The case for/against Najee Harris...

My fault.. poor use of the word 'intangibles'. I was referring to both his physical gifts and others less tied to them, most notably his ball skills. Johnson is definitely the better route-runner.

 

So let me make sure I understand your points.

You are done and will have no more comments on this.

My intelligence is comparable to a fish, or at least a fish that is trying to learn algebra.

A player who had 4 pass attempts their entire career is comparable to comparing a RB who had 149 carries with one that had 255 carries.

It's unfair to compare players stats unless they are given the same number of chances.

There are a lot of different things that can happen in 106 additional carries. Good things? Bad things? Scary things? We just don't know.

Najee can carry the load for the entire season and doesn't fumble often.

We have no clue if Warren can carry the load, even though he has 226 carries for the Steelers.

All of this is interesting, but I'm still having difficulty with why one of these guys averages 5.3 ypc and the other averages 4.1 ypc. I guess I need to study more Algebra.

 

I love Najee as a player and person. Even when he was drafted I wanted Oline instead, but was ok with it because he is a stand up dude.

The reality of the position is harsh. I'd love to keep him around but don't want to pay him what he wants/deserves.

It makes sense to move on and let someone else overpay for him. I'd talk to Warren about an extended contract and draft a RB next year in rounds 2-4.

Either way Najee is a Steeler this year and I look forward to seeing him light it up behind this revamped Oline. I would be very happy if they could work out a contract that makes sense but I think the market will be too much.

If that's the case I'm rooting for Najee to get paid elsewhere. He will have a better year behind a better oline.

I think a lot of his dancing had to do with trying to do too much behind a busted oline not trusting his blockers.

 

that’s not all luck with Frazier. A good FM knows a players value and where they should be drafted and they have a good read on the other teams knowing when to jump up and stay put.

 

Yes, you are clearly having difficulties with his argument. I'm not going to comment on the fish thing, but you are definitely off on a few points.

The Bettis thing was an extreme example he used to try to illustrate to you that it is easier to keep a better ratio with fewer attempts. It sailed right over your head.

You also don't seem to understand that 226 carries spread over two seasons is nothing like 255 in one in terms of wear and tear on a running back.

The other part of Harris not fumbling often is that Warren fumbles more. One thing he left out was the second Baltimore game. Apparently, you missed that one or you would realize Warren has difficulty holding on to the ball in bad weather. Do you not see how that would be a problem>

 

No one has given a compelling reason why there is such a massive difference in the yards per carry. We aren't talking a couple tenths here because of less carries. I think Warren had the second highest average for a RB in the entire league. Najee has had 3 years to show what he is. He is durable, good ball security but lacks the speed to make explosive plays and has a very average to below average ypc. I think the Steelers can do better and I think not picking up his option shows they think they can do better too.

 

Compelling reason- on third and one, or less than one, it's Najee in there with 10 men in the box. on the two yd line, it's Najee in there with 9 men in the box. When teams are able to be in a run-centric defense, it's Najee.

 

Your first statement is false. Two compelling reasons have been given. Teams play tendencies. The Steelers tend to run more with Harris in the game and pass more with Warren. That makes it easier for Warren. Also, many backs see their average per carry decline as they move from a secondary/third-down role like Warren's to a lead back like Harris. Pollard's 2023 season in Dallas is a recent example.

 

But that gets you 0.2 to 0.3 of the difference. I think the bigger issue is Najees lack of explosive plays.

 

Those are compelling reasons why their would be a difference, I agree. But I don't agree that makes a difference of over a yard per carry. I believe the bigger issue is Najee just doesn't get big chunks of yardage because he isn't quick enough to allude the pursuit. That's why he averages around 4 yards a carry, and probably always will. Good guy, durable, good ball security but lacks big plays. Maybe I'm wrong and this year with a better O line and new OC he will be more explosive. I would certainly be happy about it. I just don't think it'll happen.

 

There is more to being a lead back than explosive plays. Harris is more likely to break off a 25-yard run, his long last season, than go the distance from 70-plus, but there is a lot more to being a lead back than that. He has proven he can carry that workload. Warren has not. He has proven he can protect the ball. Warren has not. He has proven he can handle bad weather. Warren has not. He is also better at picking up the blitz.

Y'all keep mentioning ball security as if it is a small thing. It isn't. It is huge.

 

The algebra, and fish part was rude, and should have been left out, but the rest.....Yes....apparently You are having a problem with. 106 carries in one season is a big difference. You are basing the 226 off of two years.....Najee has 527 carries in that exact same time. If You honestly think You can equally compare two rbs that have 306 carries different in the same amount of time. Yes.....I'm wasting my time. If anyone does anything 306 times more than anyone....yes the averages will be unfair.

 

We don't know exactly what Warren would do if he was suddenly asked to carry the ball 100 or 150 more times in a season, but we have seen what it does to other backs. Tony Pollard is the most recent example. He went from 193 carries in 2022 to 252 in 2023. He ended up with two fewer yards rushing because his average per carry dropped from 5.2 to 4.0.

 

seeing a headline that he might be headed to Dallas. I will say 'told you so' if he gets traded, Wizard of Khan is a wheeler and dealer.

Najee for Cee Dee Lamb??!! kidding.....that ain't happening.

but maybe for something we need, they have CB's, etc....

 

Sorry. Just had to find a thread where no one is complaining that Tyler Boyd signed somewhere else.

 

It may be part of the same issue, but there are two sides to that argument happening on other threads.

 

Good point, and I see it going that way with Warren too, along with the inevitable increase in fumbles. Say what you will about Harris, lack of explosive plays, ect, but the guy doesn't fumble. That's huge in my book