What positions are in play at pick #20?

I disagree. You need to be cognizant of how the rest of the league looks at players. You may view a guy as a first rounder but if everyone else sees him as a third rounder then you could get him in the second instead of the first.

 

and what happens when another team or teams is playing games with their assessments? Oh they don’t like this guy we can wait. Oh crap they snagged him right out from under us. How in the world did that happen?

do your homework and there’s no need to worry about Tom, Dick, or Jane.

 

We have been if you haven't noticed my friend. Now we have even added more to the wr room with the addition of boykin. Moore, cole, daniels, green, jack, witherspoon, sutton, wallace, bush, friermuth, DJ, claypool, trubisky, najee, gentry, okrafor, norwood, minkah, killebrew, maulet, pierre, layne, rudolph, snell, watt, highsmith, loudermilk, davis, wormley, adams, McFarland, haeg, johnson, Spillane, miller, sims, sternberger, rader, hassenauer, i. Johnson who played for the raiders in sub packages, the list could go on. Three of those guys haeg, jack and sutton are in their 7th year and the rest are 6 years or less. Those are prime years and a pretty young team. They have been adding more then some think. Add this draft and we don't have a bunch of positions that aren't covered.

 

we have a far better team and a young offense we have been building so this isn't a Lawrence situation. I hate teams that throw a rookie qb onto the field and expect him to turn a failed team around. We are not that. We have time for him to sit a year. Is there a draft pick at 20 that will put us over the top? Do we have a spot we need immediately upgraded and is there a player for that spot at pick 20?

 

Interesting comment here. Just curious as to what end would the Steelers gain from using input from other NFL Teams. The last time they did that; Ernie Stautner and Jack Butler were.. more or less what the Steelers were.

 

Teams try to figure out all the time what the interest level of other teams are on prospects. Thats why teams jump up or trade down in a draft if they think they can get the guy they are targeting is gonna be there. So if you go car shopping and the market lists a car at $30K but your grandpa had a car similar to the one you are looking at and it is way more valuable than 30K are you gonna pay the market value for the car or are you gonna offer them 40K because that is what it is worth to you? If Ridder is valued as a 3rd rounder by the rest of the league then why would you over pay for him in the first round. The draft in and of itself is a competition with 31 other teams. When and where you take players matters. Knowing how other teams think is valuable information in my mind when you are strategizing when you are going to take players.

 

We have a lot of holes to fill. If we draft wisely this year and use the salary cap effectively next year we should have a really good team next year. We need DT, CB, SS, MLB, OT, WR and possibly C. So I am fairly confident their will be a player at one of those positions that will be less of a reach this year than QB. We tried taking a project last year at Center and it filed miserably. I don’t want to see us do that in round one at QB.

 

I understand what your saying but 32 teams create a market for a player. I just don’t want to overspend in the market for a player. Seattle does that all of the time and it has really blown up on them the last few years. The raiders were known for that for a while as well.

 

Not all of those guys they added are necessarily upgrades. Im still not sold on Jack and Bush at MLB. I’m not sold on lulu and Tuitt coming back and just picking up where they left off. I am not sold on Sutton stopping the run or Witherspoon stopping the run. I am not sold on most of our O-line. There is still a ton of opportunity to upgrade this roster.

 

True statement... we will see if it works or not.

 

We absolutely don't need all those positions and especially in the first. Cb, wr, are deep in this draft and we don't need to use a first on one. We have an OT we just drafted last year. We just re-signed another one we drafted 4 years ago as well. We just picked up a vet wr. We signed a vet center. We just picked up a vet ilb. We need a SS but none are really pick 20 rated. Especially at SS. DT, not needed this year.

