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Missed Tackles: Fact and Fiction

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Blast Furnace, Aug 25, 2018.

  1. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Tackles shmackles.....at the end of the game I want more points than the opposition :hehehe:
     
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  2. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    I can agree with that :lolol:
     
  3. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    I just don't think you can quantify missed tackles and their effect on the game. You can be the best in the league in not missing tackles but what if you're team just gives up a ton of huge plays without a missed tackle being part of it. I think our scheme and our communication issues plays a major part of having guys not in good position to make tackles. Too many 1 on 1 situations will lead to poor tackling. Like I said eye test and in our last two playoff opportunities I've felt like gouging mine out...
     
  4. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    They won 7 or the 9 games that they tackled poorly in, why can't that quantify its importance or lack thereof? One of those games was the 18 missed tackle performance against Chicago and I agree, that many missed tackles will affect the outcome but on average, they miss 9 tackles a game. It's poor but I just don't see it making a huge impact and their win loss record attests to that. Obviously if you're missing tackles in the redzone and goes for a TD, thats a big deal but I'm guessing that didn't happen a lot.
     
  5. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    I'm not arguing for or against I just say that it's hard to say whether they that have a impact or not. I think your stats if I remember correctly showed NE and Phil. being about average and they went to the SB. Like I said whatever is causing the missed tackles IMO is scheme and communication related. Which is a much bigger deal than the missed tackles themselves. Maybe we're saying the same thing....I'm so confused :smiley1:
    You can miss 20 tackles in a game but make the one on 4th down that wins you the game. I'm not 100% certain on the cause and effect but from what I've seen when it really counts is a defense that's not good enough....yet.

    Edit: Actually I do think they were among some of the worst in RZ defense,thought I remember seeing that. Not sure it was because of missed tackles or missed assignments and execution.
     
  6. TheTerribleOwl

    TheTerribleOwl Well-Known Member

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    Right. If they are gang tackling I don't mind a few missed tackles, especially if it comes from trying to rip the ball out. I'm not trying to defend the tackling as it was bad, but it'd be interesting to know more context. Btw, thanks for sharing the info.
     
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  7. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    Aren’t as bad as people are saying and you get we’re similar to the 85 Bears?
    Straw man!
     
  8. TheTerribleOwl

    TheTerribleOwl Well-Known Member

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    I'd say that's putting it extremely gently. The defense we saw at the end of the year was garbage. If I had to pick I'd say guys running around wide open was a bigger issue than bad tackling, but I certainly haven't studied the film.
     
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  9. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    You're welcome. Here's a further individual breakdown inspired by you. Burns and Davis logged significantly more snaps then the rest. Burns isn't missing tackles. Davis is tied for most with Shazier, 19 misses. Vince led the team in tackles but Shazier was right there and missed half the season. Losing Shaizer was huge, obviously.

    Snaps-tackels-missed tackles

    Cam: 835-27-3

    Hilton: 592-41-14

    Shazier: 671-71-19

    Tuitt: 627-24-5

    McCullers: 13-1-0

    Hargrave: 478-21-5

    Golden: 214-14-3

    Burns: 1028-48-5

    Watt: 809-35-13

    Haden: 673-22-6

    Alualu: 451-20-2

    Mitchel: 738-45-9

    Matakevich: 61-8-1

    Harrison: 40-1-1

    Williams: 785-77-9

    Gay: 271-18-5

    Sensabaugh: 242-15-1

    Chickillo: 272-8-5

    Dupree: 850-32-8

    Moats: 84-4-1

    Sutton: 113-4-2

    Fort: 90-3-3

    Walton:171-9-0

    Davis: 1010-83-19

    Wilcox: 132-8-5

    Spence: 218-15-5
     
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    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Missed tackles suck:Fact.

    Our tackling was acceptable for what we should expect from the Steelers : Fiction
     
  11. TheTerribleOwl

    TheTerribleOwl Well-Known Member

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    Wow, the Hilton missed tackles really surprised me. I did not notice him missing tackles that often. Great stuff. Thanks again.
     
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  12. strummerfan

    strummerfan Well-Known Member

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    I turned on the Falcons game last night. Within 30 seconds the color man was talking about the falcons defense and missed tackles.
     
