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We are NOT your old Classic 3-4 Defense anymore.....

Discussion in 'The Bill Nunn Draft Room' started by cajunyankee, Feb 18, 2016.

  1. cajunyankee

    cajunyankee Well-Known Member

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  2. SGSteeler

    SGSteeler Well-Known Member

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    What type of DL are you advocating tho? If we are going for a guy that slots in as a DE in a 4 man front, I think that would be a great fit for us. Ideally we would want that guy to be capable as an OLB in a 3 man front (a lot like Dupree), but since we will be in Nickel on passing downs (and really about 2/3's of the snaps) it doesn't necessarily matter. A guy that can pass rush from that spot would be a great addition to our defense.

    If we are talking interior DL, then I'd be less excited about that proposition. We already have two guys that are really good as 3-5 techs, and another guy in McLendon who I think can play anywhere from the 0 to the 5 relatively effectively. If we continue to play 4 man from as much as we do, those 3 players should be able to rotate and be really good in those situations. Adding a first round DT would be insane IMO unless we are planning on moving on from a cheap and efficient player like McLendon (which I wouldn't advocate).
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    I agree with SG. I'd be all for getting a quality 43 edge rusher in the 1st round, but not an interior guy. I watched Kevin Dodd's FBS championship tape this AM, and he is quite a player. He had 5 TFLs and 3 sacks against Alabama in that game. If Bama's receivers (especially the TE) weren't so open right off the snap all day, he would have had an even bigger impact. Right now he seems to be projected as a late 1st round prospect.
     
  4. steelers5859

    steelers5859 Well-Known Member

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    Maybe not round one for the DT/DE but Heyward and Tuitt needs a breather. They played entirely to many snaps last year. We need some depth at that position.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. SGSteeler

    SGSteeler Well-Known Member

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    For sure. McLendon should be able to provide some of that, and we could draft one later or sign someone in FA to help back them up.
     
  6. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    Cajun, very nice read lots of good stuff there. Now as far as DL in the first I am gonna say pass and here is why. I think we really need to pay some attention to the back end a safety or CB. We don't need to draft a DE in the first cause we have our starters already, pick up some depth later in the draft. As for DT/NT this draft is deep so no need to draft one in the 1st.
     
  7. GB_Steel

    GB_Steel Well-Known Member

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    I agree that McClendon should be able to give Tuitt and Heyward a breather, but it's interesting to me that he hasn't been used in that role unless forced by injury. It's also concerning because we have a competent substitute already on our roster and yet Heyward leads the league in snaps for a DE with Tuitt close behind. We need quality depth but our coaches also have to be willing to pull the trigger and get our starters out of there more often in the first 3 quarters.

    If we draft a dominant NT in the mold of Hampton/Wilfork that can transcend the position, and if that frees up McClendon to be the primary swing backup to all 3 positions, will the coaches still force Tuitt and Heyward into close to 90% of all the defensive snaps, plus special teams? I'm worried that would be the case; which is why I'm leaning towards not drafting a dominant DL anymore in the 1st and going with maybe Darian Thompson, who should be there and would likely start from day 1 at whatever safety position is open.

    Wouldn't be as dominant at his position as a guy like Billings or Reed, but at least he'd see the field in our defense.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  8. Da Stellars

    Da Stellars Well-Known Member

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    Why can't Heyward and Tuitt play all the snaps? They are young, not even in their prime yet...

    They only started rotating guys when A. Smith, B. Keisel, and C. Hampton were all getting up there in age. It would be nice to have a rotation guy, but he doesn't need to play alot.
     
  9. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Thompson is starting to emerge as my guy for this draft. The only thing is, I think that priority is going to change before then. I've been reading that the Steelers are going to make a play for a FA safety and focus on CB in the draft.

    So, I guess its wait and see. But I do like Thompson.
     
