Noll vs. Bellicheat

If Bellicheat gets 4 SB's is he a better coach than Noll all time? Will he at least be Noll's equal?

 

Noll won 4 super bowls in 6 years and never lost one. He's got my vote as #1.

 

SPYGATE discredits most of everything that Belicheat has accomplished.

 

yeah, that too. Noll = #1

 

Living in Charlotte, I find it incredible to listen to people try to talk with authority about this issue. Personally I put Lombardi at #1, Noll at #2, Paul Brown at #3.

Walsh
Gibbs
Belicheat
Parcells
Shula
Halas
Landry

These guys all make top 10. Where? Not sure, but it is a REALLY hard list to do.

 

It is impossible to compare pre-salary cap to salary cap coaches. Completely different set of circumstances to deal with.

 

He's definitely up there. I don't know about #1 though. Not sure I would take Noll either. I unfortunately didn't really get to see much of Noll's coaching, and what I did see were some of the not so great years for the Steelers. I have spent a ton of time reading about the history of the NFL, including past coaches and players. Noll is top 10 for sure, probably top 5. Bellichek likely is too, especially considering that he's not done yet and could very well add a few more SB's to his resume.

It's hard to ignore Walsh and Lombardi as 1 and 2. After all, if it wasn't for Lombardi, the Green Bay Packers may not even exist today. The only issue I have with putting Lombardi as the clear #1, is that he mostly coached in a different era when there wasn't nearly the same amount of competition. It's far easier to win the championship with far lesser teams in the league. There is absolutely no denying his record though. Everywhere he went he was a winner.

 

I disagree. I hear this a lot about players. ie. "You can't compare QB's of the 70's with today's QB's because the rules are so different." I think you can absolutely compare. Regardless of the rules or the salary cap, you work with what you have available. If you have a ton of money available, then you are competing against every other coach who also has a ton of money. If you don't have money to spend, well then neither does any other coach. It's what you can do with what you have that counts.

 

Agree.Also Noll won 4 Super Bowls in 6 years.He never lost one. So,I feel Noll is better.




Oh,I almost forgot.....Noll never cheated.

 

Feel free to disagree but you are wrong. Being able to keep any player you want ( a lot of those coached were pre free agency) means never having to let go a of your 3rd or 4th starting quality OG or OT because you have to have the money for another position. The salary cap makes every personnel decision a triage case.

 

I'm wrong? I didn't know opinions could be wrong. Anyway, my point still stands, Lombardi isn't competing against Belichek even though they're being compared, Lombardi was competing against every other coach in the league, all of which were operating under the same rules. Lombardi had advantages due to their being no free agency, but so did every other coach in his time, yet he bested all of them. Belichek has to compete against other coaches who try to steal his players, but at the same time, he can steal other teams players via free agency.

You don't have to compare the systems in place, you just compare the results they achieved against every other coach at the time who had to operate under the same rules. Not every coach in the 70's was successful, despite being able to keep all their players.

 

You know youre safe saying that on this board. But taking it elsewhere is asking for punishment.

 

You are wrong.

Free agency and expansion have changed the game dramatically. Talent is thinner and players are more mobile. Rosters less stable. And thats not even considering the enormity of the egos of todays players given footballs exalted status in our society.

Much harder now.

 

Disagree to an extent. The old phrase is "Familiarity breeds contempt. Noll somehow found a way to contain quite a few egos over a long period of time. No one ever got beyond the idea that the team was more important than the individual. Think about it. When did you ever see Jack Lambert or Joe Green do a "sack dance"? The closest you got to hot-dogging was Swann and Stallworth and their little hand-slap routine. When Harris would score a touchdown, he would just flip the ball to the official like he was ready for the next play.

Noll always considered himself to be a teacher more than a coach, and he did a better job than anyone I've ever seen at keeping the best team in the NFL learning new technique and new ways to remain dominant over those 6 years. Even though they only won 4 Super Bowls in those years, they were the best team in the NFL for those years - except maybe the injury year.

I'm not saying that Belicheck doesn't do a good job, but I really think that it is more difficult to do it repeatedly with the same group.