  13. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Is that what you took from my post? Or are you just adding to it?

    I wouldn't say it's acceptable but it's not the damaging force its being made out to be either.

    Kind of reminds me of CUSHIONS!
     
  14. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Still not sure. I do say that using the eye test as a barometer it can definitely be better and we are used to it being better and we should expect improvement.
     
  15. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    :applaud:


    Well done Blast! Most impressive.


    Even to this day, a good contingent of NFL fans still do not realize the impact of Article 46. Essentially, I would call Article 46 the "Fantasy Football Explosion" clause.


    Rodger Goodell wanted to artificially increase the install base of viewership of the sport. To that end, as half of the old statement of Bear Bryant:


    "Offense sells tickets."



    What better way to increase viewership than to organically adpot this philosophy than to limit the defensive capabilities? Furthermore, what better way to increase viewership than to not only improve the selling aspect of the product but already having a foundation that one can organically market but artificially exploit the product itself?



    Simple on both questions. The first is market the heck out of Fantasy Football. Even those who are new to football will likely get into the game via leagues for beginners of the game itself. The second? Strip the "boring" aspect of the game by "worrying" about a very controverisal settlement against the NFL.



    In conclusion Blast? Welcome to the NFL, where offenses truly do sell tickets and defenses are merely an extension.
     
  16. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    Something is off if Davis had 1010 and burns had 1028 snaps. The team had 940 on defense. Davis led the team in tackles not Vince. The missed tackles may not have led directly to losses but two losses and several games where we had to kick a FG to win it at the end doesn't show in the stats. We had leads and lost them or the game became much closer than it should have been. Thank goodness we had a good offense to overcome some of those misses. Either way it's way too many keeping other teams in the game when they shouldn't have been. It's also concerning about leading the league in the big plays given up category that goes into allowing teams to hang around when it should have been over. :cool:
     
  17. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Ah, thanks Mac, over looked Davis' lead in tackles.

    As for snaps, got it from PFF. I double checked, both their snap counts are what I posted. And team count is 1043. A quick look shows at least two other teams have fewer defensive snaps. I bet there are more. Doesn't really make sense that a “bad defense” would have the least amount of defensive snaps. They'd have more, not less.

    Bottom line on cause and effect, Mac, it didn't stop us from winning 13 games, didn't cause us to lose the Jaxs playoff game (only 3 missed tackles) didnt stop the Eagles from winning the SB.

    It did probably cause us to lose home field advantage with the loss to Chicago but missing 18 tackles was particularly bad, even for them.

    They don't tackle poorly every game, they just need to be consistent. When they are on, like in those 8 other games, they are among the best tackling teams.

    I'm not advocating they don't improve, it's just further down on the list of concerns, IMO. Stopping the run and not allowing big plays are much more important to the success of this team.
     
  18. groutbrook

    groutbrook

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    Those 2 things are directly related to miss tackles a lot of the time. It all needs to be cleaned up. I still saw some confusion between the LB's/DB's in the Titans game, as well as receivers running and catching with no one on defense near them.
     
  19. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    That's where I got the numbers too. First down thru third was 940. Forth down count put us at your count. STs was included in those. That's where the difference is.:cool:
     
  20. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Thats the same for all teams.

    Edit* Actually, thats not true, Mac. I got that from their defensive summary, its not going to include ST snaps. That number is total defensive snaps.
     
  21. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Miscommunication is directly related, I don't believe tackling is. Most of the big plays I remember had no one near making a tackle. Pass plays were breakdowns in the secondary and runs were people not filling their gaps.
     
  22. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Yes...too many plays where all 11 guys " missed" tackles
     
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  23. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Can't make tackles when you were never in position to make one!
     
  24. groutbrook

    groutbrook

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    True, but I remember more than one missed tackle on 3rd down that extended the drive and lead to a score instead of a punt, which is directly related. It's all bad. Hopefully it gets better.
     
  25. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    Look up 2017 team defense on PFF site. 940 plays.
    Still seeing 940 on the PFF site my friend. What are you looking at? I'm looking at 2017 team defense.:cool:
     

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