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Keith Butler

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Chinchilla, Dec 10, 2021.

  1. Chinchilla

    Chinchilla Well-Known Member

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    I know there are injuries to key positions in 2021 and I do not want to make this a drama post but I a think he may be on the hot seat where he will be asked to retire if the defense continues with its struggles.

    We can argue forever about who is calling the plays and how much control or lack of control that the coaches have but he has his work cut out for him in my opinion.

    I searched everywhere to try to determine how much say he has in the draft personnel, the week to week defensive plan against the team that week....the actual play calling....and it does look like he is more than a puppet but of course I dont know this 100%.

    When Coach Lebeau retired it was agreed that he would be the DC because I think Seattle was looking at him. Maybe like the same agreement Tomlin had in that he would inherit coach Lebeaus 3-4 scheme.

    Anyone agree or disagree? I like stability vs turnover but I think the defense regressed and metrics do not always capture this accurately in football yet.
     
  2. Steelrules

    Steelrules Well-Known Member

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    For the first time ever last night, I heard that Butler huddled with his defense when they were being shredded by the Vikes. Didn’t see it, but the announcers stated it. This guy seems so clueless with what’s going on. It’s like he doesn’t know what to do until he gets in the locker room at half time and search Google for a solution
     
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  3. DukeDukeDaDaDa

    DukeDukeDaDaDa Well-Known Member

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    I hated when they gave Butler the DC job all those years back because it just continued the flawed schemes of Dick Lebeau. I know many like to genuflect at the Lebeau altar but sorry folks his defenses have been figured out. This team needed fresh ideas on defense back then but instead it became, well Keith has been with the organization so long and he was promised this job eventually...screw that! Is this a football team or a fraternity? It's just more wishy washy nonsense that continues to this day. Bring in new blood!
     
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  4. Da Stellars

    Da Stellars Well-Known Member

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    Is John Mitchell still coaching defensive line at all?

    That dude used to light a fire under their A$$es.
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2021
    • Informative Informative x 1
  5. MadtownDruankard

    MadtownDruankard Well-Known Member

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    flawed schemes? Lol. Plenty of teams use the 3-4 base defense. DL’s flawed schemes have been copied by many great defenses . Our issue is not scheme its personnel. The NT play has been a disaster. Add that with terrible ILB play and a secondary that doesn’t like tackling you get what we see.
     
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  6. KnoxVegasSteel

    KnoxVegasSteel Well-Known Member

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    Maybe they just like Dick :shrug:
     
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  7. DukeDukeDaDaDa

    DukeDukeDaDaDa Well-Known Member

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    No he's gone
     
  8. DukeDukeDaDaDa

    DukeDukeDaDaDa Well-Known Member

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    If what you're saying were true then Tom Brady and other good and average quarterbacks wouldn't be able to carve us up at will. This has been a problem going back to the Lebeau days even when we had good players on the defensive side of the ball. I can't stand the guy but even TB has given us constructive criticism saying our D is too predictable and been that way for some time. When I said scheme I didn't simply mean 3-4 vs 4-3. It's not just personnel. Many teams get more out of the defenses with less than what we have when healthy. The Steelers need to stop pumping a dry well.
     
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  9. Coolhandluke23

    Coolhandluke23 Well-Known Member

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    Butler stinks.
     
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  10. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    I'm pretty sure he's talking about the large cushions the dbs used to give receivers to prevent them from giving up the big plays. I remember it almost as if it was yesterday. People used to complain about it all the time including myself. It was kind of a bend dont break mentality. Once the field shrunk there became far less options for the offenses. That might have actually worked last night if they had been consistent with it. May have prevented Sutton from getting beat deep.
     
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  11. Chinchilla

    Chinchilla Well-Known Member

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    I maybe getting the staff confused but when the system was fresh for lack of a better term I remember the fire X blitz, etc getting to Carson Palmer early and often where in the 4th quarter that blitz was not getting there and Carson was still caving when the pocket was not even collapsing.

    On the flip side...I watched Colt McCoy let a blitz come to him from the left side and he and the WR on that same left side connected because there was that ridiculous cushion that was there that the CB would leave by design.
     
  12. Chinchilla

    Chinchilla Well-Known Member

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    I remember there was one time the Steelers played man and actually won but I remember how undisciplined the OLB and safety play was where TB would pump fake and McDaniel would even call flea flickers because they so much Artie and Mitchell would bite on peeking in the backfield or double moves etc.

    Even against Blake Bortles ...play action to a FB that baited everyone but Fournette gets alot of credit there with his big day.
     
  13. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    he's the assistant head coach.:cool:
     
  14. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
    :cool:
     
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  15. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    :cool:
     
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  16. Wardismvp

    Wardismvp Well-Known Member

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    If Steelers do not fire MT, which they won't Don't stop at Butler, OL, strength coach, LB coach
    and all coaches should be evaluated. A big change needs to happen.
     
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  17. Cranny

    Cranny Well-Known Member

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    Butler is DC only in name. Tomlin is in full control of defense and he has even said as much. Tomlin needs to go and get all new coaching staff
     
  18. Chainmover1

    Chainmover1 Well-Known Member

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    yep! he is/was the best dline coach forever in the nfl.

    John Mitchell
    ASSISTANT HEAD COACH
    John Mitchell, the longest-tenured member of the Steelers’ coaching staff, will enter his 28th season with the franchise in 2021 having served as the team’s defensive line coach from 1994-2006, before being named assistant head coach/defensive line (2007-17). He was promoted to assistant head coach in 2018.

    As assistant head coach, Mitchell oversees staff development among the coaching staff, works with current and former players in career development, and assists Head Coach Mike Tomlin in community-related events.
     
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  19. Clive From PIT

    Clive From PIT I don't often drink...but I'm starting to. Site Admin

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    Did that Dick make them look fat?
     
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  20. DukeDukeDaDaDa

    DukeDukeDaDaDa Well-Known Member

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    Still? I thought he retired. The DL coach is Karl Dunbar so kinda confusing what Mitchell does other than assistant head coach being an honorary title.
     
  21. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    he's probably quite helpful. most head coaches have so many things to do besides just coach on the field during games and practice. not having to do all the outside stuff should give MT time for on field stuff. maybe it does and maybe he just isn't that good at it. :shrug::cool:
     
  22. DukeDukeDaDaDa

    DukeDukeDaDaDa Well-Known Member

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    It's just odd that you never see him on the field or at the games at any capacity. Unless he just never ends up on camera.
     
  23. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    might be in the booth. canada is in the booth during the games. :shrug::cool:
     
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  24. Steel Hog

    Steel Hog Well-Known Member

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    But shouldn't you change the scheme if you don't have the horses to pull the cart? Only way to go is up, so why not? JMO>
     
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  25. steelersrule6

    steelersrule6 Well-Known Member

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    You can blame Butler all you want, but they're lacking the talent on defense this season, some games the defense looks like a preseason squad.
     
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