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Let Dupree walk!! Target TE Hunter Henry

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by cajunyankee, Feb 11, 2020.

  1. cajunyankee

    cajunyankee Well-Known Member

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    please provide evidence that Henry is not a better blocker than Kelce !!!

    Seeing as I didn’t say Id rather have Henry than Kelce Then how can anyone believe Anything you write after your comment of putting words into someone else’s responses?

    cajun
    <><
     
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  2. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    You and @NY STEELERFAN both have valid points. I would like to add a couple different options as well. I say we try to hang on to Vance and Vannett. Vance has a chemistry with Ben and would be big help for a QB coming off of elbow surgery. Keep Vannett because we already used a 5th on him so I don’t see the point in investing another draft pick for a blocking type, which I feel Vannett is more of than receiver. Not knowing what the 2021 class looks like I’m still willing to take the chance of waiting until then to find our TE for the next 10yrs. The “ experts “ are saying it’s a weak class so I’m going to take their word for it this draft. Unless someone falls in our lap late.

    A couple other ways I think would help address the position not necessarily directly but indirectly is to look for a TE/FB/H back type of versatile player. Those type of guys can usually be had in the 4th or later. He wouldn’t necessarily have to be a great blocker or receiver but a chess piece that can be used in many different ways. Seeing how Nix is hurt a lot we would be able to fill his role as a FB but also TE as well. The versatility would serve as a element of surprise with the defense not ever knowing what the player is going to do. My model for this type of role is Kyle Juszczyk. That’s a nice piece to have for a offense. (cough, cough Degaura)

    My second option would be a jumbo WR. Many of these receiver type TEs are undersized and poor blockers anyway. Why not maximize the receiving potential, albeit a small sacrifice in size,mostly weight though. There are a few guys I have in mind that maybe could be had anywhere between as early as the 2nd or as late as the 6-7th. Some guys to keep a eye on Jauan Jennings (Tenn.) Stephen Sullivan (LSU) and Juwan Johnson (Oregon). These are guys that can threaten the middle of the field,something we’ve been lacking. I’d have to explore any other potential options. These guys automatically pose a legitimate RZ threat if nothing else until they develop further.
    We are lacking a big body type WR and RZ threat.

    Drafting either a TE/FB or a jumbo WR would allow us to keep our current TE depth in place while having a FB with added versatility and hopefully one that is available. Adding another WR especially the type we don’t currently have is never a bad idea either. Just my opinions and some possible options....
     
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  3. Diamond

    Diamond Well-Known Member

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    First of all it's unlikely the chargers are going to let hunter go anywhere, secondly he wont be looking for a 1 or 2 year deal even if he becomes available:

    What is “market value” for Hunter Henry? I went to Spotrac for guidance on that question. Spotrac estimates Henry's value at $8.9m per year (or $1m per year less than Austin Hooper). They project a 4-year, $35.6m contract for him.Jan 15, 2020
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020
  4. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    Yeah that is why I mentioned Gentry cause he is the receiving type but if he fails then what? We kind of had this conversation last year here with a few guys that Grimble was ready and he got hurt leading to us having to scramble to get Vannett. I am not against the wait and see approach like you say and hope that Vance stays healthy and Gentry improves.

    I get what you are saying about a blocking TE and agree less wear on Vance blocking can lead to more snaps for him. One thing is just cause we read they aren't good blockers don't mean they aren't. There are many opinions and sometimes these writers never watched the kid, also they might not have been asked to do it much in college. I will say this I watched one game of Pinkney(not sure which one) and I saw a guy that blocked. I like this class and the ones I did watch I was mostly impressed. Okwuegbunam, Hunter and Harrison Bryant, Trautman, Pinkney, Deguara and Magnifico are guys I have looked at some what. Also interested in Moss(Randy's son), Kmet, Hopkins and Parkinson. Let me say this Hunter Bryant lacks size but he is a Waller type guy, don't line up much next to the tackle but is a receiving thread big time. You mentioned Farrell he might be a guy that falls out of the draft and becomes a FA gem to replace Vannett and I am good with that.
     
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  5. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    It is funny you mention the big WR thing cause man do I like Antonio Gandy-Golden from Libery, 6-4 216 yeah but I just don't see another receiver need here. I know there are different opinions about getting another WR but I like ours and feel we have a nice mix with Juju, JW, DJ and Cain. One last thing no to Johnson that transferred from Penn ST the drops I seen from him scare the crap out of he.....jmo.
     
