1. Hi Guest, Registrations are now open. See you on the inside.
    Dismiss Notice

What would you change in our Defense?

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by steelers5859, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. steelers5859

    steelers5859 Well-Known Member

    2,835
    50
    Oct 23, 2011
    Either personnel or scheme.

    I for one would try Brett Kiesel at ROLB. Chris Carter is not strong enough to hold the edge. That would put Heyward at end with Hood and McClendon/Hampton at nose.

    What do you think?
     
  2. steelers5859

    steelers5859 Well-Known Member

    2,835
    50
    Oct 23, 2011
    I wanted to add this article i read on the trib. If you don't want to read the entire article, pay close attention to last sentence at the bottom and what Stokley was quoted as saying about the Steelers defense. Thought it was interesting.

    One learns in life it isn’t all that bright to argue with 285-pound, thickly bearded, mountain-bred defensive ends. So I happily accept Brett Keisel’s word when he spoke the following late Sunday night in Denver: “We feel like we’re a better defense than that.”

    He’s correct, of course.

    It just might be that, by the time the Steelers march off Heinz Field this weekend, they’ll have mauled Mark Sanchez and the Jets, and the opening 31-19 loss will be as distant a memory as Rex Ryan’s former waistline.

    It just might be, as Keisel added, “a matter of rectifying a few things.”

    But let’s first rectify one description of the defense that shouldn’t be in the discussion.

    OLD and SLOW.

    It started with Warren Sapp’s jab a year ago, and it’s carried all the way into the predictable outcry this week. Someone on the Web or a talk show brings up the defense, and it’s a matter of seconds before it pops up anew.

    OLD and SLOW.

    It’s lazy analysis, to be kind, especially as it relates to Sunday.

    Let me ask this: Who was the Steelers’ best player?

    Answer: It was, by an almost shameful margin, 32-year-old Larry Foote. He had eight tackles, a sack, two hurries of Peyton Manning, a forced fumble, a pass defended, and probably helped little old ladies cross the street outside the stadium.

    Fellow inside linebacker Lawrence Timmons?

    Five tackles and ... well, he did make it onto the active roster.

    Timmons is 26, and he’s YOUNG and FAST, though you wouldn’t know the latter from how easily the surgically rebuilt Manning sprinted away from him on that late scramble.

    The linemen and outside backers totaled only five hurries on Manning. But again, that had little to do with OLD or SLOW.

    Tomlin rotated his linemen liberally, giving extensive time to Cam Heyward, 23, and Steve McLendon, 26, in part to combat the thin air. And of the outside backers, LaMarr Woodley, 27, had no sacks or hurries, and Chris Carter, 23, who’s VERY YOUNG and VERY FAST, was buried all night by Denver tight end Joel Dreessen.

    The biggest factor, actually, was that Manning was brilliant in picking up blitzes and quick in moving the ball. But that would have been the case if the Steelers had gone with ALL ROOKIES who could ALL RUN LIKE USAIN BOLT.

    Which takes us to the secondary, maybe the most maligned with that OLD and SLOW label.

    Manning’s most frequent victim was Keenan Lewis, 26, who allowed Eric Decker seven catches. It was no way to make anyone forget William Gay, 27, whose offseason exit via free agency always should have raised more red flags than it did.

    That was a case of OLD being better than NEW.

    Ryan Mundy, 27, filled the spot of Ryan Clark, 32, for the game.

    Ike Taylor, 32, was torched again by Demaryius Thomas, but he shuts down pretty much everyone else, YOUNG or OLD.

    And Troy Polamalu?

    Well, let’s face it: When people talk OLD and SLOW, aren’t they really talking about Troy?

    Sorry, I’m not there yet.

    Sure, Polamalu isn’t hitting the highlights anymore. You’ve seen a lot more Clark Kent than Superman for a couple years now, especially when hurt. Tomlin revealed Tuesday that Polamalu has a strained calf.

    Still, look at his big gaffe in Denver -- he went underneath a block that led to Thomas’ 71-yard touchdown -- and it was mental. An OLD player is better equipped to make that play, even if he’s now SLOWER.

    “I should have made a better decision,” Polamalu said.

    Or he could have had help. Mundy got blown up, too. Maybe Clark wouldn’t have been. Never underestimate what Clark’s stability means to Polamalu.

    Look, I’m not going to sugarcoat this. The defense was lousy. Three 80-yard touchdown drives in a row is embarrassing.

    But let’s set aside the memes and consider real solutions Tomlin and Dick LeBeau should find for the Jets: If James Harrison isn’t ready, sit Carter for Jason Worilds, who put the only hard hit on Manning. Get help for Lewis, too, or drop him for Cortez Allen. And let’s see more of Heyward and McLendon.

    The coaches should look in the mirror, too.

    Manning outsmarts most opponents, but there had to be an extra sting in hearing Denver receiver Brandon Stokley say of the Steelers’ late defensive collapse: “I think they pretty much did the same thing all game.”

    Hey, maybe it’s the strategies and adjustments that are OLD and SLOW.


