My takeaways from Allar interviews, his receptiveness to coaching and his play in mini camp.

And I asked you what exactly are the hard questions?! You don't give me answers. Why not? List them.

The NFL cares as they give the players these tests. That should be enough for you to see its value. But I have the feeling you don't.

I have noted that the QB's who score poorly do not make a good pro's unless they are exceptional athletes that land on good teams with good coaching.

There is no such study that I am aware of that you asking for , but you can look at the data and judge for yourself. But you don't have access to the data in general so...

If you do, you will find I am correct. Here let me give you some data.

Any QB who scores below 18 is likely to be poor, unless he is a special athlete like Lamar Jackson. This has generally been the case since 2000. My observation.

The super winning QBs in all cases since 2000 scored a 20 or higher.

Do you think it is an accident? Come on, man


Look at the track record since 2000. Super Bowl-winning and consistently elite QBs almost all scored 20+:

• Eli Manning: 39
• Matt Stafford: 38
• Aaron Rodgers: 35
• Tom Brady: 33
• Russell Wilson / Drew Brees / Peyton Manning: 28
• Joe Flacco: 27
• Ben Roethlisberger: 25
• Patrick Mahomes: 24
• Brett Favre: 22

QBs scoring below 18 are rarely successful pros unless they're exceptional athletes in great situations (Lamar Jackson at 13 is the prime example — elite runner who landed on a good team with good coaching.

The data shows high football IQ gives you a real edge in this league.

Now, this is a Drew Allar thread! PM me or create a wonderlic thread if you wish to continue.


Pittsburgh Steelers quarterback Drew Allar scored a 22 ( don't ask for the link ) on his Wonderlic test. This is okay. Lucky for him he has special arm, good size, and landed on the right team with a good offensive mined head coach.

PS: On a personal note, I took the wonderlic test once, not for the NFL but for a job which sceneed people for aptitude in the company. I scored and " upper green " level which was a 38 . The bar I had to clear was a 32. No -- I am not a genius, but I do think most people who wet to a 4 college and graduated should be able to pull at least a 22.

 

Still waiting on the studies you were referencing before.

Just last page you said:

Now you say

Why did you say there were studies (plural) supporting your idea when you don't know of any that exist?

There is at least the one study I found which answers this exact question. I referenced it above. It says the exact opposite of your argument.

Then you say

This is my favorite part of your post Joel.

Neither of us has the data. Because the data is private. There are posted numbers, which may or may not be correct in each case.

One of us is arguing for the "null hypothesis" (that the Wonderlic doesn't matter). The other argues that it's a good tool for evaluating NFL players (QBs in particular?).

But...the good thing for us is that someone did have that real data. Raw from the source. Do you know who that was?

The people who wrote the paper I referenced earlier.

You know what they found?

That the test doesn't help.

I'm happy for you that you scored reasonable well on the test.

My guess is that you would be a horrible NFL QB (just like all of us).

 

Two or more members on this board got perfect or near perfect scores

 

I did it again. I wrote out this long post, and decided to erase it. LoL

 

I anticipate this post being well received and the goal posts moving

 

Are you going to edit my quotes then attempt to reply like you did before? Such is a cowardly way of debate. And please leave my family out of your replies. Such talk is beneath this forum. I take it you got a warning from the mods.

 

Joel

Why do you make attention seeking posts and then whine when you get attention

It’s hard to know what you want

 

I've watched way more interviews and breakdowns on this than most people. Look, since 2000, every Super Bowl-winning quarterback has scored 22 or higher on the Wonderlic. Trent Dilfer hit exactly 22. Since then, the lowest are guys like Ben Roethlisberger at 25 and Patrick Mahomes at 24. High 20s and 30s have been more than enough.With all the low-scoring QBs (especially 17 and below) drafted and given real chances since 2000, you'd think at least one would have won a Super Bowl by now.
But none have.

I'm not saying everyone sucks at drafting QBs. Clearly some teams and coaches are good at it — and those tend to have bright head coaches.In general, give me a Big Ten or SEC QB with real NFL physical tools over a Harvard or MIT grad any day, even if the smart guy drops a 48 on the Wonderlic. Their athleticism usually just isn't there.The radio speaker in the helmet has made playing quarterback easier these days. Without it, the guys who struggle reading defenses would look even worse.I don't think you need above a 22 to win a Super Bowl, but I believe the ones scoring 17 and below since 2000 never will. The high 20s and 30s are smart enough. Crystal clear now?

 

Basically, this comment is saying that most QBs who won SBs have Wonderlic scores that are about average. Just like most people. I believe that IQ tests tend to be normally distributed...so we'd expect ~ 68% of people to be withing 1 standard deviation.

My guess is also that the sample of 15 people (I think that's right, you can double check) you're talking about isn't going to have the "statistical power" that you seem to think it has.

Again, people who have studied this show that there is not statistical link between Wonderlic score and success.

You keep trying to talk about anecdotes.

And even your anecdotes appear to be: most SB winning QBs have Wonderlic scores around the average scores of QBs.

Which is likely saying the same thing as "the Wonderlic score doesn't really matter".

Which is what people who studied whether Wonderlic scores mattered concluded.

I'm still wondering why you said there were studies that showed this link when you didn't know of any.