  6. cajunyankee

    cajunyankee Well-Known Member

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    What will the chargers do? I wouldn’t be at all surprised if they keep Henry.
    What Henry brings to the table he is worth That type of contract! He’s a everydown type player. He’s only issue or problem has been his availability and on that note it seems it takes a serious injury to get him off the field.

    cajun
    <><
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020
  7. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

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    Just don't see a te being drafted this year. Maybe if they let Vannet walk but my opinion is that they fill that void with someone from the scrapheap. I think they keep McDonald & Gentry looks like he was drafted to be a target for Ben.

    Running game with blocking te's? A pipe dream until our, in some posters words, "overpayed feeble qb" is shown the door.
     
  8. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    The problem with AGG is , yes he has the size but has been used strictly as a outside receiver. The guys I mentioned have middle of the field and seam ability much like a TE. I know you don’t like the Johnson but hands can be worked on. He has mammoth size(height and weight) and was a 4 star prospect coming out of HS and when you’re talking 7th round there are going to be holes in a players game. Agreed he hasn’t lived up to his hype yet but got a lot of nice reviews during the Shrine Game practices. The potential is there.Whether it gets unlocked can be the question with almost everyone.

    https://247sports.com/college/orego...-Calvin-Throckmorton-Juwan-Johnson-142194489/

    https://steelersdepot.com/2020/02/2020-nfl-draft-player-profiles-tennessee-wr-jauan-jennings/
     
  9. cajunyankee

    cajunyankee Well-Known Member

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    Nick Vannett is a good Blocking TE! Better than Vance yet not as good as Henry. He is UFA and his price shouldn’t be very high at all! In fact he has very good hands. He isn’t the weapon Vance or Henry can be.

    Here’s something I’ve found and not exactly clear on.... I need help here!!!
    Vance has a contact that’s year by year club option...... it’s 5.5 mil plus 900k bonuses and the Steelers have until March to pick it up ...... If they don’t doesn’t Vance become an UFA and if he signs somewhere else that will add to our Comp pick equation????

    so for an extra 2-3 mil we replace McDonald with Henry AND the comp pick situation is not hurt as bad????

    Can someone shed more light on this ??

    Cajun
    <><
     
  10. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Taken from Steelers Depot.....
    The Steelers also acquired McDonald’s contract when they acquired him, of course, and the 49ers’ deal with him was structured in ways they normally avoid. The contract is essentially structured in a pay-as-you-go format, with each year being an option year. They will have to decide whether or not to pick up his option for 2020 by March 17. He is set to earn $5.5 million in base salary, with another $900,000 in workout and per-game roster bonuses.

    Sounds to me there would be no comp pick if he were to leave because he didn’t play out his contract.
     
  11. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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  12. cajunyankee

    cajunyankee Well-Known Member

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    But is it? It almost sounds like he’s on a series of one year contracts, club option each year, if the Steelers don’t pick it up doesn’t he instantly become a UFA? He wasn’t cut or waived or released.....

    Cajun
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  13. SteelersFanCanada

    SteelersFanCanada Well-Known Member

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    If the Browns put David Njoku up for trade, do the Steelers give him a look? Do the Browns even take their call? Hah .
     
  14. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Not sure but it sounds to me like he’s not actually our property unless we sign him.so losing him wouldn’t net us a pick. That’s how I understand it...
     
  15. Brice

    Brice Well-Known Member

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    If they let him go it will be 1.4mil in dead cap space. Who is out there for under 6 mil to replace him?

    You are probably looking at over 10mil to replace him if you add in the Dead cap space if he is released.
     
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  16. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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    I have looked and can't find a true answer however if the Steelers do not pick up his option then he becomes a FA. Therefore making him eligible for the comp bonus, the thing to understand here is there are only 32 comp picks. The way I understand the process is it would depend on where he signed and how much. Here is what I did find:

    The placement of picks is determined by a proprietary formula based on the player's average annual salary, playing time, and postseason honors with his new team, with salary being the primary factor. So, for example, a team that lost a linebacker who signed for $2.5 million per year in free agency might get a sixth-round compensatory pick, while a team that lost a wide receiver who signed for $5 million per year might receive a fourth-round pick. However, the NFL has never revealed the exact formula used to determine allotment of compensatory picks, though observers from outside the NFL have been able to reverse engineer it to some degree of certainty

    In 2019, the NFL released the compensatory picks on February 22 (nineteen days after the Super Bowl).
     