 

What were we ranked last year offensively both in the run and the pass? Didn’t we lose three WR’s to free agency this year? What was our run defense ranked last year? All three of our starting CB’s are number 2 CB’s at best. We don’t need but it would be nice to have a number 1 CB. Devin Bush is an uncertain at this point so if a Chenal is there in the second I would jump on him. Alualu is coming back from an injury and is old and we aren’t certain about Tuitt. In addition Tuitt tends to be injury prone so if a Davis is there at 20 and take Ridder over him I would be disappointed. Our tackles are middle of the road and if a better prospect is their in the draft that is always an option so in my mind we didn’t solid portions in free agency we just created competition thats all.

 

Again though, interesting statement. Pittsburgh had not cared about such a philosophy for over 50 years. If anything, Mike Tomlin alluded to performing a mock draft during his rookie season back in 2007 via the Pre Draft Conference in 2021; only to toss it after only performing only 4 rounds total out of seven. It is quite the waste of resources to worry about what other teams are doing for the Steelers. As for trading up, that is also, not subject to teams attempting to figure out what other teams need. That is based on what the Steelers need and if a team is willing to negotiate for them to acquire said player.


Now, to the point of the NFL Draft being a competition.. fair enough. I compare it to part of the arms race; Free Agency being the other.

 

OK.
I don't know how anyone believes ( Your opinion, and I respect You for it) that a player that has shown He has struggled in cold weather wouldn't be worse when having 2 play in it more than a couple a times a year, or How player that have played in cold, rainy, wind blowing, and sometimes snow wouldn't be better if they played 80% of their game inside....with no wind, cold, or any of that.
I can't see How You, or anyone can come 2 that connection.
There is a reason the only time Brees made it 2 the SB the NFC had 2 come through N.O.

 

You are right Pittsburgh has rarely cared how other teams value players. I m not saying it should be a driving force but I think there is value in understanding how other teams think just so they understand the general landscape of the market.

 

But how do you really know what the other team is thinking or how the true value on their boards. When you get in trouble is when you start to panic and over think the process. Ues you strategize and at times move up or down, but you do so for your purpose, that you want this guy because he likely won't be there based on your research and needs.

 

This..I gave no.idea how gms and owners communicate about players they may like..if at all, but I highly doubt even in the years the Rooney's and Maras were so close they shated draft board info.

 

I think the NFL is a pretty tight nit community and so many of the perssonell have worked with other teams or coaches throughout the years and just evaluating who players meet with at the combine and pro draft days and visits, etc, I believe they have pretty good idea what teams are looking at whom also each team understands other teams needs and draft patterns as well. We reLLY Vlued Revis the one year and the Jets I believe jumped in front of us to draft him and the CB Concinatti took like five years ago right in front of us. We panicked in that situation and were bound and determined to get a cb and we reached and drafted Artie Burns. The year we drafted Terrell Edmunds we were dead set on drafting a Safety and we reached because we liked his measurables. I am fearful we are doing the same thing this year at QB. I feel like we get so focused on a position some years we lose sight of better players at other positions that become available to us. If we are in love with Ridder at the very least I hope we trade back in the first round and at least pick up some draft capital.

 

The years we didn’t draft were need was when we drafted are best. We drafted Cam Heyward when we already had Aaron Smith and Brett Kiesel starting is one example. Big Ben is another example. Tommy Maddox was performing at a high level but the value was their with Ben and we took it. I just don’t want us to oforsake good value and take a QB for the sake of taking a QB this year.

 

Understanding how other teams believe and behave though would be quite counter productive in comparison to a team that has more success than any other since the merger. To win in the NFL, a team needs to understand what it does best, how often it can rely on using the best assets it has available, understanding what does not work and most of all, how to fix what does not. The more a team's weaknesses are magnified.. the more susceptible they are to failure. Yes, acquiring great talent is critical overall but scouting and developing said talent in that team's infrastructure is what separates good teams from great ones. For that matter, this is just a small fraction of what separates cornerstone franchises to NFL Teams that merely have that right based on the NFL's name and image only.


