Who here is buying Dupree?

I agree with a lot of what you are saying and I know VW is one of the players you can't stand but you keep talking about him being a starter if we cut Barron. I just want to point out in the 14 games VW played last season he started 8 of them. Barron did play a lot more 69% of snap counts to VW's 36%. We need to make sure whoever picks up them 69% can play the pass......I want it to be Edmunds with us getting another safety. jmo

 

Well said

 

How do you like dem apples?

 

Hey I like that Edmunds idea . We play some 3 safety looks anyway. All you’re asking is to allow TE to play closer to the line of scrimmage. People are getting too wrapped up in the LB terminology. He will still essentially be a Safety just with more of his responsibility coming around the LOS. Finding another ball hawk like Minkah to pair with him makes our secondary downright scary. It would allow us to move Minkah around like a chess piece without the fear of having your last line of defense a glaring weakness. That’s why I have Safety as one of my top 5 needs.....

I also like the potential of UG3 to cover for a few of the snaps we lose with cutting Barron....

 

I'd hope it's Barron but if not UG3. Or draft Patrick queen in the 3rd. I wouldn't move Edmonds yet. Year 3 is usually the year the true player arrives. Let our two coaches which will be in year 3 and 2 in this defense have at him with a full camp. I would draft a guy like fuller from Ohio state as a 3rd safety. Arnette from Ohio state as a cb. That team was that good on the backend. We could reload for years to come. They may be there in rds. 3-4. Would be ideal if they went for jenkins at olb. Could be very doable.

 

I am pretty sure it was you and AQL who talked about this a month or two ago. The way i remember it wasn't this the reason we drafted TE to be that hybrid type guy?

 

I am open to this, I would rather another safety but I could handle this. Keep an eye on the Weaver kid from Cal he is a tackling machine if we go ILB.

 

Actually, it really hasn't been okay at all. In spite of Conner, the Steelers were near the bottom of the league in rushing in 2018. The offense had all sorts of trouble at running back this past season. Losing Bell may have been unavoidable and I don't think anybody here thinks the Steelers should have given in to his ridiculous contract demands, but his departure absolutely hurt the team.

 

Actually, my opinions are more valid than yours because I back mine up with facts and you tend to prefer offering what you think with no support at all.

Getting Tuitt back is more likely to replace lost production by Hargrave's departure. I don't think anybody expects the Steelers to keep him and Dupree.

Last season's statistics are an indicator of what is to come. That isn't a guarantee, but it adds likelihood to an opinion.

The difference between you and I is that I actually use facts to support my opinion and you reject facts simply because they work against yours.

I have experience and facts. You have experience only. That is why I win.

 

Hey Formerscribe.

I tried to tell folks here on the Board, and outside of the Board, that the departure of Bell (as well as Brown) was going to be immense. It was going to be way more detrimental than people realized. Conner had one good year and many folks were "see I told you". Now look what we have with Conner. An undependable, constantly hurt, middle of the pack at best RB. Conner is no where near in the same class as Bell.

Teams had to special game plan for Bell. His rushing productivity plus his receiving skills (80+ catches/year) whether out of the backfield, or lining up wide, gave opposing defenses a whole lot to think/worry about. The man had HOF capabilities and probably would have reached that club had he played his whole career with us.

Yeah, Bell was a pain in the rear. No where near what Brown put the organization through however. I still think something could have been worked out with Bell. Shoot, I am holding out hope that he returns to us. There are small grumbling rumors out there that the Jets do not want him. Plus, I knew he was not going to be anywhere near as productive with the Jets as he was with us. We are the perfect "marriage" with Bell. We need one another to be successful and fulfill our potentials. Our O-Line was the perfect fit for him. One does not need to be a rocket scientist to have figured that out.

The same piece that I just wrote above about the Bell/Conner scenario can all be applied to the Brown/JuJu one as well. So many people thought that JuJu was going to seamlessly replace Brown based on his great year with Brown and him lining up together. I tried to tell people all that I said about Bell above, that the same was going to apply with the Brown/JuJu scenario. Once again, I am not a 'I told You So" person. Just a man who looks at things rationally. Not basing things off of a distaste for Brown and Bell as some fans have for the both of them. I look at things for what they are factually; not based on emotion.

However, this is where the fork in the road comes for me regarding Brown and Bell. Where I would take Bell back, I would like to have Brown back too but I have my limitations. Brown has evolved into something some of us probably never would have imagined. A real mystery. Unlike Bell, Brown has burned every bridge possible to ever wear the Black and Gold again. The man needs real help. Like I stated earlier, Bell is a pain to some degree but Brown I cannot even put into words. I will leave that up to a professional in the field of mental health.


