1. Hi Guest, Registrations are now open. See you on the inside.
    Dismiss Notice

What do you think our red zone problem is ?

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by bettissb40, Oct 24, 2017.

  1. bettissb40

    bettissb40 Well-Known Member

    688
    35
    Oct 16, 2011
    We have had problems getting into the end zone ever since Bettis left. Does anybody on this coaching staff have a clue on curing this situation. It seems to me that they practice more on making the 2 point conversion than they do on getting in the end zone which by the way why practice the 2 point conversion if you can't score. Boswell is doing a good job on winning games for us or at least keeping us in the game.
     
  2. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

    21,270
    5,117
    Apr 21, 2016
    It is either our execution or that the personnel matchups simply are not within our favor.


    The former has mainly to do with the offense and the latter is all on Haley; both issues creating the current state of affairs.


    To begin to correct this, Ben really should make adjustments on pre snap reads if there is a matchup based on player vs. player or personnel weaknesses overall within the opposing formation. From there, snap the ball and execution will dictate success or failure. More often than not said previous



    For Haley, he really needs to stop over analyzing some of his playcalling decisions on situational downs. Using Rosie Nix on some of those third/fourth and shorts really would have helped as opposed to simply having Terrell Watson run it in between the A and B gaps (better blocking would have assisted as well but an extra blocker would not hurt).



    Either way, as I recently stated in another thread although will be adding a more "headstrong" statement towards it;


    Cris Boswell is not beating New England! An entire unified, synchronized, concentrated effort from the offense will; Ben included.
     
  3. WWW

    WWW Writing Team

    1,164
    80
    Oct 24, 2011
    At least, 75% Playcalling and personnel.
    Idem for 3rd & 4th and short.

    We do have big targets to throw to, as well as backs to run the football.

    Of course, execution (missed blocks, drops, bad reads) plays a part of this failure (25%?)
     
  4. steelcurtainmrp

    steelcurtainmrp Well-Known Member

    1,412
    188
    Nov 15, 2016
    I think it is a mixture of a few things, but mainly Haley. Ben needs to make some pre-snap adjustments. But I think Haley is the real problem. We go down the whole field no problem then sh*t the bed in the redzone because we go to a formation that we didn't use the whole drive (that was working). We'll go 5-wide receiver set when we're 5 yards away from the end zone, doesn't make sense. Then on 3rd and 4th and short we put Terrell Watson in (Nothing against him) when Le'veon is absolutely killing it. Not to mention not having Rosie Nix in there on those short yard situation, like come on, he's a frickin bulldozer out there, looks like Dan Kreider in his prime.

    I just don't understand where he's coming from and you can tell with some of Ben's facial expressions that he's not a fan of some of the calls. Freaking Terry Bradshaw called his own plays (remember he can't spell cat even if he's spotted the C and T, lol) and look how well he did. I would love to see Ben have that much freedom but you just don't see that in todays game.

    I think our offense it at best when were in the two minute drill or in a rush to get down the field. Thats when Bens at his best: no huddle, running his own plays and calling the shots, I love it.
     
  5. turtle

    turtle

    8,542
    1,375
    Jan 14, 2015
    The play calls are horrendous imo. Don't know if its Haley or Ben calling audibles. They seem to set themselves up for failure before the ball is snapped with some of their formations.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. steel1031

    steel1031 Well-Known Member

    3,825
    239
    Oct 16, 2011
    The way ben said he needs to look at the film before he comments after game, tells me it might be some wrong routes
     
  7. jeh1856

    jeh1856 Beer is good

    26,991
    10,035
    Oct 26, 2011
    Ben was on the radio today, and with no self centered ego, pretty much said if the play goes well it’s because he called a good play and if the play goes poorly he’s just a player and runs what the coaches tell him. Typical Ben
     
  8. 86WardsWay

    86WardsWay Well-Known Member

    16,308
    4,628
    Dec 27, 2012
    From what I see it's coaching. They abandon the play calling that gets them in that area and try to be a finesse team when pure power gets them down there. What good is it running the ball down the opponents throat to the 4 yard line and then all of a sudden go 5 wide on 1st and goal? When we do run it, how often do they pitch it and run wide to stretch the field? It's almost never.
     
