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No Hate For Jerry O??

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by TuRnDoWnForWaTT, Feb 12, 2018.

  1. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    Just curious why everyone wants Joey Porter tar and feathered but Jerry Olsavsky gets a free pass. I would have to say outside of Shazier the ILB corps performed just as bad as the OLBs did.
     
  2. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    He's not above criticism, but I think he managed to get decent production out of Vince Williams. Williams is very limited athletically, but he led all linebackers in sacks and was second on the team. Williams is a backup, IMHO, not a starter but he fared pretty well overall.

    Plus, Jerry Olsavsky doesn't act like a flippin' idiot when he's away from the office. Seems like much more of a professional to me.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  3. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Haley acted like a flipping idiot off the field too. Just saying.

    Also, Lake got players like Blake, Gay, McCain, Hilton, Cockrell to play above the line and he was everyones favorite whipping boy.

    TDFW has a point about Jerry O.

    Personally, I think fans place too much blame on these position coaches for the teams failures. Drafting well and defensive/offensive scheme is far more important.
     
  4. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    That doesn't mean I dont think Porter should be replaced. Its hard to know if hes good at his job or not (I dont really think he is) but he is a loose cannon and doesnt set a good example when you are trying to get players to toe the line.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  5. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    Vince Williams looked like garbage after Shazier went down. Jerry O had two months to get Sean Spence up to speed and wasn't able to. Matekavich looked awful in limited time, and LJ Fort wasn't even able to wrestle the starting job away from Spence who was terrible. So what I am saying is after years of working under Jerry O, Williams still is what he is, and no other ILBs have developed into even backup status. That's not a great track record.

    I also would lean toward getting rid of Porter. But my point is I feel like he and Lake have become scapegoats to a degree. Maybe Jerry O isn't getting in fights all over town, but his track record for developing linebackers is no better than Porters.
     
  6. Thigpen82

    Thigpen82

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    There’s also the fact that certain coaches are simply more recognisable and/or visible to fans. I don’t remember Lou Spanos catching quite this amount of message board discussion.
     
  7. Watt Wack

    Watt Wack Well-Known Member

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    Sean Spence was LAYING ON HIS COUCH before we signed him; he wasn't even 3rd string or on a practice squad anywhere.

    That tells me that he was seriously limited physically; so what if JO had 2 months to work with him? The guy had zero lateral speed going on - he was pathetic. NO coach could have made him any good. People tend to forget, sick injuries like Spence had are not usually overcome. It is the exception, not the norm, to ever come back from such a nasty injury.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    You make some good points. I'll add him to the list...

    #FJOI :smiley1:
     
  9. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    Haley can definitely be an idiot but I believe the Tequila Cowboy only had one incident in Pittsburgh at the Tequila Cowboy if I'm not mistaken. IMHO, he had a little more reputational capital as a competent football coach than Joey Porter has ever had, so he may get just a little more rope. When you suck as a coach AND are an idiot in your personal life too, it's time to go. At any rate, Haley is gone too so hope you're happy. ;)
     
  10. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    And let me add that we're talking about a guy, as you point out, who was out of football and laying on his couch. We're also talking about a guy with a lot of heart, was a late round draft pick in Dirty Red who is destined to play special teams in the NFL. And LJ Fort??? Seriously??? Joey Porter has had some very high draft picks to work with and has presided over their regression and their failure so far.

    But I'm cool if TDFW wants to fire Olsavsky. He's basically irrelevant but I think he seriously may have a little more upside as a coach. He was always a pretty heady player for us.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    Then Tomlin should have looked for options outside of Spence once it became obvious Spence couldn't get it done. It's not like Shazier went down in week 16.

    The main point I'm trying to make is that if the talent isn't there than it's very easy to blame position coaches. In the Steelers case I think it's the combination of both lack of talent and coaching. I'm not sure Jerry O had a lot to work with. But I'm not so sure Porter did either.
     
  12. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    How is Jerry O any more irrelevant than any other position coach?
     
  13. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    Maybe irrelevant is a poor word choice there. I think we can continue to ride with Jerry O. Or we can let him go and hire someone to replace him. I'm kind of neutral where he's concerned. My feelings on Joey Porter are not neutral or apathetic in any way. He needs to go NOW, IMHO. He has done absolutely nothing during his coaching tenure that has made me believe he's a quality coach. And he's done enough off the field to make me believe that at some point he's going to act up again. He's done it repeatedly and I don't want our young guys being led by someone like that.
     
  14. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    Joey Porter has had at least three VERY HIGHLY TOUTED AND HIGHLY DRAFTED players to work with. What are you talking about? Jerry O has had late round special teamers, other than Shazier who was lighting it up. Apples to oranges.
     