  10. GB_Steel

    GB_Steel Well-Known Member

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    Because they are gassed when we need them to help us close out games in the 4th quarter. Those two have essentially become the Reggie White/Sean Jones of our defense; they are our primary pass rushers. We can't have them toying around on every special team snap and 90% of all the defensive snaps and expect them to generate much push against the OL late in games, especially once the season begins to drag on. It would help if our OLB's could generate consistent pressure, but that isn't happening.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    i'm expecting walton, lyons and chickillo to have more playing time as backups and specialty passing situation players. walton and lyons as backup DE's for the breather for tuitt and cam. putting chickillo and dupree (both around the 260# range) on the outside really increases our size from the outside as small 4-3 DE's or big 3-4 OLB'ers for pass rushing purposes. there is talk about using the quarters package as we did in DL's final season more, but last year had to use more of the nickle packages under KB because of our safety situation. i think they prefer the quarters if we have better safety play and using dupree and chickillo as bigger players off the edge on passing downs transforms it all to an improved best of both worlds defense.

    tuitt, heyward 2 down linemen

    dupree edge, shazier mlb, chickillo edge

    cockrell outside, gay slot, ( let's say mccain) outside

    mitchell mid field help for shazier or deep middle help, golden grant, two converted cb's to help with the deep half. :cool:
     
  12. steelersrule6

    steelersrule6 Well-Known Member

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    You're asking a lot from Chickillo to go from barely playing as a rookie, I don't see him playing that much next season with Harrison and Jarvis still here.
     
  13. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    harrisons role will be limited just as last year and probably more. JJ hasn't shown much in the pass rush department. chickillo as i said would be more of a pass rush specialist on passing downs. this would give us more of a 4 man front and an extra safety for run support but two safeties with cb coverage skills. :cool:
     
  14. Da Stellars

    Da Stellars Well-Known Member

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    I'm not high on Chickillo... He might be a decent special teamer for us... I don't see him as much more than that.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. RPO IZSB

    RPO IZSB Well-Known Member

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    Great article. I've been preaching the same for 2 years.
     
  16. steelers5859

    steelers5859 Well-Known Member

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    As I agree we do need help on the back end, I think it comes down to value. Would you take a top 5 DT/DE or a Safety or CB rated 15th or below in their position group?
     
  17. steelersrule6

    steelersrule6 Well-Known Member

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    Harrison role wasn't limited last year he played more snaps at OLB than the other guys, there was some instances he wouldn't come off the field to let Jarvis in the game. Chickillo would have to show a lot of progress in preseason for him to get playing time.
     
  18. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    Well I get what your saying, but your example is a little off. If 10-15 cb/s go before us at 25 we are going to end up with a top 5 player overall. I think the question would have to be would you rather a top 5 DT or a top 5 CB or S...and I take the CB or S. This draft is deep at DT, there are at least 9 DT's I would take and not be upset with. Robinson, Rankins, Butler, Reed, Billings, Nkemdiche, Washington, Clark and Johnson are all guys I like and feel could get the same kind of production from each. Now listen am I saying Clark is better then Robinson, no but I am saying I would rather have a Alexander/Neal/Apple/Thompson in the 1st and a Reed/Clark/Washington/Johnson/Butler in the 2nd or 3rd.

    Take any mock draft I used Walterfootball. At our pick DT's picked before us Rankins, Robinson, Billings, Reed and Nkemdiche. Leaving Clark, Washington, Butler, Collins and Johnson in the 2nd. Now look at CB/S before our pick Ramsey, Hargreaves are gone(for the record I think more will be come draft time) leaving Alexander, Neal, Apple, Fuller, Howard and Thompson all with much higher value imo.

    I like Washington, Butler and Johnson a lot but our need in the back end makes me want Apple, Fuller, Neal, or Thompson more. That's just how I feel I am not saying your wrong I feel we need help up front but I feel we get more value not picking DT in the 1st. Not to mention with Heath retiring that make TE a bigger hole too.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    for james harrison? that WAS limited. him playing that much wasn't the plan for him then, nor will it be this year.

    sure chickillo would have to show progress, thats kinda what we expect from players. as a "situational pass rusher" chickillo wouldn't be on the field every down either. his role would be more of a "DE of a 4-3" with dupree in passing situations. :cool:
     

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