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Ben is returning to the Steelers

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by steelersrule6, Feb 23, 2021.

  1. KMM

    KMM Well-Known Member

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    excuse me for being late to the party, but I just looked up the pass play stats on Pro-Football reference and didn't realize how bad it was. I knew we didn't run much play action, but had no clue we were dead last in the league. And not by a little bit. The Steeler ran 51 play action pass plays which was last in the league. Second place was 91 play action plays. On top of that the Steelers led the league in pass attempts.

    Criminy.
     
  2. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    No reason to run play action if you aren’t running the ball effectively. This obviously has to change and I’m hoping that is part of what Art and Ben discussed about his return.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Very Optimistic Very Optimistic x 1
  3. steelersrule6

    steelersrule6 Well-Known Member

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    Ben isn't playing for the minimum, the NFLPA isn't going to allow that.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  4. S.T.D

    S.T.D Well-Known Member

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    Oh ......NOW WE MOVE THE GOAL POST. LOL. Just like I suspected. Sad thing is . No matter if he does well next year, or not.
    Some people just can't be wrong no matter what new things maybe brought 2 light. Seen it alot. If he does well . It will because of the line, or the Wrs bailed him out. Maybe cause our Rb are great now. It will be something. It's ok. When you want to get back 2 wins and losses, instead of, I bet we get the ball 1st, or who wins the coin flip let me know.:thumbs_up:
     
  5. Thor

    Thor Well-Known Member

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    I'd think so. I've been looking here and there trying to find actual CBA language on it and haven't found anything yet - players giving back salary obviously doesn't come up much.

    Because depending upon the reasoning against cuts, an argument could be made against the incentives. If the NFLPA's reasoning is to ensure contract integrity (i.e., the player is paid base wages unless cut or the contract formally restructured), they could say that team and player could effectively accomplish the same by loading unrealistic goals.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  6. S.T.D

    S.T.D Well-Known Member

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    I didn't think they(Steelers) did incentive based contracts?.?.?
     
  7. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    They don’t but they are in uncharted territory here. I see noise coming from Ben’s camp that he would be insulted if he was asked to take a pay reduction. Who knows what the actual outcome will be.

    Perhaps all the posturing in the media wasn’t about money and was simply to hammer home to Ben that he is replaceable and that he is going to have to change, that they will be running the ball more etc. He has had far too much control over the offence under Fictner.
     
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  8. S.T.D

    S.T.D Well-Known Member

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    So .....He hasn't been good at all in the last 5 years?
     
  9. DukeDukeDaDaDa

    DukeDukeDaDaDa Well-Known Member

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    Regular season good yeah, playoff good no.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. S.T.D

    S.T.D Well-Known Member

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    I hear you, but that could be said about all the QBs in the league outside of maybe 2.
     
  11. DukeDukeDaDaDa

    DukeDukeDaDaDa Well-Known Member

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    It does make you wonder who is really running the show here. Ben, Tomlin, AR2?
    For a coach who's been around for as long as he has to not pay attention to that glaring stat. Isn't he an analytics guy? Maybe there are times that he's wanted to bench Ben but wasn't allowed to.
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 1
  12. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    He’s be insulted? They shouldn’t have to ask him. If he’s really interested in coming back for one more shot at a championship then help them to be able to surround you with the talent to do it.
     
  13. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    He did the same under haley. If you remember Ben was calling things from the prior year from BA at the end of year 1. Then he and Haley had to sit down in the off season and change Haley playbook to what Ben liked to run. He changed the verbage as well. I don't see this going well with canada offense.:cool:
     
  14. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    Yeah. Doubt he sees it that way. These guys have incredible egos. Ben probably believed that he is still a top QB and deserves top of the market money. Steelers can cut him if they like, a lot of other teams probably would. If he didn’t have the success he had early in his career it would be a no brainer.
     
  15. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    I still give this thing a small percentage chance that it falls apart and they part ways. Art is stressing it’s not about Bens ability but about finances and said if there is a deadline it is March 17th, have to be in compliance. That’s hardly a ringing endorsement for getting a deal done.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    Not good enough.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  17. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    That’s fine when you are an elite QB that can win games on your own like Ben was at that stage, he isn’t that guy any more. I hope Rooney made it clear to him that if he is coming back things have to change, he will have to meet the team and Matt Canada halfway and buy in to a new way of doing things. If he starts going rogue again, they should not be afraid to bench him. The Giants did it to Eli
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  18. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    Maybe. I don’t think the money side in insurmountable. They can figure that out easily. It’s pretty straightforward to kick the can down the road on that front.

    What they cannot do is roll out the same offence that we saw down the stretch last year again in 2021. If Ben is going to stand in the way of meaningful change he should retire.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. Steel Hog

    Steel Hog Well-Known Member

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    The indicator that I look for is a contract or signed agreement. Not words and no guessing it.
     
  20. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Exactly so if if it drags out then it’s because they want him to take a pay cut which Ben isn’t going to want to do.
     
  21. The Sodfather

    The Sodfather Well-Known Member

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    Used to adding to 16. :shrug:

    Anyway, looking at this thing in a somewhat cold hearted, business way, the Steelers owe Ben nothing. He's made over $250 million dollars playing for them. From that perspective, why should they waste a year of rebuilding if they really don't believe they can put together a legitimate championship team? No matter what, this deferred money is going to come do within the next 3-4 years. Cut the cord and start getting it paid down. It's not going to prevent me from tuning in to watch every week. I'm a lifer as a Steeler fan. I just see bringing him back as a waste of time and money. Maybe they prove me wrong.
     
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    • Agree Agree x 1
  22. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't hold my breath for that to happen. Rooney is bens biggest fan. :cool:
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  23. Jujubean

    Jujubean Well-Known Member

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    Ben should have retired and went out on a somewhat high note. He's going to get hurt this year because he moves like a three toed sloth and it will be sad to watch him go out that way.
     
  24. Wardismvp

    Wardismvp Well-Known Member

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    Has anybody heard what figure Steelers are going to pay Ben? I had stated in a previous thread that 10 million
    for next year would be too much. So if the Steelers owe Ben 41 million dollars for his previous contract
    can we legally/ CBA league rules, Tear up his contract and the Steelers and Ben agree that 27 million will be enough.
    for me and the Steelers, so we have a three year contract valued at 27 million, steelers are not liable for third year. Can we do this
    and what dead money do steelers owe, how does it effect Steelers cap charges for 2021?
     
  25. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    His $41m charge for 2021 is made up of a $15m roster bonus due in March and $4m in salary that he will be paid on a per game basis. This is the only part of the $41m charge that they can manipulate or change.

    The other $22m is a cap charge on bonuses that he has already been paid from when he signed the contract, and a restructure last year. That money is locked in and will be on the cap sheet no matter what, even if they extend him, cut him or he retires.

    Technically there is nothing stopping them releasing him and re-signing him on a cheaper deal, but I dont see why Ben would agree to that, and given his profile it would be a very unpopular move among other players and the NFLPA, it may be seen as setting a precedent.

    The most likely move is a multi year extension, where most of the $19m mentioned above gets converted to a signing bonus and spread over 3-4 years on the cap sheet. That would get his 2021 cap charge down to about $28m. The rest would be charged in whatever year he retires.

    He will probably still be on the cap sheet two years after he retires, presumably after next season, all so he can play another season with the team going nowhere. That is the part most people are not crazy about.
     
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