Remember that the NFL is a copycat's league by virtue of the league's own parity. It would be silly for me to assume that the Steelers do not follow some of the successful concepts of the league. However, unlike the likes of both L.A. teams, Cleveland and others, Pittsburgh only follows certain concepts that are an integral aspect of the natural evolution of the game itself; parity included. I personally would hope that the team that is greatly responsible for many of the modern NFL's rule changes is keeping up as the Steelers are still the best example of not just on how to build a Super Bowl winner but also what type of balance a team needs to have sustained excellence overall; the 1978 Steelers still being the blueprint for which all teams follow.



Now, as to why L.A. and other teams are going against the wayside of the grain is not one of "revolutionary brilliance" as much as the media makes it out to be. What is happening today is no different than what was during the 1950s and 1960s of the NFL's infancy; teams trading away picks for Superstar Level talent. Guess who was the pioneer of such a philosophy on team building? One Vince Lombardi. However, as many teams attempted to emulate the Packers.... many would end up failing. One of them was the Steelers. Chuck Noll onward? Entirely different story. Chuck Noll, Bill Nunn and Dan Rooney all had paved the way for how modern NFL Champions are born; using the draft to acquire the best overall talent while having what was UFDA's as key depth pieces to solidify the roster. It worked in the 70s and still does today; the Belichick led Patriots teams included (Ty Law, Vince Wilfork, Richard Seymour, Chandler Jones and Malcolm Butler people!!!). What everyone just witnessed within the past Super Bowl is nothing more than a one off instance of a team having just about everything go their way; as such the case with many. While most are impressed at what Les Snead and the Rams have accomplished... contrary to popular belief... Les Snead had and currently has no choice but to go all in or go home. Why? That answer can be summed up in two words; Los Angeles.



There is a plethora of activities and forms of escapism in Los Angeles to steer potential fans away from NFL Games. Remember that Los Angeles alone is one of the biggest metropolitan cities in the world and one of the most financially exceptional via GDP; 3rd Place being their most recent ranking. Furthermore, Los Angeles has known only one aspect for much of its existence; winning and having winners. The Los Angeles Rams' previous two Super Bowl trips before their win ended in a loss to New England and their loss to Pittsburgh at the Rose Bowl; a loss that would subsequently become one of a number of downfalls despite some success in the 80s. After 1994... the LA Rams would fade into memory and would not resurface until 2016. Other teams that are enacting this very same "All or nothing" policy are doing so based on what was seen with L.A. However, unlike the Rams.. there exists one major issue for both the likes of Cleveland and Denver; their own Conference and more so for Denver their own Division. Pittsburgh does have the current issue of finding their next one but are not going to do business at the cost of essentially a Super Bowl Rental.




In short? Understanding how the NFL's current structure, personnel based demands, talent acquisition, salary cap management and team building are critical aspects no doubt. However, how each team approaches this varies due to a myriad of factors. Luckily for the Steelers, they are trend chasers no more contrary to popular belief. Yes, the trades for both Devin Bush Jr. and Minkah Fitzpatrick are definitely against the grain of how the Steelers typically operate but said trades are of independent studies and not moves of desperation. If anything, the acquisition of Minkah was more than just the Steelers being the best team fit but one of historical significance; building not just an identity of themselves throughout the draft process but developing and cultivating relationships of players throughout; some of which have shown to be long standing. Minkah was another example of this; Jerome Bettis actually being the first.

 

Your logic supports my belief... the draft is valuable. The best franchises with long term sustainability are built through the draft. As a result we should most often take the best player available and not reach for a draft pick. When it comes to QB I don’t have a problem reaching in the draft at the right time or going after a proven veteran in free agency but this isn’t the time to do it. You waste the resource now if you do that until we plug the other holes. The other thing we are all failing to see here is are the Steelers capable of developing a QB. Tomlin has never had to develop one. We have no idea if he has strengths in that area or not. Speaking of trends with all of these small athletic defenses trying to match up with the spread offenses out their... I think it is time the Steelers reset an old trend and go back to smash mouth power football and take advantage of the smaller middle linebackers. Focus on controlling the clock with the offense and have an elite defense. That is my hope.