    Read more: http://triblive.com/sports/2573376-74/s ... z26FxpniNL
    Follow us: @triblive on Twitter | triblive on Facebook
     
  3. mrn6

    mrn6 Well-Known Member

    237
    4
    Nov 18, 2011
    great analysis....it is time for Coach Lebeau to step down after this season. Thank you so much for all the great things you have done for this organization.

    The most upsetting thing is not playing man to man like he employed against New England last year. I don't want to hear that we were trying to avoid the big throws. I will take my chances against an older QB with the deep passes.

    The defense HAS to get younger and faster..see SF 49ers

    I would even transition to a 4-3 if we have to. The problem defenses run nickel most of the time. We need help at Safety and Cornerbacks in the next years draft..

    I feel like I have been saying this for years
     
  4. shaner82

    shaner82 Well-Known Member

    9,932
    551
    Oct 16, 2011
    I would change the "bend but don't break" mentality that allows QB's to easily dink and dunk on us, all the way down the field. Why not step up and jam the odd receiver. Why not try to jump the route and pick off the odd ball. Why not actually cover someone rather than give them a 7 yard cushion.

    I would also switch to a 4-3. The personnel we have aren't doing our 3-4 justice.
     
  5. mrn6

    mrn6 Well-Known Member

    237
    4
    Nov 18, 2011
    Shaner82..you pretty much nailed my sentiments. I have to admit almost everyone of your posts on this message board makes sense
     
  6. FeartheBeard

    FeartheBeard Well-Known Member

    2,832
    303
    Oct 26, 2011
    :this!:
     
  7. lovembig

    lovembig Well-Known Member

    1,200
    4
    Oct 30, 2011
    to me the biggest problem this team has had over the last few season, and yes that includes their super bowl season where they lost to the Packers, is their inability or unwillingness to adjust.

    the NFL is more about matchups and exposing teams weaknesses than it is about talent. sure talent will win you some games, but exposing teams and finding the right matchups is the key to winning consistantly.

    the Steelers always seem to come out of the gate slow to start the game. by the second quarter they seem to find their stride and they usually look pretty good in the second quarter. then comes the half. the other team always seems to make little tweaks that the Steelers never have an answer for. thats why it always seems like they are holding on for dear life in the 4th quarter.

    they have the talent to win. sure they are getting a bit older and a bit slower, but with age comes experience and smarts. those are the things the coaches should use to their advantage, but they very seldom do.

    DL is one of the greatest defensive coaches of all time, but he has to be one of the worst in game coaches. when something isnt working he sticks with it. thats not a complement. when the other team exposes their weakness, he sticks with his plan. again, not a compliment.

    with the talent and experience this team has, they should be putting up 28 plus points a game and holding teams to less than 20. that doesnt mean i think they should go 19-0, but that does mean i think they can beat any team and should never be used like they were last sunday.

    i do like the idea of moving Kiesel to lb and putting one of those young lb up at DE. they have always relied on the front 3 getting some pressure and taking up blocks to free up the lbs. right now that isnt happening. sure Hampton takes up blocks, but he is almost a non threat at ever getting to the qb. Hood is not Aaron Smith yet and Haywood is still learnig. they need to mix some things up.

    the Jets showed they can score some points and that was against a defense that looked pretty good in the preseason when they played the Steeleres. they cannot let Sanchez sit back there and sling it. he has the ability to put up big numbers as he did last sunday. the Steelers need to figure out a way to get pressure on the qb. that doesnt mean they need to 10 sacks either. we have all seen what pressure does to qbs like Brady and Manning. if the Steelers were getting close to Manning and throwing of his timing they would have won that game. you cant let those guys sit back there and go through all their progressions. they will find the open wr. its amazing how pressure on the qb makes your secondary better. i could find an open wr if i had 8 seconds in the pocket to find one.
     
  8. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

    24,240
    3,365
    Oct 22, 2011
  9. Steeltradition83

    Steeltradition83 Well-Known Member

    343
    3
    Oct 21, 2011
    You hit the nail on the head with unwillingness to adjust. I feel the Steelers have been very stubborn the past couple season. The whole "red shirt rookies" seems to be a pretty good example. I feel like they get so caught up in maintaining the "Steeler Way" that sometimes reality is lost. The NFL changes everyday and eventually you have to start making your own adjustments.
     
  10. shaner82

    shaner82 Well-Known Member

    9,932
    551
    Oct 16, 2011
    Couldn't agree more. Tomlin seems like a very status quo type guy. Like starting Redman in week 1 instead of Dwyer. That was a huge mistake. Thankfully they got it right as the game went on, but I can't help but wonder if the only reason Redman was limited as the game went on was because of his injury, or if it really was because Dwyer looked better. The pre-season showed that Dwyer was clearly the better RB, and it wasn't even close. Dwyer should have started and should have got 85% of the carries. There's this stubbornness about the Steelers that I just can't understand.

