Discussion in 'The Bill Nunn Draft Room' started by mac daddyo, Mar 15, 2015.
OLB so we make sure we get a top guy? cb and hope we get an OLB that we can eventually use? other?
If a top OLB is there, I think you have to take him. We need a top guy, we need an athletic freak, which Jarvis never was. Put that guy against the excellent LTs we have to face, and let Jarvis be the new Worilds. Unfortunately, I think they'll all be gone, and possibly long gone. I'd trade something to get one, but not too much. Maybe a 3rd if I had to, and if the team really loved him. Target CB in rounds 2/3. Rounds 3 and on can be DE or S. Rounds 4 and on can be TE, RB, and hell, I'll take more OLB/CB.
From the 4th round on, I'm fine taking any position if it's exceptional value. But I don't want to see us take a WR in the top 3 rounds just because the guy is good. We have good young guys there, and we need new players on the field at other positions. I'm a BPA guy, but it's a balance. When you're as desperate as us at certain positions, you can't waste opportunities to fill holes for a guy that will sit on the bench *cough*ARCHER*cough*. I don't usually feel that way, but we usually don't have such glaring needs. I expect there to be good value available, so I'll be disappointed if we con't come away with help.
That's what I'm hoping for!
If we sign Roberson tmrw, We go Collins in the first, OLB in the sec then mabey CB in the 3rd.. Depends how the draft falls, .. IMO
here is my concern. if the top OLB'ers are taken ( which is another debate about which ones are the top guys) and we opt for a CB in the first, how many OLB'ers will be there in the second by the time we pick? the same thing could happen in the 2nd with the 2nd tier of pass rushers. then we are looking at an even worse OLB'er and almost having to force one then. do we reach for the next available OLB if say ray, gregory, Dupree, fowler, beasley are gone? do we go hunter, Harold, kikaha, mauldin or another guy a little earlier than we may want?
If the top 5 rushers are gone (Fowler, Beasley, Ray, Gregory, Dupree), then I look at CB. At this point Harold seems like a reach, but I haven't seen much film on him yet. If there are still quite a few CBs on the board that I like, I consider trading back to the end of the 1st, and taking one there. Or, if they really like one guy, I'm okay with them pulling the trigger. For me, in a situation like that, I care about how the team feels about them more than how I feel about them. Just like Shazier last year. Throughout the process, I was all about the Shazier pick if the Steelers liked him. If they didn't think he'd be a good fit, I didn't want to touch him. After all the research, I feel like I know all about a player like Shazier or this year's CBs, but I still have no idea how well he might fit with the team. I can guess, but not really know.
By trading back, we can either get an extra guy in the 3rd, or use the ammo to trade up in the 2nd or 3rd to snag a falling target. I agree, if we don't land an OLB in the 1st, we might face the same exact problem in the 2nd, missing out on the 2nd wave as well. I hate to reach, so trading back is what I'm thinking.
Obviously I don't want QB, RB, WR, or ILB. Some other positions some people have us taking but I want no part of in round 1: DL, OL, S, TE. I'm a tough guy to please this year.
I pretty much never want to trade up in the first. However, this season I would trade up and give up some picks to get Fowler or Ray. I doubt that either will even get into range where we can get there without paying a king's ransom, but maybe some teams will fall in love with guys like Dupree or Beasley because of their physical traits and push Fowler or Ray down a bit. As for Beasley, Dupree and Gregory - I need to watch more film, but so far I feel a bit less certain about them than I do about Fowler and Ray.
All of that said, I wouldn't reach for position need. I have big questions about the guys in the next wave of OLBS, and would probably pass on them at pick 22.
someone will fall ,
i would be happy with one of these
lael collins andreus peat landon collins kevin johnson bud dupree
,one of them will be there ..i hope
Yeah I think you are right. Of the guys you listed I think the LSU duo would be most likely to be there when we draft.
Dupree scares me. We need someone that's very athletically gifted like him, but his production hasn't matched his athleticism. Rushing the passer is more of a mentality than anything, and Dupree may not have the mindset for it. I think of all the top guys, Shane Ray has that mentality, but he'll be long gone.
Personally I think the best way to go for us is OT, so that BB can get even more breathing room to work his magic.
I wish is made sense for us to select DL in the 1st, as there will be some quality guys there for us to take. But our starters are set so I don't see us taking a DL for a depth only, unless they don't have faith in McClendon staying healthy. I would really like to see Eddie Goldman on our roster.
The top CB's (Waynes and Johnson) will likely be gone and the best of the rest would be reaches at #22, although I really like Rollins. OLB at #22 will come down to Harold, or McKinney making a switch to OLB. Ehh.
