Slow Down the Hype Train?

Bettis was an old man. Hines was only good for a short time, then he couldn't get open against me in man coverage. Ben buying time to complete all those passes to Hines is the only reason he has a chance to someday get into the Hall of Fame. He played with Plaxico for one season. Randle El was just a guy. He was an average player. Ben played with Green as his center as a rookie. He practicly ended Ben's career.

Everybody talks about all these legendary players Ben played with as if they carried him. If Ben wasn't there to help this team win a $hitload of games, half of these guys would never be as highly thought of as they are today.

Ben Roethlisberger made everyone around him better. Mason Rudolph does not. He's the guy that needs everyone else's help to succeed. Rudolph is just a guy. That's it.

I like the guy. He's a decent backup and spot starter....but that's it. He is not a quarterback that becomes the reason the team wins games. He is just a cog in the machine and will never be an elite quarterback. The team shouldn't be looking for a guy that is serviceable. That's not what this team needs. It needs a quarterback that can play at a very high level.

You have no idea about the mental makeup of these quarterbacks. They literally just got their first NFL action of their careers. Time will reveal the rest.

 

So do we approve of the hype train's velocity now?

 

Bubby could throw the ball a mile

In random directions

 

We are talking when Ben started. Hines was in his prime then, Bettis may have been old but he always converted third and short and that's how he was used. (remember him running over Chicago's LB). For most of his football life Ben had Maurkice Pouncey at Center who is a serious candidate for hall of fame. Among his skill receivers Ben, in addition to Hines, over the years Ben had pretty good group with Plaxico, Emmanuel Sanders, Mike Wallace, Alien, AB, along with decent RB like LeVeon. His O-line was very decent as he had Faneca till 2011. When he was winning and had Cowher's coaches, he also had a great defense which didn't let opposition convert 3rd and long on a regular basis. The team had arguably the best safety that ever played the game. You mention Green almost got Ben killed. Rudolph also had him too and others that had him knocked out in his first year of starting. Rudolph had Juju, Diontae and James Washington, and Juju was hurt when Mason was having bad games. Diontae and Washington were never better than third receivers on any other team.

Yes Ben had talent and was probably always top 6-7 qb when he played. Yet after 2010 he got exposed by good teams during playoffs (when he got there), because he relied a bit too much on buying time with his legs and successfully playing sandlot football rather than someone like Brady, or even Manning, who relied on reading defenses. Ben had a strong arm, was accurate while running around, but his greatest gift was that he could buy time with his moving around and convert 3rd down where most qb's would be unsuccessful. It was also his downfall in playoffs later in his career because teams could contain him and he never developed elite skill in reading defenses. There is no way Rudolph can be another Ben, but I think he can be another Neil O'Donnell, or Bubby Brister till we wait for next Ben. I don't think he's any worse than any qb's that would be available and affordable in free agency. I think he will get to play under McCarthy this season and will do OK. If not, get a free agent or draft a qb. McCarthy probably feels the same way and from what I have read, he is a fan of Rudolph.

Among the young QB's, I can guess about the mental make up from their college career and their body language. I watch Michigan games and I have seen both new QB play terrible against Michigan. Howard bounced back which tells me his mental state compared to Allar. Of course, time will tell, but it's my opinion. I could be wrong just as most draft prognosticators are wrong. However, I have a good track record in these things...I predicted that Pickett and JJ McCarthy would be busts on these boards even before their nfl career began. Time will tell.

 

some on here don't need a pre-season and they skip OTAs. They're so polished and on point, they're ready to complain for complaints sake. Hey, I am one of the complainers, I am not self-unaware, but my complaints the past 6 months have been mostly about the prior coaching staff and all that was left on the table for the past 10-12 years. Sad, really sad.

Right now, we're in a place where Rodgers or mostly bust, which is a very risky place.

One key I'd like to point out about "slow down the hype train" and those that "hated the McCarthy hire". He was hired, I have to believe, to help mold the next franchise QB, whether that is on the roster NOW, a pick in the 2027 draft or a trade to be made. IF McCarthy sets up the Steelers with a WELL trained franchise QB, then the hire will have been a home run, even if this year or next is more Tomlin-like than hopeful and exuberant. Hey, I have gotten used to being mediocre and then totally sucking in January. I can't even remember the last playoff win that was impressive.

I wanted a young gun OC or DC hired as HC too, and wasn't fond of hiring bloated and aging McCarthy, but once my head cooled, I have become a fan. There are three reasons for optimism: One, young OC/DC hires as HC tend to flame out more often than they succeed. Two, Tomlin is mercifully gone, so that alone was a win, even if you hired a scarecrow as HC in his place. Three, McCarthy has an offensive mind which we desperately needed and is a known QB improver/polisher (Tomin was neither and couldn't hire anyone after Haley that was competent).

So I am now quite happy with McCarthy hire. Like many, I am nervous as to whether or not we have a franchise QB in the making. Odds are against Allar becoming that, but he has the right coaching to get there. If not, we're hoping Kahn chooses correctly with trade/draft decisions to acquire the likely franchise QB in 2027.