  15. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    I'm on the fence about how I feel about Porter as a coach. If we are being honest there's not a coach out there that was going to develop Jarvis Jones. He hasn't done a thing since leaving the Steelers either. The jury is still out on Bud Dupree. People sure weren't down on him at the end of 16. We were all expected more, but I'm not sure I'm willing to put his struggles all on Porter. Tj Watt came in and looked great from day 1. Yes he did hit a wall, but most rookies do. Other than those 3 Porter hasn't been given much to work with.
     
  16. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Ohhh so you don't mind when players/coaches aren't "buttoned up" as long as they are doing a good job???

    Haley had his tequila cowboy moment as well as trashing a rental he had and also stiffing a dog boarding business that he left ha dogs with for 6 months. He has more incidents then Porter!

    Yeah I'm giving you a hard time Jack, just playing :lolol:

    Oh and yes, I'm very happy :dancing:
     
  17. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    Imagine this scenario. Todd Haley builds a top 10 offense within 2 years and a top 5 offense within 5 years. The Browns make the playoffs in his third year as OC, with the Haley led offense being the primary contributor to the team's success. In the meantime, the Steelers continue to underperform and Ben decides to retire in 2 years. Landry Jones is a stopgap the year after Ben retires and the Steelers go 8-8. The next two years, under Josh Dobbs, they go 7-9 and then 6-10 resulting in missed playoffs each of the last three years. The Browns actually win the division the 5th year Haley is there and he has built one of the most explosive offenses in the league. Rooney finally tires of the ineffectiveness of the team and asks Tomlin to gracefully bow out as the Steelers coach, allowing him to save face and retire under his own terms. ABC immediately hires Tomlin to become the color commentator for MNF, offering the highest contract in broadcast history citing that he's one of the most tremendous wordsmiths in the world and when you combine that with his football knowledge, you can't go wrong!

    Two weeks later, the Steelers call a press conference to announce the hiring of their new head coach. Mr. Rooney takes the podium and announces "Ladies and gentlemen, I'd like you to meet the new head coach of the Pittsburgh Steelers, Todd Haley".

    Later that afternoon, two men in white coats show up at Blast's house with straitjacket in hand...:roflmao:
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2018
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 1
  18. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    It seems like a lot of Todd Haley's problems are of the crazy wife variety.

    Jack Attack, if Todd ever becomes Steelers head coach, mental health institutions will be booked over capacity. Blast Furnace may have to be carted of to a nut house in Cleveland.
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 2
  19. doubleyoi

    doubleyoi

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    I would say mainly the lack of production from the 1st rd talent (Dupree and the limited production from Watt down the stretch). Jerry-O had very little to work with once Shazier went down.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  20. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    i don't think it's hate for any of those guys just inexperience and i personally want more experienced coaching that can make a difference in a team that already has a lot of good players. coaches with the experience can put us over the top and thats where we want to go before our franchise qb retires. :cool:
     
  21. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    [​IMG]
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 1
  22. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    Good point, mac. Just look what happened when we brought a legitimate OL coach in. I'm hopeful that Tom Bradley can have that effect on the secondary and that we can find an OLB coach who can get the most out of these young, talented linebackers. First, we need to move on from the OLB coach we have and it doesn't appear that Tomlin is going to do that. Only he truly knows why. :shrug:
     
  23. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    Who exactly has Porter NOT developed?
     
  24. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    Okay, I'll concede that Jarvis Jones was probably destined to be a bust.

    Bud Dupree has clearly regressed after showing some flashes toward the end of last season.

    TJ Watt had some early season success, but actually seemed to regress himself the second half of the season.

    Anthony Chickillo is somewhat limited, but I can't help but believe that there's some talent there that we can tap into with the right coaching, in much the same way Munch got the most out of AV.

    Arthur Moats, limited talent I know, but certainly wasn't coached up by Porter.

    I agree with Mark Madden, Porter is a mascot. I agree with Paul Zeise, he has a friend in high places watching out for him. He's done some idiotic things off the field (away from coaching). We've got some guys who are desperate to be coached up to the next level and have the talent to be successful, but I don't believe Porter is the guy to get them there.

    JMHOFWIW :shrug:
     
  25. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    I do not give Jerry too much flak given the fact that L.J. Fort and Sean Spence were "last resort" options in addition to the fact that he did develop both Ryan and Vince collectively. Add the fact that Tyler Matakevich was initially in the running for being a Special Teams Pro Bowler and I would say Jerry has performed well.


    Yes, Ryan was already going to be a star but Jerry ensured that he would also be able to become more analytical with the positions principles. Vince needed more than that but is now a well rounded starting linebacker. Tyler Matakevich and L.J. Fort are solid depth options but the issues regarding as to why the now infamous "Jaguar Slaughter" were not due to just a lack of depth.



    Much of this befalls on Butler for implementing a scheme predicated around one player covering every single weakness possible as opposed to using his entire defense with that player being the force multiplier for any given situation.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1

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