1. Hi Guest, Registrations are now open. See you on the inside.
    Dismiss Notice

Not Trying to Create a QB Controversy Here

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by STEELWINDS, Nov 7, 2019.

  1. STEELWINDS

    STEELWINDS Well-Known Member

    284
    39
    Sep 12, 2019
    I will ask everyone this and I know, myself included, that I am getting way ahead of myself with this. However, before I do, and for the record, of course I want Ben back. Yet, we all know that this is not happening this season. It is an age relevance thing that got me to post this thread.

    Alright here I go: Given that, Mason is now building chemistry with a group of young faces that collectively are becoming "His Guys". Let's say that Mason does have a great deal of success with this crew. Then what? Well of course it is still going to be Ben's job. However, from an age standpoint Mason and many of the young skilled position players on "O" are all about the same age. What…. maybe 1-3 years apart? Does anybody think that this may factor into a QB preference from the young players on the “O”?

    Do you think that if Mason has a great deal of success (maybe a deep playoff run or how about a Super Bowl victory…. Yes!) would the young crew possibly prefer Mason over Ben? Not that it really matters because management has the final word. Also, by no means am I trying to create the proverbial "QB Controversy" here, especially after just a few average starts but some good wins here. The key verbiage is winning…. with Mason.

    Hey, if it was not for the blunders going back to the Seattle game we could be 7-1. Self-inflicted wounds I tell you. Everyone has seen them here and they were not Mason’s fault. Just something to think about. Given that, I have been on record from what I have seen SO FAR, and that is that I do like what Mason brings to the table; The man has “grit” I tell you. However, there is a lot of football still to be played and we will just have to wait and see how the season unfolds, development of his skill set, as well as how far he does lead us. STEELWINDS
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
    • Winner Winner x 1
  2. FeedTheMachineFTM

    FeedTheMachineFTM Well-Known Member

    2,966
    214
    Jan 1, 2012
    I’m ready to move on from BB
    IMO he did what he was brought here to do
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  3. defva

    defva Well-Known Member

    4,242
    225
    Oct 19, 2011
    I know I get on BB alot. But, I truly do believe that these wr's would be alot more polished with Ben at the helmet. It's not like when tommy gun got injured and Ben came in and actually did well beyond what anyone expected. MR doesnt scare anyone in the film room ... lol
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

    8,638
    1,063
    Nov 4, 2011
    Funny... when I saw the title, I thought this thread would be about whether to give Hodges another shot. Rudolph has done nothing to show me that he can be Ben’s successor for the long-term, never mind push Ben aside. Yeah, he’s managing games effectively, but our offense is almost completely devoid of dynamic plays in the passing game. It’s not all on the WRs and Fichtner. Rudolph has been erratic on downfield throws, and I think there’s good reason for the coaches to not trust him with a wide open attack.

    I still have hope that Rudolph can develop into a true starter, but every week I get less convinced that he’s a long-term option. In my view, any discussion of him replacing Ben if Ben comes back healthy requires an unrealistically negative view of Ben, and a really rosy view on Rudolph that makes excuses for his play to date.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 1
  5. AFan

    AFan Well-Known Member

    2,133
    192
    Oct 24, 2011
    If the young WRs have to choose between a fellow millennial QB who doesn't throw the ball often to WRs or a crusty old fossil QB who does, they'll take the old koot every time.
     
  6. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

    2,555
    328
    Sep 4, 2017
    From the limited time I have seen Mason on the field, he will never reach Bens skill level at QB. I think Ben earned the right to be the Steelers starter until somebody outplays him for the #1 spot.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. Jammasterc

    Jammasterc Well-Known Member

    7,050
    285
    Oct 26, 2011
    Trade someone to the Bears.
     
  8. STEELWINDS

    STEELWINDS Well-Known Member

    284
    39
    Sep 12, 2019
    Hey FTM.

