 

i bet if it was tomtom it would have comeback.

 

If the Steelers don't come back - it's a BOGUS call.

Since they won - I can see why they called it a fumble.

 

not me i think it was an incomplete pass

 

Now that I've seen it a million times I'm absolutely positive that was a HORRIBLE call. Even if it "MOVED" it doesn't matter. It has to be that he has an empty hand on the way forward which he CLEARLY did not. I think Ben's face pretty much lets us know that it was an incomplete pass. But I get it now.... YOU'RE PHIL SIMMS!!!! I never knew it until now! You're Phil Simms!!! You changed your mind DURING the game and said that "everyone still disagrees with me but I now think it was a fumble." So it HAS to be you! I just want to let you know that you are a horrible broadcaster and you're one of THE biggest homers of ALL announcers. LOL!

 

Not trying to crucify you at all, I respect others opinions. However, my only question is... Would it be called the same way for Tom Brady or Peyton Manning?

 

Ray D speaks the truth.

 

Tuck rule wouldn't apply, Ben never brought the ball back towards his body. I believe he tried to but it just came out, but unless he actually pulls the ball back in, the tuck rule wouldn't apply. Intent doesn't matter.

 

I have to be honest, I didn't read the rule as it's written, but the way they explained the rule, that if it begins to come loose before he begins to throw it, that it's a fumble regardless of if his hand is empty coming forward or not. It's all about whether it was beginning to come loose or not, at least that's the way they explained the rule.

 

EXACTLY my thoughts too. It should have been called an incomplete pass to begin with...and then let the Giants decide if they wanted to challenge it or not!

 

Horrible call...my brother called it the worst instant replay call since Troy's INT in the colts playoff game. What is the precedent that this call sets? Anytime the call shifts in the QB's hands is it a fumble, any wobbly pass a fumble? Come one it was pathetic!!!

 

My earlier comment was just said in jest. I agree it was a bogus call.

The thing is - if it's Peyton Manning or Tom Brady on that play - they call it incomplete from the moment it hits the ground - probably even with Eli Manning. With Ben - it's a fumble until proven otherwise.

 

Ben appeared to still have good control. Doesn't that matter?

 

Yes that PI call and personal foul were terrible...in REAL time you could see it. The announcers said oh in retail it would have been hard to see if it was a hit to the head or not...then they showed it in real time and you could easily tell, haha. I even SLIGHTLY questioned the 2nd PI call on Lewis...the WR stopped as Lewis had his head turned looking back for the ball and they collided...but out of the 2 the first should NEVER have been called. The Refs pretty much gave the Giants 14 points.

 

It has to be "on its way out" which just because it "moved" doesn't mean it was "on its way out". But you are right about the tuck rule though. But as stupid as they call that one I wouldn't have been surprised if they'd have just came back and said "tuck rule incomplete!" LOL.

 

That's the exact essence of the tuck rule. If the grip isn't total and your trying to regrip and bring the ball back down into a tuck. (while still having control of the ball) There's no way he didn't have control of that ball with the throwing motion he had going on. It's plain to see it came out at the end of his motion which was a downward direction. At the very least it was a pump fake that slipped out, same thing...incomplete. Everyone int the room including Giants fans said it was comming back. Coughlins' face showed the shock/suprise that they got that call as well. (Note they didn't show that shot of him again, nor did they talk about it)

 

I actually sent someone a text during the game and said this is the WORST officiating I've seen since the 05 playoffs and I was right too.

 

Yup the fact that it shifts is not a fumble. It's plain as day from the replay that he still had control because he damn near turns the ball completely sideways while trying to bring it back down. Look at the impression by his thumb! that's a grip on the ball if I ever saw one!