TE is possible, but I think they like this position round 3 and later. Maxx Williams has some growing to do yet and he's already good, so I'd be fine with him in the 1st, but don't think his immediate production totally supports a 1st round selection. He's more of a "let's take him and hope he realizes his full potential" selection.
So that leaves OT. We only really have two capable guys, Pouncey and DeCastro, and the rest are open to upgrade. I like Jake Fisher, but he's not a value pick at #22. If DJ Humphries, TJ Clemmings or Andrus Peat are there, I think we take one. It's time.
I thought you said Jalen Collins, not Landon Collins, hence the "LSU duo" statement.
I think this has a pretty good chance of happening. I think the Steelers are low key really interested in Landon Collins.
I hope not. OO from ucla may be a sleeper first pick in that OLB unit.
I would also throw the 3rd Collins in with Landon be the preferred one. I actually think there's a decent chance of him falling.
if i have to choose another cb not named k johnson i will take rollins
while i like rollins, i think 22 is high for him. 1 year is my concern. i do like byron jones, steven nelson, doran gramt or eric rowe if we get into rounds 2 and 3 for a corner. if it ended up OO and then jones followed by grant, i could like that.
i know is little high but i was answering to the possibility to add jalen collins , i prefer rollins then ... i like grant too , jones i don't know ..
I still think cb is the way to go in the 1st...... there's a big drop off after the top prospects, so if we don't get one of them in the 1st, then we're almost looking at the same futility in the secondary next season....
the olb prospects and de converts are extremely deep this yr, and we can find someone who can be highly productive throughout the draft
I've watched some corner film recently, and I like Johnson a lot. I would have no problem taking him at #22, and I wonder if some teams ahead of us have him on their radar. He's a good prospect. I really don't like Jalen Collins' film at all. He has the physical tools, but it looks to me like he lacks toughness and has questionable instincts. I like how Rollins isn't afraid to mix it up, but I saw coverage inconsistencies. He may improve in that area with coaching, but it may take some time. I do like him better than Jalen Collins though.
I also continue to question how highly rated Landon Collins is. He's great attacking the run game, but is pretty questionable in coverage IMO. I haven't rewatched the Alabama loss to Ole Miss, but my recollection is that he got beat for 2 TDs in that game, including the game winner. I'll have to go back to confirm, but my impression of him back then was "ugh" after that game.
me too i'm worried johnson will be gone by 22 , he and waines are the two best cb in the draft ..
Even though a lot of free agent OLBs were signed by teams drafting ahead of us, I still think the top five will be gone. Which is fine by me anyway. A lot of people think Bud Dupree may slide but I think one of his old coaches is at Philly and Chip Kelly does not like Marcus Smith. And they lost the aging Trent Cole.
I think there will be more value at CB from the players left on the board. I would think two CBs will be gone, probably Waynes and Peters. Again, fine by me. I would be OK with Kevin Johnson, Alex Carter or even Quinton Rollins who could go between CB and FS. He did some drills there at his Pro day.
Carter and Rollins may be reaches but I would rather reach on potential than character (if Peters is there for example).
Most years, by the time the draft comes around you pretty much have it narrowed to a couple guys. And usually it is one of them. This year, it could be 15 different guys.
I would love to be a fly on the wall down on the south side this year. This has to be a tougher year than most to get the players ranked and establish a game plan.
I imagine there's a lot of lobbying going on.
I am of the thinking they will go with OLB /pass rusher first. They have got to get some pressure on the QB. Unless they feel that this person is already on their roster? CB/safety also has to be in play and people that are capable of playing quickly.We cannot afford red shirt years anymore. Our starters in the defensive backfield are just not that good.
I really like Rollins, and while I feel he'd be a reach at #22 (considering other talent projected to be available) I still think it'd be a good pick. I think he'll struggle with the deeper stuff initially (he was able to make up for mistakes in college with his athleticism), but anything in front of him it's lights out. With his basketball thievery background I think he'll be extremely effective in the redzone. Getting all those steals on the court was no accident, he has the mindset of a thief, and that transfers to the field. Plus, he'll come up and lay the wood in support of the run game. While there have been other "flavors of the day", I keep coming back to Rollins.
I would not be surprised if Johnson eclipses Waynes as the first CB drafted, and I'm thinking both will be gone before we select at #22. But the rest will be there, including Peters, who I wouldn't touch until the 3rd, at the earliest (he'll lead the league in missed tackles).
I forgot to mention Peters. I couldn't stand his film. I actually had to stop watching one of his game tapes half way through because he was such a wuss in the physical aspect of the game. I see some online pundits like him a lot, but they must be watching different games than I watched.
Also, I think Johnson may go before #22, but I think whether he goes before or after Wayne will depend on the scheme fit of the beholder. Johnson played off a whole lot, which certainly fits what we have historically done pretty nicely.
the cbs rankings is the most similar to my thinking between all the rankings around