STEELWINDS AKA The East Side Kid

 

Ok I will bite....Conner 12 games starter 973yds with a 4.5 avg he did pretty good.......yes the team was 31 out of 32 but not because of Conner. Which was my point not the Steelers rushing attack so let stay on subject. Conner played well when we all thought Bell was well.......irreplaceable. A FA can come in here and put up the same numbers as Bus but end up with a different result in the standings.......not his fault. Guys come and good all the time Bud had 1 out of 5 good years let's stop acting like he is some special player that can't be replaced.

 

Conner missed time in 2018 with injuries, then has his 2019 season pretty much ruined by them. Bell had some durability issues in his career, but he's Jim Brown and Walter Payton rolled into one compared to Conner.

I'm not blaming Conner for the decline in the running game since Bell left, but it has absolutely declined significantly and that wasn't just an issue in 2019.

 

Once again we were talking how Conner did in replacing Bell in 2018......NOT 2019. Conner did miss time and still put up good numbers, oh and not to mention all while Ben was throwing league leading and career best numbers. If passing numbers go up what do you think is going to happen to the rushing numbers? FYI Steelers were 4th in total yds and 2nd in passing. Like I did say this conversation is not about Conner it is about Bud and a replacement which you don't feel we can find(and that is your opinion) however many of us here do think we can find......our opinion!

 

The Steelers were 2nd to last in attempts in 2018 that’s a big reason for their ranking. The problem wasn’t Conner as your stats clearly show. Yes Conner missed time but while he was able to play he was producing much like Bell . Who I was a big fan of. Sorry but in the beginning Conner was making us forget about Bell. Injuries sidelined him and lack of overall attempts as a team played a role as well. So I don’t know how anyone can say we suffered without Bell? We suffered because of injury/attempts.

Decline in 2019? I’d have to look at the attempts there. Conner again missed significant time. The OL played terribly and the overall poor play by the QBs had a impact as well. I don’t think many RBs in the league would of fared well under those circumstances. Look at Bell last year with the Jets. A players production isn’t guaranteed much in the way we are talking with Dupree...

 

Bell got to rest a year.

 

Yes sir I agree and Bells numbers last year.......well they weren't even close to what they were his last year here. Players are affected by what is around them and that is why guys like you, me and a few others feel like a FA coming here will be helped by having Watt, Heyward, a healthy Tuitt and an improved secondary. Take Golden for example he played with the Giants and had a nice season 10 sacks, 72 tackles, 13 TFL and 27 QB hits. All while playing for a defense ranked at the bottom, I feel he would shine here and will cost half the price or close to it. There are so many players like this out there this year which is why I would not spend on Bud......jmo

 

I maybe out of line, but I think the Steelers usually allow
their players to explore the FA market. If I understand the CBA we are allowed to
match the offers they get or place the Franchise tag on Bud which is about 16 mill
I don't think the Steelers will match a ridiculous offer or put the tag on Bud
So I see our first pick in this draft will be an OLB.

 

in both cases, the evidence fits my opinion better than it fits yours.

 

Not anymore. Someone (not me) thought they could use the Bell departure to support the idea of moving on from Dupree. Now that is part of the conversation.

 

Wait...if Goldens stats are correct wouldn’t it mean he would do even better here because we have a better defense. Statistics don’t lie remember....I mean Duprees numbers are guaranteed.no? That would mean Goldens numbers would be better..That’s the logic I’m hearing around here.

 

whatever.......

 

IDK some of the stuff I am hearing from around here is giving me a headache.......

 

Pretty sure Brown and/or Payton would have rushed for more yards than Bell last season.

If Bell is/was as good as you claim, why didn't he rush for more yards?

I'm eager to see what "facts" you have to support your claim.

Wait. This is off topic. Don't respond to this. Suffice it to say that you are wrong...again.

Back to Bud talk...

 

Keep whacking away at that stew man or let me know when you want to have an honest discussion. You can’t do both.

Nobody ever said that Dupree's statistics are guaranteed, so why would Golden's? That is what I meant by a straw man. You didn't attack my argument. You attacked an argument you made up, hoping it would sound similar enough to my argument to hold up.

The logic is that experience and opinion supported by statistical data is better than experience and opinion that flies in the face of statistical data. I hope the clarification helps you going forward.

You are also assuming Markus Golden will come at a reasonable rate. He has reached double-digit sacks twice in the NFL. His 2017 season was ruined by a torn ACL and he missed time in 2018 before landing with the Giants. Why are the Giants going to let him go? They have a lot more cap room than the Steelers.

Also, you are comparing them looking at sack numbers. What about pressures? What kind of run defender is Golden? Can he play outside in a 3-4? Have you ever even seen him play?