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The All-Time Steelers Team

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Charlie Whigg, Jul 1, 2018.

  1. Formerscribe

    Formerscribe Well-Known Member

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    That is guesswork that can't be checked. I'll stick to what actually happened. By that measure, Harris was clearly better.
     
  2. Formerscribe

    Formerscribe Well-Known Member

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    I'd probably be able to take that more seriously if you knew how to spell Gretzky.
     
  3. Watt Wack

    Watt Wack Well-Known Member

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    "Clearly better" with less career yards? OOOOOOOOOOOOOO KKKKKKKKKKKKKK dokey
     
  4. Watt Wack

    Watt Wack Well-Known Member

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    Not needed in an NFL board.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. Formerscribe

    Formerscribe Well-Known Member

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    Harris averaged more yards per carry. You're also ignoring the passing game, in which Bettis was largely useless.

    You are also ignoring the largest difference between the two, which was the playoffs. Even though Bettis played in an era with more rounds of playoff games, Harris still had more than twice as many yards rushing in the post-season, 1,556 to 674. He also averaged more yards per carry, 3.9 to 3.4. He has four Super Bowl rings to one for Bettis and he actually earned MVP honors once, setting what was then the rushing record for the Super Bowl.

    Your analysis here is overly simplistic and flat-out incorrect.
     
  6. tyler christopher

    tyler christopher Well-Known Member

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    Bettis had some horrible fumbles in big spots and had some horrible playoff games........
     
  7. Ben There

    Ben There Well-Known Member

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  8. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    I feel that they need a spot for John L Williams and Dan "the Destroyer"Krieder on an all time list. Just as lead blocker/utility player.
     
  9. Formerscribe

    Formerscribe Well-Known Member

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    The team has a good tradition of fullbacks who could also run. Krieder was pretty much a guard in the backfield. Williams was at least a quality threat as a receiver. But do you make room for guys like that over a more complete fullback like Merril Hoge?
     
  10. jeh1856

    jeh1856

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    Or Bleier
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Formerscribe

    Formerscribe Well-Known Member

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    True. There wasn't much distinction among fullbacks and halfbacks in Noll's offense. The fullback was often the feature back. Harris, Pollard and Hoge were examples of that.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    Very tough decision. Big Hoge fan so I'd put him on an All time list but still would want Dan or John L in there too.
     
  13. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    I love Bettis. One of my all time favorite Steelers. I too think he would’ve thrived in that era. Hard to put him ahead of Harris though. Harris was great for the reasons @Formerscribe@Formerscribe mentioned and he was part of the huge turnaround of our team.
    Lloyd was great especially for the short amount of time he actually played. He is my all time favorite Steeler and absolutely would have thrived on those 70’s teams IMO.
     
  14. Watt Wack

    Watt Wack Well-Known Member

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    You know what? I really don't care either way. There is no wrong answer. It's just that Franco was on the best team ever, Bus was on good teams. Imagine how much easier it would be to play on those 70's teams. Ridiculous.
     
  15. Charlie Whigg

    Charlie Whigg Member

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    Yes the Bus was great in any era, but he would’ve dominated the physical, hard nosed beat ‘em style of 1970’s football
     
  16. Formerscribe

    Formerscribe Well-Known Member

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    The greatness of those teams was on defense for at least half of that decade. Harris emerged as a stud before they had Swann and Stallworth. He was a star before Bradshaw had even fully emerged as the starting quarterback.

    Yes, Harris had more talent around him as the decade went on. He also had to share carries with Bleier because Noll was going to run his offense no matter what and it worked.

    To me, the playoffs are the reason there is a clear answer. Harris was fantastic in the post-season, a huge part of four Super Bowl victories. Bettis had mixed results in the playoffs and he was a backup for his one championship team.
     