    Tomlin has had a lot of success early in his career, but I wonder if that success is going to continue moving forward. He doesn't adjust, he doesn't seem to hold his coaches accountable, he doesn't seem to hold players accountable (although he sure talks the game) and he is beyond awful with clock management. There's no way a coach should allow his team to have a weak secondary and weak Oline for 5+ years. That is unacceptable. I don't care if we've been to two SB's, when there's a glaring weakness on your team, as a coach you do what is needed to fix that weakness. How many more years will Tomlin allow our weak Oline to negatively affect this team. Whatever the issue is, whether it's the players, the scheme, the coaching, or Ben hanging the Oline out to dry, Tomlin needs to fix it once and for all.
     
  11. Diamond

    Diamond Well-Known Member

    5,790
    469
    May 26, 2012
    Kiesel weighs in at 300 pounds, you think he would be agile enough to get back into coverage? Coverage is an intregal part of playing OLB, better leave Brett where he is, to ask him to lose 40 or 50 pounds right now is pretty tall order, ya think?????
     
  12. steelers5859

    steelers5859 Well-Known Member

    2,835
    50
    Oct 23, 2011
    I think he's athletic enough to take a few snaps at ROLB. Woodley looks to be about 300lbs so why not try another person. Because Chris Carter is an abortion.

    I wouldn't use him there permanently, but we need to find a solution because hoping James Harrison returns to form is wishful thinking.
     
  13. Jim90

    Jim90 Well-Known Member

    2,766
    254
    Oct 18, 2011
    Time for Lebeau to retire, and Ike going down to covering the #3 receiver, Lebeau is just throwing the same thing at the O-lines, our corners and db's are playing 900 yards away from the line of scrimmage, everybody knows whats coming all they have to do is clog up the center, then all of our guys just run into the backs of each other. I thought Lebeau was going to use more exotic blitzes,( as in preseason) but he's gone back to snoozeville . Until those 2 go I don't expect much from our D.
     
  14. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

    5,484
    334
    Oct 26, 2011
    Scheme and people....I think we need more DL in there at least 4 maybe even 5....A s far as the players go ,I would get Lewis off the field I think he is soft and a William Gay clone....As far as Mundy goes I don't think he does anything well enough to be on the field....Put Brown,Dyke heck put Charlie Batch back there,,,at least he could help the D recognize what the O is doing.....Mundy looks lost to me more often than not....
    Get the young speed guys on the field,,, send the heat with the DL and play more straight up Football.....I think we would be better served to do that...
     
  15. numbah58

    numbah58 Staff Member Mod Team

    1,857
    29
    Oct 16, 2011
    I'd like to see us move to a 4-3 cover 2 base defense next year..
    We have the players to do it. In fact, I think at this stage we're better suited for it than the 3-4.
    LDE- Keisel
    DT- Heyward
    DT- Hood
    RDE- Woodley
    WLB- Spence
    MLB- Harrison
    SLB- Timmons
    Yes, I think Harrison could be a good MLB and we could get pressure on the QB with the front four.
     
  16. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

    36,612
    6,286
    Oct 16, 2011
    Ugh, that part particularly stings. I'm already having enough doubts about DL, now I read opposing players voice their opinions of our ineptitude.
     
  17. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

    36,612
    6,286
    Oct 16, 2011
    I would think it would be a near guarntee that Tomlin will switch over to that once DL retires, Tomlin is a 4-3 cover 2 guy and he had a good defense doing it when he was a DC.
     
  18. steelers5859

    steelers5859 Well-Known Member

    2,835
    50
    Oct 23, 2011
    If we were switching to a 4-3 we would have drafted DEs for that scheme.

    Keisel is not a pass rusher. None of our defensive lineman know how to rush the passer.
     
  19. shaner82

    shaner82 Well-Known Member

    9,932
    551
    Oct 16, 2011
    Hood is a 4-3 DE.
     
  20. numbah58

    numbah58 Staff Member Mod Team

    1,857
    29
    Oct 16, 2011
    Brett Keisel is a prototype 4-3 LDE. LaMarr Woodley played RDE at Michigan. Ziggy Hood was considered one of the top 5 three technique DT's in his draft.
    I don't think there would be any problem switching to a 4 man front with our current roster.
     
  21. diehardsteel

    diehardsteel Well-Known Member

    1,067
    0
    Oct 19, 2011
    I've been wanting the 4-3 ever since Tomlin was hired. I thought for sure he would institute that change but apparently decided against it as the 3-4 was working well at the time. It would seem that may no longer be the case.
     
  22. Jack LHambert

    Jack LHambert

    496
    41
    Oct 18, 2011
    I said this a few days ago in another topic

    After some thought though, I'd probably put Polamalu at MLB and just let Mundy take his spot in the backfield for now. Polamalu is at the LOS most of the game anyways. Why not put him at MLB???
     
  23. HinesWardHOF

    HinesWardHOF Well-Known Member

    2,075
    0
    Oct 24, 2011
    I would change 3 things. the way LEWIS covers.. the way LEWIS tackles .. and the way LEWIS guarantees hes a pro bowler

    HINES
     
  24. fanfav

    fanfav Well-Known Member

    558
    80
    Jan 2, 2012
     
  25. Jack LHambert

    Jack LHambert

    496
    41
    Oct 18, 2011
    The greatest defense of all time was a 4/3 :steelflag:
     

Share This Page

Welcome to the ultimate resource for Steelers fans. Sign Up Here!