  9. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

    16,211
    4,202
    Oct 19, 2011
    The Five wide makes sense when they are trying to eliminate so many guys packed tight into the box, supposedly then you take the opposing defense out of base defense and force a more favorable matchup with Nickel or dime and then try the shovel pass to TE's or JuJu on the slant so the reasoning is sound just the execution or realization that they didn't take a LB out for a DB is slow.

    However I agree that they need to straight up go old school and power it in behind Nix or at least run some pick plays to get guys free just as they cross the goaline
     
    • Against The Rules Against The Rules x 1
  10. steelcurtainmrp

    steelcurtainmrp Well-Known Member

    1,412
    188
    Nov 15, 2016

    I understand that reasoning but it just irks me that we'll ride Le'Veon down the whole field then go five wide two plays in a row which usually ends up with Ben scrambling, maybe due to no RB to pass protect, and throwing it out of the end zone.

    I agree that the 5 wide has worked some times, JuJus shovel pass TD was out of that formation I Believe... But I feel short passes and plays like that are the only plays that work out of that formation... because like I said, more often than not I feel Ben is scrambling and throwing it away, and you know he doesn't have the legs to get to the end zone like he used to.

    Regardless of what we do, I hope something starts clicking in the redzone and on short down situations.
     
  11. strummerfan

    strummerfan Well-Known Member

    15,725
    3,052
    May 9, 2012
    2 head coaches
    5-6 offensive coordinators
    Who knows how many different combinations of rb,wr,te etc

    Through all of that there’s one common denominator, Ben. Over the course of his career we’ve had two seasons where we aren’t average to below average in the red zone.
     
  12. GoalLine

    GoalLine

    2,527
    983
    Oct 16, 2011
    Here this explains it...

     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

    2,766
    576
    Oct 8, 2017
    It's coaching. If Ben has never been any good in the red zone, like some of you keep saying (which is absolutely stupid, btw) then the coaching staff has had 14 years to play to his strengths and come up with a scheme that works.

    If we can move the ball outside the red zone and then stand around with our thumbs up our butts inside the 20, then it's not execution. It's coaching. It's bad play calling and poor assessment of personnel.

    If the problem is bad route running, then guess what? The coaches need to address and FIX IT!

    All this falls on Tomlin and his offensive staff. They aren't dealing with a bunch of rookies. This isn't college. The core of a very good team is available to them. They've had years to develop and scheme and assess talent and weaknesses.

    What's our problem? Coaching. How do we fix it? Clean house. Will that happen? Not any time soon.
     
  14. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

    41,499
    8,939
    Oct 16, 2011
    Love Ben, always have defended him but two things are obvious now.

    1) The common denominator in the redzone is Ben as you said.
    2) Bens game has dropped off a lot, dont hold your breath for him to miraculously start playing great football again.

    He may have a couple 350 yards, 3 TD games in the second half of the season but more than likely, you'll be seeing 200-250 yard 1- 2 TD's Ben from now on. Which should be enough if the defense plays like this the rest of the way and Bell does his thing.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. strummerfan

    strummerfan Well-Known Member

    15,725
    3,052
    May 9, 2012

    You can call it stupid, but it's true. Look at the numbers. As for your claim that it falls on the coaches that's just garbage. Coaches can make players better, but there's a limit to what they can do. They can't make a player's brain process information faster etc.
     
  16. STEELWARRIOR

    STEELWARRIOR Well-Known Member

    3,646
    543
    Oct 26, 2011
    One word, Heeeeath!!! We have found his replacement.
     
  17. JAD

    JAD Well-Known Member

    3,193
    330
    Jan 2, 2012
    1. Not using your fullback in goal lines.