 

You're the one talking about Rudolph and somehow comparing him to Big Ben. They're not even in the same league.

If you don't think Ben was a very good quarterback, that's fine. It's funny you say he got exposed after 2010. It is after that last Super Bowl appearance when he started putting up his best numbers and threw for 5000 yards a couple times.

No quarterback throws for 5000 yards if they can't read defenses. It is something that is brought up all the time that makes zero sense. This talk of Big Ben not being able to read defenses is so ridiculous that I get sick of talking about it. You, and apparently others here seem to think that the connection with Antonio Brown just happened or that AB was so good that he made it easy for Ben. Ben and AB had to be on the same page all the time. They both needed to read the defense and make whatever adjustments had to be made based on that defense. The idea that Ben HAD to run around is a joke. The only way all of that happens with AB is if his quarterback knows exactly what to call, what signal to give to AB, and where exactly to go with the ball at exactly the right time based on reading the defense.

Many people watch football, but they don't really know what they're watching. They have no clue what's really going on.

You watching Michigan football games doesn't give you any special insight into Howard or Allar. It takes watching many of their games against all kinds of opponents, understanding what their skillsets are, the talent they played with, the coaches they played under, the offenses they played in, the physical abilities they have, and then trying to determine how much more growth is possible to reach their potential ceiling.

I don't know how good Howard and Allar are going to be. Leading up to last year's draft, my quarterback draft order was Ward, Dart, and Tyler Shough as the top three quarterbacks and the only quarterbacks that I would have drafted early...and gave my reasons why. I had Sanders lower and said he was not what he was being hyped up to be based on his limited physical talent and mental makeup. I rated Howard as a 4-5 round guy but said he had some attributes that give him a chance to be good, but that he lacked any elite physical traits. That was at another message board.

Leading up to this draft, I told everyone here that Allar was a guy to take a chance on, particularly if he dropped in the draft because he has elite physical gifts. That doesn't mean that Allar is going to turn into a special franchise quarterback. It just gives him a chance if everything clicks for him and he has the mental acuity to match his physical talent.

I just bristle when people talk about Mason Rudolph and even whisper Ben Roethlisberger's name in a comparison. And if you think Rudolph's absolute ceiling can be a Neil O'Donnell or Bubby Brister, why do you even want to try to get there. He's 31 years old. If they keep him, the only role he should have is as a backup and mentor while they try to find the next quarterback. That's my opinion.

 

You forgot that Tomlin hired lousy coordinators which in my opinion seemed purposeful. Can’t have anyone outshine the boss.

 

I said Ben had better cast around him when he started. There is absolutely no denying that. Ben won two SB and that's elite company. But his strength was his strong arm and athleticism. You won't find too many pundits considering Ben a cerebral qb like Tom Brady, Peyton, or even Steve Young. He was never known to spend hours in film room etc.

You must have a reading comprehension problem. I never said he couldn't read defense. I said it was not his strength. I said he was exposed against good playoff teams after 2010 . His stats after 2010 in playoff is 3-7 with 17 td 12 interception . His career playoff qb rating is 86. That's kind of average. Yes he had tremendous chemistry with AB. They had plays that were unstoppable. He was a franchise qb. All qb's have strength and weaknesses. Brady and Manning weren't great athletes and their strength was mind. Ben was a lot more athletic and didn't have to rely on mental aspect as the other two. Ben also had a very competitive streak and he wants to win at everything. His never wanting to lose pulled the team up. I don't think Rudolph has that.

I combine my watching with what they have done. I could be wrong but it's an opinion and I have a good track record. I am not saying anything revolutionary, just that Allar is more physically talented and Howard seems to have a hunger to win. He won the national championship. He got those first down no matter what it took. Allar has not showed me that grit.

If you bristle, that's your problem. When Rudolph replaced Rothlisberger in 2019 is Seattle game, he was actually more efficient. The argument about Rudolph is that he is probably the best option we will have in free agency. I am pretty sure McCarthy is not going to next season with just Allar and/or Howard. There are no franchise qb's available in free agency and the mediocre ones will drain your bank. I think he will get a chance to play this year and if he does well and plays significant amount of games, he will probably be somewhere else next year. Someone will overpay. If he does average, he will probably be back, backing up Allar. If he ****s the bed, then bye bye.

 

Oh, you are one of the Rudolph worshipers. Got it.

Saying reading defenses wasn't his strength is saying he wasn't good at reading defenses. Don't try to sugarcoat it. Maybe someday Rudolph can use all that studying and efficiency to throw for 3000 yards in a season.....

Rudolph was better than Ben in one game in Seattle when Ben blew out his elbow. There you go. Comparing Rudolph with Ben based on one game to try to prove your point. Why don't you mention that when Rudolph got a chance to start, he couldn't keep Duck Hodges off the field? Never mind, I already know.

You keep shining that bright light on Mason Rudolph though. Someday, maybe he will get to show the football world what you know they've been missing.

 

Three types of yinzer Steeler fans: