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Who would you want backing up Ben?

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Stone, Jan 20, 2020.

  1. Move up/trade to get a stud to replace or learn under him for 1 -2 years?

    5 vote(s)
    11.9%
  2. Move up/trade to get a solid veteran backup?

    9 vote(s)
    21.4%
  3. Stick with our illustrious threesome we currently have backing him up?

    28 vote(s)
    66.7%
  1. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    Just a reminder I was one of the biggest Mason fans, heck I even thought at one point we could send Ben packing and Mason step in. My problem with Mason is this, he has no pocket awareness. Can that be taught IDK but what has made Ben great over the years? his ability to keep the play alive, people want to blame the oline for how bad they were last year but what they are missing is the fact that they were the same but Ben couldn't be tackled. This is why I like Mariota so much and a few other QB's that might be undrafted or very late round picks like Mcdonald or Montez. If we get a pocket passer no matter who Marsha included they are chopped liver with the oline we have. JMO

    All of this is for nothing and is JMO because Mason is gonna back up Ben and we have to hope having a QB coach will help him out if Ben goes down. :smiley1:
     
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  2. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    We will find out and man I am hoping you are right cause I don't want to see a repete of last year. :thumbs_up:
     
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  3. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    While it would be nice to have a more mobile QB that’s not what teams typically do . They try to have the backup be similar to the starter so there is continuity should the starter go down. They’re not going to develop 2 different offenses to suit each QBs strength. So having a mobile QB backing up a pocket passer is counterproductive especially when the backup QB is essentially a emergency plan for a few games. Offenses need to be designed around mobile QBs. IMO not having a QB coach was more detrimental to MRs development than people realize. In Canada I trust....
     
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  4. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    There were a couple other factors affecting the performance of the OL besides not having Ben. There was also no AB,Conner being injured,JUjU injured ,receivers dropping passes and Pouncey and Foster having bad years. So they weren’t the same offense or OL Ben played behind.
     
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  5. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    DD was on a gimpy leg as well. He has had his surgery and hopefully makes a full recovery. This went extremely under the radar. Our interior OL was not what it once was. this is a huge story that will be very telling this coming year. Especially if finney goes elsewhere. :cool:
     
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  6. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    Back to the original question, who would I want backing up Ben?

    How about a competent OC! That may not help Ben a lot but it would sure help whoever steps in if Ben goes down! Shame on our organization for not seeing this!
     
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  7. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    Who hires an OC to help the backup over the franchise qb? Especially going into the season not even knowing who the backup would be. Then also coming off a season where your qb threw for more yardage then anyone. They also upped the red zone efficiency that season. :cool:
     
  8. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    An intelligent NFL organization!

    Based on that logic, why even have back up QB's?:smiley1:

    We saw exactly why last year.
     
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  9. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    Really stone? Make the offense fit your backup? I just don't know what to say to that statement. :cool:
     
  10. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    Really mac daddyo? You think Futchner designed an offense to fit someone?.....anyone? You think the exceptional offense the Steelers had in 2018 was because of Futchner?

    Seriously?

    We all know that Futchner is here because Ben runs the offense and he wanted an OC who didn't challenge him. The Steelers should have hired a real OC who could actually contribute, whether it be to Ben or whoever filled in for him.
     
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  11. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    I’m no fan of Fichtner but look at how Ben pouted about Haley. Were we really going to be able to bring in a OC that would challenge Ben and not face the passive aggressive threat about retiring. Fichtner is here because of Ben whether you like to admit it or not. So what was the option?
     
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  12. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    I believe that Haley is a bad example in this case because Haley was a cancer everywhere he went. I think there are good OC's out there who Ben could work with who could also contribute rather than simply be Ben's yes man.
     
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  13. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Haley may have been a cancer but he was good for Ben’s career. Whisenhunt is another example of Ben not wanting to be told what to do or reeled in. He loved BA and he loves Fichtner for the same reason....It’s not as easy as you think to be able to find someone who is a good OC and also has to give Ben whatever he wants. Most OCs have their own way of doing things and how they envision their plan being run.