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  17. Charlie Whigg

    Charlie Whigg Member

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    Harris was on better Steelers teams, so they saw more playoff games. He had more opportunities than Bettis. And per Pro Football Reference, Bettis had a career 3.9 YPC to Harris' 4.1. Harris still has more, but that .2 YPC really isn't that much of a difference.
    Not saying that Bettis is the obvious choice, I think you could make a really solid case for either. Just saying that I don't feel it's as cut and dry as you make it out to be
     
  18. Formerscribe

    Formerscribe Well-Known Member

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    Over the course of an entire career, 0.2 yards per carry is significant. Yes, Harris had more opportunities in the playoffs, but Bettis had more during the regular season. Part of that is because the league didn't even extend the regular season to 16 games until the seventh season of Harris's career.

    Harris wasn't just better in the playoffs because he got more carries. The yards per carry average difference between the two is far more significant in the post season, 3.9 yards for Harris to 3.4 for Bettis. Harris also caught 51 passes for 504 yards in 19 playoff games. Bettis caught eight passes for 57 yards in 14 playoff games.

    Somebody brought up Bettis having more career rushing yards, which is why I countered with the advantages Harris has in average per carry and playoff performance.

    For all the talk of what Bettis might have done in the '70s, what about the production a versatile back like Harris would have had in the '90s and early 2000s?

    Also, Harris was part of the reason those '70s teams were better.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Kreighoff

    Kreighoff Well-Known Member

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    Anytime someone comes up with a list of All-Time Steelers or ten best Steelers there are going to be disagreements.
    The steelers have been blessed with so many great players in the past almost 50 years maybe the All-Time team needs to be a full 53 man roster.
    Different era's are always hard to compare, just look at the size of the guys today compared to the guys from the 70's , Olinemen are 50 lbs bigger today. Bettis although not the all purpose back Harris was might have been a monster if he played in 1975 at 250 lbs. Bettis would have been as heavy as Webster or Kolb who played around 250 or 255.

    Schemes were much different offensively and defensively, the steel curtain was the classic 4 / 3 and the roll of the outside LB's was a lot different from the way they are used today in a 3/ 4 alignment.

    Well at least its something to talk about until camp opens.
     
  20. tyler christopher

    tyler christopher Well-Known Member

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    That is just one of those things you will never know about but fun to talk about. Defenses stacking the line to stop bus and daring kordell to throw to receivers that were wide open. Bus never had a real qback. Even Bens first year the jets and pats stacked line and dared him to throw and made him look lost with different coverages.
     
  21. mcam

    mcam Well-Known Member

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  22. mcam

    mcam Well-Known Member

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    It was fun watching Bettis in his prime take on 9 man fronts when they knew we'd run and still take it to them. He gets a lot of attention during the end of his career winning superbowls, but the best of Bettis is when he just came to the burgh. The guy laid the hammer down.
     
  23. tyler christopher

    tyler christopher Well-Known Member

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    Good point I missed that one....... Harrison is much more dominant.
     
  24. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    Good list, but I'd go with Bradshaw over Ben, Harris over Bettis, and Swann over Ward, all ever so slightly. My 70s Steelers bias may be showing a little, lol. But these players were part of 4 winning Super Bowl teams in 6 years so I give them the edge based on that unparalleled success.
     
  25. mcam

    mcam Well-Known Member

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    Did you watch Kevin play?

    Check out Kevin Greene's stats
    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GreeKe00.htm
    10 double digit sack seasons

    vs James Harrison
    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HarrJa23.htm
    3 double digit sack season

    Harrison played 13 seasons in the Burgh. Greene only played 3, which in my opinion is a shame.

    Greene also has 160 career sacks in his 15 years compared to James Harrison's 84.5.

    Sorry bro, Kevin Greene was the dominant player in comparing the two. Very cool seeing him line up opposite of Greg Lloyd, which is up there with honorable mention. Also Jason Gildon, Joey Porter.

    It has been cool watching all of these players over the years. Obviously Jack Ham is a pen in for being the best at the position. Never saw him play personally except for old film, but he's regarded as one of the best all around players that has ever played outside linebacker.
     

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