    2. Not passing to and using your 6' 6" tight end or 6' 4" Bryant in end zones.

    3. Not forcing it to AB always in the end zone, he is great in open spaces but his size dosent help in tight spaces.

    4. Use play action more and be less predictable on run or pass.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

    2,766
    576
    Oct 8, 2017
    These are professional athletes. The best of the best. Most have been "practicing" for the NFL since the age of 10. They were hand picked based on their physical and mental abilities to PERFORM on the field, to EXECUTE the plays as drawn out.

    They are human, however, and can make mistakes, get distracted, or even not give 100% on every play.

    At this level, coaches really don't make them better. At this level, coaches manage athletes, strive to pull the best out of them, and attempt to position them in a way to combine their efforts into a single, focused synergy. If a coach is able to do those things, a play, or a series, has a good chance of being successful.

    If a team is consistently deficient over a long period of time, then the coaching staff has failed to assess the talent they've chosen and to adjust to the strengths and weaknesses of the players.

    This is not college, where the talent pool dramatically changes every year. There is a limit to what they can do. They have a scheme that players fit into. In the NFL, offenses can be centered around the talent.

    When you have the league's best wr and rb, you don't force them to perform under a system that doesn't play to their strengths. You adapt to them. COACHES adapt to them.

    Everything ultimately falls on the coaches. To say anything else is folly.
     
  19. bigbenhotness

    bigbenhotness Well-Known Member

    21,276
    3,292
    Nov 1, 2014
    Ben has never been elite in the redzone, the numbers don't lie. Although, Haley can help him by not being an idiot lol
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  20. Iowasteeljim

    Iowasteeljim

    2,524
    492
    Oct 26, 2011
    It is straight up play calling. I've played and watched football for over 40 years, you are not going to convince me otherwise. As close as we have been at times, Ben could have tripped forward for the touchdown. If you are in the 5 yard range with 3 downs and you can't run the ball in, I guess I'm not even sure how you made it that far.
     
  21. strummerfan

    strummerfan Well-Known Member

    15,725
    3,052
    May 9, 2012

    When you have a sample size that includes numerous coaches, coordinators etc and one common denominator you have to take off your blinders. Ben is what he is and one of those things is a qb that struggles in the red zone. Ben has never been the most accurate qb. He likes his receivers college open. That used to happen when ben could scramble and extend the play. However, you have tighter windows in the red zone which diminishes the success of extending the play. That is also excacerbated by his decreased mobility.
     
  22. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

    27,703
    5,277
    Oct 22, 2011
    our problem is not scoring TD's. maybe it's to keep bosswell from wanting a trade for not getting enough FG tries. :cool:
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 3
  23. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

    5,803
    453
    Oct 26, 2011
    Part Coaching and play calling and mostly QB play as stated . Ben is not a precise thrower ,he is no threat to run. He is not a good play faker either. All these things get compounded as the field gets shorter .

    IMO the Team should give Dobbs a hat and start working him on short yardage and Red zone looks . The threat of the QB run should help. The ability to play fake better will help. We could run more multiple RB sets as Dobbs has the speed that Ben doesn't .

    I think a lot of fans are hung up on what Ben used to be . He is not better than Dobbs overall , Ben may still be the better thrower , but all the other things Dobbs can do that Ben can't might be exactly what is needed in certain situations .
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  24. Sojourner

    Sojourner Well-Known Member

    271
    49
    Jun 25, 2015
    That will never happen.

    I agree with those who say it's the situational play-calling. Haley sucks in the RZ. Always has and always will.
     
  25. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

    5,803
    453
    Oct 26, 2011
    It probably wont but it should . We tried some specific packages for a washed up Vick when Ben was playing much better. It makes more sense to use a young QB now while Ben is in a massive decline.
     

Share This Page

Welcome to the ultimate resource for Steelers fans. Sign Up Here!