    I like what Ben has accomplished here as well. I am from the early 70s and remember the drought between Terry and Ben. It was not always pretty. I for one am not ready to write Ben off. I do want him back. I do believe that he can get us another ring or two; especially now that it seems we are finally putting together a formidable "D". As I have stated in other threads, how quickly the "O" and "D" have respectfully changed places as far as the team's unit of strength.

    Given that, if Ben can build chemistry with the new faces of the "O" he probably at this moment in time is our best shot at another championship versus Mason. With all that said, I think that we are potentially on the cusp of being as complete a team on both sides of the ball as we ever have been. Like I also said, this would have been more probable if we still had Bell and Brown but we do not. However, I am excited about the new skilled position players on our "O" and the expediency of their development in correlation to Ben's window of time left is a big factor. That is why even though I like Mason, I still think Ben gives us our best chance to win it all but again, his window of time is shrinking due to age where the new "O" guys are just beginning their careers. Even guys like McDonald and Vannett are closer to Mason than Ben when it comes to age/retirement. STEELWINDS
     
  9. MeanJoeBlue

    MeanJoeBlue Well-Known Member

    640
    111
    Jan 2, 2013
    I'm never quite sure how to read this, when someone says this.

    That he needs to develop (a lot) more before he can be considered a long-term solution, I would agree with. But he seems to be growing, and not plateauing like Landry did.

    But some fans are saying that they don't think Rudolph will ever be a long-term solution, based on how he is playing now. I think this is premature for his first season getting starter's reps.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  10. STEELWINDS

    STEELWINDS Well-Known Member

    284
    39
    Sep 12, 2019
    I agree Roonatic.

    Mason has to earn it for sure. I seem to be in the minority here for my liking of Mason. Once again, by no means am I suggesting that Mason is ready to replace Ben. However, as another posted somewhere his body of work is such a small sample that I nor anyone else here should judge him too quickly. I just think the kid has some good upside from what I have seen. Most of it I must admit are intangibles. I feel he wants to prove that he should have been a Round One draft choice and even admitted that it is a driving force for him that he was not. I know, I know everyone feels that way but that is a good thing to have that kind of self-motivation. Otherwise, why even play the game if you do not want to be the best.

    As I have stated before, at this point in Mason's career, Ben had a way more complete team to work with. Mason, really has a very young "O" minus the O-Line. So young, that they are almost starting out together was my point of this thread. Where Ben had Bettis, Hines, Plaxico, Cedric, Heath and others that I am probably forgetting. Also, Ben had a Great "D" to work with to boot. Take care. STEELWINDS
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
  11. STEELWINDS

    STEELWINDS Well-Known Member

    284
    39
    Sep 12, 2019
    Hey Roonatic.

    Like I responded to FTM and I agree with you too, Mason must earn that spot and yes, he is no where near Ben's level to replace him at this point in his career. Given that, he has only started a handful of games but really has not done anything to lose the games that were lost. Ironically, those losses primarily come back to blunders by other players.

    Now, I am not giving Mason a pass here either. Given the turnovers that our "D" created for him he does not have a very good TD conversion rate regarding capitalization. FGs are not going to cut it as we know. However, Ben has also had these issues at certain points in his career as well. Maybe it is a player execution issue for both QBs or maybe it is a coaching issue (play calling) which often leaves many of us scratching our heads when our "O" is in the Redzone. Probably a combination of both. Take care. STEELWINDS
     
  12. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

    2,555
    328
    Sep 4, 2017
    The 'Ben had help poor Mason' argument is weak sauce. And if we want to get into being held back by the coaches early in your career part, well I have some bad news...
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 1
  13. santeesteel

    santeesteel

    5,961
    736
    Oct 17, 2011
    Ben is a "crusty old fossil"? I'm almost 30 years older than him! That makes me a...……………?
    CRAP!!:facepalm:
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. TheTerribleOwl

    TheTerribleOwl Well-Known Member

    947
    151
    Sep 1, 2017
    I think it is undeniable that Ben had more help on offense. He had a much better running game and better receivers to throw to. I am not sure how that can even be debated.
     