 

QB1

 

I never said that you said Allar was going to be the best ever. You said “one of the best ever”

and you also know the old board went belly up so there is no way link to it which makes you look guilty. Its like demanding a dead man testify to prove you said something. You know its not possible.

You’ve already made like 3 or 4 Allar post too which makes you look like someone who would say it.

and yes, its true, I haven’t been impressed with Big Ten QB play the last 20 years outside of OSU Quarterbacks who have struggled in the pro’s. I also know Brees and Brady played in the Big Ten 30 years ago.

 

QB4 at the moment

 

I failed kindergarten
Wasn’t me
Started life a failure
Gonna end it a failure
At least I am consistent

 

I got sent home from kindergarten one day for doing a science experiment

I stuck an entire roll of paper in the toilet and kept flushing it until it overflowed went out the door and cascade down the steps

I was analyzing the fluid mechanics and flow

I was 4

 

Why are you getting spanked by the mods

Me, I have honest thoughtful conversations about the Steelers with the mods because they present their thoughts well and are honest

Most posters are

 

I clearly showed 26 years of data. In the modern NFL, there is a minimum Wonderlic score needed to win a Super Bowl — the lowest being 22, with the range going up to 39.This is based on 150+ quarterbacks drafted since 2000 — not just 15. That’s a very solid sample size. Zero percent (0.0%) of those 150+ QBs scored below 22 and went on to win a Super Bowl. That demonstrates a definite correlation.Scores above 40 are very rare in the NFL. I’m not sure why this is so hard to understand.

In my opinion, quarterbacks who score 17 or below are simply not suited to be championship-winning QBs in today’s NFL. I’ve also heard that some teams are uncomfortable drafting a QB with a score under 20 (though you won’t find an official link for that). Only others who say that. The NFL is very careful not to use terms like “mental IQ test” and keeps the actual scores private. They don’t officially release them — the numbers we see come from leaks by other sources. Got it?

You’d probably score very well on the Wonderlic yourself. That said, it’s clear this topic is sensitive for you. You keep demanding official NFL-reported data, even though everyone knows the full results aren’t publicly released — they only exist through leaks. I don’t have every single score, but I do have the leaked ones that are available, and I accept them for what they are. You seem determined to dismiss or shun them.I even suggested we move this discussion to private messages, but it looks like you ignored that offer. Feel free to reply if you must. I’ll let you have the last word, but I ask that you quote me in full context before you do. Let the football facts rule — not a proverbial axe.

 

If you only knew what the PMs said to me. You’ve now been called out as a liar with proof. Another poster showed exactly what you said in those private messages — and you slinked away without a response. Happy now?

 

Good morning Joel

You are not correct and since it appears he who PM’d you is either misquoting or lying to you he also is not correct. Plus if it’s who I suspect it is he has a history of being whiney changing the goal post never admitting to being wrong and is reading challenged. I recommend you think for yourself and get a more reliable source of information.

Do a little homework

Said poster recently proved every word I said was true and it was he who either lied or misspoke. I can prove it but have no need to lower myself to his and your level. Apparently he lied to you. Anyway don’t you think his PMs are kind of creepy? So you don’t need to PM me anymore either. As you noticed I ‘m not real inclined to respond. I’m not wasting any more time on fools unless I get some personal satisfaction from it.

And why are you trying to pick a fight about something you know nothing of and are not involved in? You have your own issues with honesty and integrity to improve on. Enough time has been wasted here so I will move along.

Stick to posting honest and accurate things about the Steelers and avoid attention seeking look at me posts and everyone Including myself will forgive you.

And yes I am a quit happy person. I’m honest honorable have great friends and live well. Life is good.

Thank you for asking.

Go Steelers

 

I NEVER said he was going to be one of the best ever. You either lie or have a bad memory.

The link to that site works fine. SHOW ME WHERE I SAID THAT! You won't. I remember you from that board. I won't shame you in this thread , but when you "forget" or say something that I did not say I will call you out. Okay?

By the way, in addition to Brady and Brees , the Big Ten produced Russell Wilson. And we currently have two Qb's from the Big 10 on the roster. The recent play of the QB's has been good. You are wrong to say it hasn't.

 

I'm not demanding NFL reported data. It doesn't exist. Because it's confidential.

I was asking you to provide links to the studies (plural) you said proved your point. But then you said that you don't think there are any (still not clear why you weren't truthful about this).

Then I did show you the only study I found. And it said the exact opposite of what you said.

Your example of the 15 QBs (again...I'm not sure this was correct) who won SBs since 2020 is that most of them were within one standard deviation of the mean. Which is what we'd expect for any random sample of 15 QBs. Because the sample is too small.

I'm also not "sensitive" about this topic. I just don't it when people lie / randomly make **** up to try to win an argument on the internet. It's probably something that I should let go of more easily...

 

Trust me bro!!!

 

They do the same as anyone. It's a job.

 

as a young man what did you do after work and on the weekends? if i was single i went looking for the fairer sex more often than not. do you think they are as motivated to do that? a bus driver doesn't go home and say hey family, let's go for a bus ride.

 

Maybe they just lie in bed and read a book to finally relax
Or
They play clue
Or
Monopoly
Sex is awesome
But
Too much of a good thing isn’t so good
I used to
Beat the bishop
Flog the log
3 times a day when I was younger
As Green Day would say
Masterbation has lost it’s thrill