 

Regarding Tomlin never having had to develop one... Mason Rudolph. That did not work out so well. Dwayne Haskins was supposed to be another but sadly... none of us will ever know (my deepest condolences and best wishes to both his wife and family doubly so and no less). Trubisky does not count but Trubisky could revive his career here... not that I would bank on it. Now, as for your final statements.. this is what the Steelers have been doing since the beginning of this Offseason; rebuilding the Offense to tailor to the Running Game. Now, Trubisky is going to need to throw the football; his best work comes from out of structure. However, for Pittsburgh to remain competitive... not only will it have to fall on the shoulders of Najee Harris (someone who is getting way too much focus on in my opinion) but also Matt Canada (the forgotten one and most influential one in all of this). This is now officially his Offense.



Time to see what he can really do. Adding some weapons will be key as Johnson, Claypool and presumably Boykin (should all go well for him) are not enough. Freiermuth and Harris will no doubt be better but it is also worth noting that the team could still use a 3rd WR option. Me personally and, going to be quite controversial I am sure.. George Pickens. Sounds odd I know given the fact that he just came off an ACL Injury and is mainly an outside receiver. That said, given the fact that Claypool can be better suited for that role and, will likely be doing so anyway, Pickens can add another dimension to this Offense for not just Mitch but also Najee as well.



Again... Pickens being a Top 20 Player does sound silly. However, remember that this is the very same Pickens that took the SEC by Storm in 2019 and would have done so again in 2020 if not for that injury. It is a fairly high risk deal but the reward could yield a much bigger payout than the risk.

 

Its not as simple as "dome good weather, outside always bad weather"

1. Its overstated since so few games are actually played in bad weather. 30 degrees means nothing unless its gale force wind or raining. Its maybe 2 really bad weather games a year for most teams, maybe 3 for Buffalo and New England. Its mostly just in playoff games, and really only a handful of teams are affected.

2. It only affected Brees "more" because his whole offense had to change in inclement weather. He had a 10 year stretch (2007-2016) where every season he played in all 16 games he threw over 650 passes in the season. That's like 41 attempts a game. They were built to play that way and not built to run the ball, control the clock, and win the game 20-17. It doesn't take a great football mind to see how his teams could find a way to struggle in inclement weather more than other teams.

3. Ben, Rodgers, Brady all played super well in bad weather. There weren't enough horrible weather games to bring them down. Ben was just as likely to throw for 500 yards on a 30 degree Pittsburgh day in December as he was in a dome in New Orleans. Actually all of his 500 yard games were outdoors. Brady threw so many excellent games in bad weather that they all blend together. These players would be so minimally better full time in a dome that it would almost be considered within the range of statistical error rather than have had any real affect.

 

last year means very little. no ben to start with. different o-linemen already added. daniels is a stud. cole will be an upgrade at center. moore year two should get better. moore was thrown to the wolves last year. he had the highest ceiling of any OT coming out last year. new O-line coach that actually knows what he's doing. they still may add a tackle later in this draft for depth and down the road. no imminent need at 20. still have haeg, chaz green, john leglue all can play tackle if the need arises too. that will be sorted out in camp but we have our starters and won't have a statue at QB.

we still have our starting WRs and added 2. olszewski and boykin. still have miller and sims both with decent nfl experience under their belts.

CB is very deep in this draft. we can easily get one in round 2-3. no need to force one at 20. isaiah johnson was added late in the year last year and may make some noise in camp. he played for the raiders and was used in sub packages for them. big too. 6-2 210 corner. i do expect we add one within the first 3 rounds. as i said this position is very deep this year.

bush is an uncertainty but the steelers will play him. they added jack next to him and drafted buddy johnson last year. they may add one at some point in this draft. this position is pretty deep too. they also added genard avery which can play inside or outside.

alualu broke his ankle. freak accident not a lingering injury type of injury. still have adams, loudermilk, wormley, carlos davis, and kahlil davis. if we get tuitt fine but not really a need.