  17. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Found this....doesn’t look like we’d be getting a comp pick....
    https://steelersdepot.com/2020/01/s...-on-te-vance-mcdonald-now-includes-new-twist/
     
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  18. NY STEELERFAN

    NY STEELERFAN Well-Known Member

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  19. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. I actually read this a week or so ago but figured McDonald was going be a cap casualty anyway,so I didn’t really pay too close attention to the article. Seeing how some of our opinions changed recently I decided to look closer. What really stands out is the fact we can cut him all the way up to the start of the season and still get the cap relief. Not that it would matter too much at that point but at least we would have some money to sign a potential cut from another team. Keeping Vance doesn’t bode well for Dupree. I don’t see where they come up with that extra 5 -6 mil. now.

    A part of me is now wondering if Barron is as good as gone as we expected . If you think about it we had VW already and we still went out and signed Barron. Why all of a sudden would they be comfortable with VW starting and logging so many snaps? UG3 is unproven behind him,so there’s a risk there. Is there a chance Barron stays if we don’t sign Dupree? Barron comes back cheaper? Could we pick up another coverage LB cheaper? IDK. We’re gonna take some hits across the board giving Dupree 16-17mil.....
     
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  20. cajunyankee

    cajunyankee Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, I visit Depot often and missed this one.......

    Really good read, Only 32 comp picks given out and quite a few other teams used this tactic to gain an advantage so closing this loophole might actually help us Since OUR FO never used it!!!!

    Cajun
    <><
     
  21. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    Nice find. Basically they need to keep him. If they don’t find the right guy in the draft the TE room will be a dumpster fire. It typically takes a TE a few years to get in to it even if they draft a good one.

    @thesteeldeal i agree completely that keeping Vance makes it much trickier to tag Dupree.

    Regarding Barron I think he was signed as an insurance policy in case they couldn’t get Devin Bush in the draft, and as a bridge to let him get used to the league. Williams is not terrible as long as they play to his strengths which is stopping the run and blitzing, don’t ask him to do things he can’t do, they’re stuck with his contract now anyway so they have to play him. Barron is as good as gone imo
     
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  22. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    I agree with what you’re saying and I am a VW fan. It’s a part of me feels like maybe they are higher on Barron than most fans. I mean they were stuck with VWs contract last year as well and he didn’t play very often. I know there was a adjustment period and learning curve with Bush, maybe they aren’t comfortable with Bush’s coverage and that’s what he will be asked to do mostly if VW is the full time thumper. In the end you’re probably right and if I had to say myself I would say Barron is gone. To me it hinges on what they do with Dupree. If they don’t bring him back I could see them hanging on to Barron. Just a feeling I have that at that point it might not be as cut and dry as we think...jmo
     
  23. cajunyankee

    cajunyankee Well-Known Member

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    I totally agree. Barron wasn’t horrible last year and will only get better with a better understanding of the defense and working with his fellow defenders. As you say UG3 shows promise but is still unproven. VW is proven but now has a reduced role so is his contract too large for what they ask of him?

    I really don’t see them keeping Dupree now. Getting Hunter Henry to add to the offense and keeping McDonald would Seriously Strengthen our Offense and Help Ben but is that a luxury we really go after or even afford??

    I don’t see it happening But Man would I love to see it!!!!

    Cajun
    <><
     
  24. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    Bush is going to be the man this year.

    Re Barron they need the cap space to re-sign Feiler, Hilton, Banner and the rookie class. It’s not like they’ll have a lot to spare even if they let Dupree go, and they’ll also need a replace the OLB remember. If there is anything left over use it on a veteran running back unless they feel Snell is ready for a big step forward.

    I do agree Barron is not as terrible as many make out and he played a lot of snaps last year but he is too expensive for me.
     
  25. thesteeldeal

    thesteeldeal Well-Known Member

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    I agree the chances of Barron remaining are slim. I still think there’s a small chance though....jmo.
    If they can’t keep Barron for 6mil and bring those guys back there no way they can sign Dupree for 16mil. Which I’m fine with. I definitely feel we need Hilton,Feiler,Finney and Vance back so whatever they need to do to make that happen...make it happen. Like I said though under your scenario of keeping those guys, how can they afford Dupree at all? I don’t see it. You’re talking cutting 5-6 players, who then will have to be replaced at a cost as well. I’m not so much questioning you. I’m trying to rationalize it in my own head. I just don’t see Dupree back under those circumstances.
     

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