    Edit: old dog new tricks scenario at this point
     
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  14. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    Fichtners, offense brought Memphis to the forefront on the national stage during his time there. It also fixed our red zone efficiency and let our qb throw for over 5000 yards and we ran the ball well after losing the top running back even. The only time it didn't do well was when our 2nd year qb and udfa qb had to play and losing the top wr in the game. That 2nd year qb, that had never played an NFL game, was 5-3. The udfa was 3-3. You can be mad and blame everyone, but it's really not as bad as you make it out to be the way things went down last year. :cool:
     
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  15. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    I can't disagree with that but I also think most people see Brady as the GOAT and I think most people also see Josh McDaniels as a good/great OC. I'll bet they both work together because the organization says they will.

    I guess my point is that our organization cow-towing to players is coming back to bite us.....and may get worse. Given Ben's penchant for the limelight, bringing Haley in was throwing gas on a fire.
     
  16. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    These are all valid points. I just see it a bit different....I see a solid collection of talent and leadership carrying us through last year as opposed to it being our OC. I think his play calling, which is the only real tangible, was exposed when Ben went down.
     
  17. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    I don’t know but I think TB and JM actually get along. You also have to include cow-towing to Ben as part of the problem as well. Ben had it out for Haley since day1 before they even met face to face with his “Rosetta Stone” comment. If we’re going to hold other players to a higher standard of professionalism then Ben set a bad example right off the bat. The thing is I recognize Ben’s greatness but at the same time I don’t overlook all the areas he could have easily done better. Both his positives and negatives have affected our successes and failures. Which is fine, nobody is perfect but at the same time they shouldn’t be ignored.
     
  18. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    without any true stars to carry the offense last year, and the play of our interior line which should have been our strength but wasn't, you get an offensive showing like that. It actually did better then it should have with all the injuries. :cool:
     
  19. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    I am not familiar with the "Rosetta Stone" comment but would love to know?

    I think Ben had issues with the idea of a guy who had problems, including physical altercations with players, like Haley coming in to the mix and I can't blame him for that; I hated it before they ever met as well because of Haley's explosive manner. A blind man could see that relationship was going to be a disaster.

    And again, our organization's handling of our stars has been deplorable! From kissing Ben's ass to allowing AB to be an unchecked cancer, our management has made an ugly bed for all to lay in.
     
  20. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    I think Ben had issues with whom ever was going to replace his buddy BA. You may have hated the hire but there is no denying he helped Ben. You shouldn’t really judge someone you never met based on someone else’s interactions with them. Ben never really gave it a chance and took every opportunity along the way to throw Haley under the bus.
     
  21. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    Fair enough. I'm not exonerating Ben, we all know his tendencies. As far as Haley, he had a long track record of mal-content before coming here so it's not like I judged him on hear-say. I think we are on the same page but I can't help but repeat that the way "The Steelers" have handled our star talent has been horrendous and that was the basic context of my post #156
     
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  22. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    That is not what I am saying, I am not talking about 2 different styles. I am saying while Ben is a pocket passer he extends plays cause nobody can tackle him. MM is no LJ he is not run first pass 2nd. People think he is a run first guy but he really isn't. Mason on the other hand won't move his feet and that is my biggest concern about him. Like I said this oline has had issues for years but Ben has covered it up due to his ability to break the first tackle. :smiley1:
     
  23. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    I do agree with all this however like I just said even with all them guys Ben has been one of if not the most hit QB in the league. When Haley came here he helped change that but Ben still got hit a ton just not sacked.
     
  24. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    Mac I understand what you are saying however while these guys put together a 5-3 and a 3-3 record they did not play good. Mason had a nice game vs the Bungals right 24-28 229yds and 2 td's 124.6 rating. After that it all went downhill take the first game out that was Ben's game but we went over 200 yds passing only 2 other time this season. The record don't show the real story we struggled with Duck and MR for a lot of reason. Injuries is right there as a reason however so is Fitch, people are asking where the TE's were well after awhile you would think the OC would recognize the fact that our QB's are not using them and help these guys get the ball to them.

    I am not putting the whole thing of Fitch but the truth is the truth. Ben calls the plays and changes the plays. No Ben and Fitch was clueless when we needed him the most with 2 young QB's one who got his brains scrammbled. There are lots of blame to go around injuries, no AB, no Munch, a death to our WR coach(which is bigger than most think) and no QB coach. Fitch did nothing to help these young QB's out and that is what scares me for next year if Ben goes down again. :smiley1:
     
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  25. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    I don't care who is playing QB, if you never throw the ball downfield, the defense will cheat up on you and make your QB look bad. This was the story of the season last year and that's on Futchner.
     
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