  15. pjgruden

    pjgruden

    2,786
    153
    Oct 16, 2011
    I think regardless of who the QB is, the team needs to move on from Ben. His cap hit is just way too high. Whether his replacement is currently on the team, I don't know. What I do know is they will have some contracts coming up they need to do, and they're going to have to get some new talent on the OL. All that costs money. Money that would be tied up in Ben's contract.
    Besides, have you seen Ben on the sideline? He's looking larger than ever. Does anyone honestly think he has the work ethic to keep himself ready and in shape for next year? I don't.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  16. STEELWINDS

    STEELWINDS Well-Known Member

    284
    39
    Sep 12, 2019
    Well that was my point there OWL.

    Another thing that Ben had was quality moralistic-type leadership amongst the team to support him. How many times has that been discussed here over the years about: "Who are the "Leaders" on this team?" A few names have been blurted out here and there but no one really stood out several years ago or even today. Some may say that that quality at the pro level is over rated. I am not so sure about that. It can only be an asset to a young QB or any player for that matter.

    How many of us remember the sound byte that Bettis gave to Ben before they played Super Bowl XL in Ben's second year. It went something like: "Hey Ben, the beauty of it is that it is just football". I think that support like that, along with superior physical talent helps to complement one another. STEELWINDS
     
  17. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

    2,555
    328
    Sep 4, 2017
    It's being used as an excuse for Mason. That makes for a weak argument.
     
  18. SteelerJJ

    SteelerJJ Well-Known Member

    7,011
    281
    Oct 16, 2011
    To me, Mason is more like Mike Tomczak than Big Ben. Serviceable but that's about it. We'll see though.
     
  19. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

    8,638
    1,063
    Nov 4, 2011
    I’m not saying he’ll never be the long term solution, but so far I’m not seeing any progression. If anything, I’m seeing regression. To me he’s not even the same guy that came off the bench vs. Seattle. His inaccuracy downfield is getting very concerning. By “downfield” I’m not referring to the deep ball. I think he throws a pretty good deep ball. I’m referring to anything longer than a quick slant out to around 25-30 yards. Digs, crossing patterns, deep outs, etc. We were very lucky that more of his errant throws vs. Miami weren’t intercepted. A team can’t have a high level passing offense when the QB is only effective throwing bombs or check downs. When he throws a pass that’s longer than a quick slant, and shorter than a bomb, I tense up in anticipation of something bad happening.

    I hope he starts progressing and becoming a better passer all over the field because we need it.
     
  20. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

    8,638
    1,063
    Nov 4, 2011
    Would you expect to save a lot of money vs. the cap by cutting Ben? We wouldn’t. Ben’s dead money will be $25 million next offseason. If we cut him before June 1, he would still have a $25 million cap hit for 2020. If it’s after June 1, the hit is spread over two seasons. Still, it’s not a situation where we can part ways and have plenty of cash to sign a starter.
     
  21. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

    11,564
    1,299
    Nov 24, 2011
    Trade deadline has passed
     
  22. Steel Hog

    Steel Hog Well-Known Member

    909
    137
    Dec 6, 2017
    Why discuss this now when there are too many unknown variables? How many more threads concerning MR qualities so far? Does anyone really know how Ben will recover? Does anyone really know what the WRs think or prefer? If Ben is able to play, he plays. Period.
     
  23. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

    2,555
    328
    Sep 4, 2017
    Aren't the Bears still reeling (pick wise) from the Mack deal?
     
  24. bigbenhotness

    bigbenhotness Well-Known Member

    13,668
    1,473
    Nov 1, 2014
    Ben didn’t throw really inaccurate wobbly ducks in his first season though... lol

    other than that he’s been a great game manager
     
  25. TheTerribleOwl

    TheTerribleOwl Well-Known Member

    947
    151
    Sep 1, 2017
    I don't use it as an excuse but I do bring it up when people compare Rudolph to Ben when Ben first started. Their situations are very different.
     

Share This Page

Welcome to the ultimate resource for Steelers fans. Sign Up Here!