It's not Ben and the offense!

One could argue that the offense had chances to end the game and didn't

 

Well the run game has been a little enemic before last week

 

Both the offence and defence have left a lot to be desired. Seriously, neither side of the ball has been flawless and anyone who says different is fooling themselves. We score far too many FG's and not enough TD's. I don't care whether it's the fault of WR's or Ben, it's all on the offence. Ben has made some bad throws this season, and the WR's have had too many drops. Our defence has given up too many points in the 4th quarter, like always.

Both sides need to get better if we want a serious shot at making a run this year.

 

There's 2 stats I care about, points for and points against. We are far from #1 in either category, and we've faced some pretty weak competition so far this year, so as far as I'm concerned both sides of the ball need to get better, a lot better.

 

I wouldn't say the offence has done enough. 19 points against Denver is not enough to get it done in the new NFL. Even against weak teams, 19 points is just not enough. 16 points against Philly is unacceptable, even though we won that game. We have to score more points, especially when their defence has been subpar this year. 23 points against a horrible Titans team isn't enough either. When we play bad teams, we need to score 30+ points. It's not the 90's anymore, the game has changed. 23 points isn't a lot anymore, especially against weak teams like that. 24 points against a division Rival is decent, but we left so many points on the field. It was another game of too many FG's and not enough TD's. Now I'm not blaming any specific player, but the offence as a whole still leaves a lot to be desired.

Now don't get me wrong, so does the defence, but I haven't seen anyone in this thread defending the defence.

 

Another reason people need to really be piling it on the D is because we are keeping them off the field! It's not like it used to be where we had a lot of 3 and outs or didn't do a good job on time of possession. We are giving them more than half the game to just sit there and watch. Haley has designed a great weapon if the players will execute it correctly. Imagine when Troy and James were in their prime if we would have had an offense like we have now that can dominate time of possession and keep Troy and James fresh! There would be qb's getting carted off left and right! We would be talking dynasty again. Me and Tomlin are correct as usual about the offense. LOL.The O is the best thing going for us this year.

 

Yep! Only 16 ranks to go!

 

It's debatable if Ben is having an MVP season. At this point, I don't see how that's the case when Ben and the offense didn't deliver when they had the opportunity to win games in the losses.

The defense gave up 4th QT leads. My understanding of the situation is the game isn't over until the clock hits zero. It's also my understanding that the offense needs to score as many points as necessary to win games. In any event, let me refresh your memory of the circumstances of those games that were loss.

In the 4th QT of the Denver game the defense did a good job holding the Broncos to a FG as oppose to allowing a TD. This made the game Den 25 Pit 19. There were 3 minutes left on the clock and Pitt needed to score a TD to win the game. Ben threw the game sealing INT. The offense had a chance to win the game and didn't deliver. A lot of that certainly falls on the shoulders of the QB.

The offense scored 0 points in the 4th QT vs Oakland (I didn't realize this until I looked it up). The game was tied 31 to 31 when the Steelers offense received the ball with over 6 mins remaining on the clock in the 4th QT. The offense failed to move the ball or run enough time off the clock. As a result, the Steelers gave the ball back to Oak with 1:43 remaining. Palmer lead his team down the field to score the game winning FG. Palmer got the job done in crunch time. Shouldn't fans expect the same from Ben in crunch time? The offense and the defense failed to do their jobs in crunch time.

The offense gave Suisham an opportunity to kick a 54 FG vs the Titans. Hardly a makeable FG but one the coaches thought Suisham could make based on the 52 yd FG he made earlier in the game. You think the offense could had gotten the ball a little closer for Suisham? The Titans received the ball on the 45. Steelers defense failed to stop Hassleback from giving his kicker a chance to kick a 45 yd FG. Offense, defense, and special teams failed at their jobs in crunch time. But hey, you can continue to believe the offense is absolved from any blame. Even when Ben admits to not getting the job done himself in those circumstances. The defense and special teams deserve some blame for the losses.

 

The AB fumble in Oakland was a killer. The problem with that game was not offensive DESIGN but offensive EXECUTION. In the Titans game I don't see how you can put that on the offense as much as you can the D. Ike and Keenan looked like high school players in that game. IF this offense had capitalized on all the opportunities they should have we would have a much better record. We've left points on the field in EVERY game this year. Haley has designed a great scheme for us to be VERY successful and probably even as successful as we were in the 70s. We have the talent at the skill positions if they will just step up and play like it. I say next year is when we will see what we can truly do. This offense has more potential than any unit we've put on the field in a VERY long time.

 

we won't see the full potential until the line is fixed.

 

The line has slowed our offence a bit for sure, but some bad throws by Ben and bad drops by the WR's have killed us more. Execution is hurting us more right now than a lack of talent on the Oline.

 

No, it's not even remotely debatable, definitely having an MVP season. He's thrown 3 interceptions this year, I'll say that again, 3 interceptions. Do you expect a QB to never throw an interception? Because he can't improve too much on that. He also has a 98.6 QB rating and ranked 5th in the league, thats better then Brees, Eli and even Brady.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but no QB is going to drive for a wining score every time they get a chance but I'll refresh your memory that Ben has 21 fourth qtr comebacks and 28 game winning drives, that's more winning drives then any current QB not named Brad and Peyton. But hey, if your expectations are such that he should do it every time, then yep, he's failing.

Seriously? You're going to bring up the Raiders game? You're going there? 31 points, defense sucked, nuff said.

Poor coaching and more poor defense cost us the Titans game.

I'll keep drilling it into you guys until you get it, 47 4th qtr points SUCKS! When the offense hands the lead to the defense in the 4th qtr, it's the defenses job to hold it or are they responsible for nothing?[/quote:871nnm51]

Of course they're responsible, just as responsible as the offence. I don't think anyone in here is saying the defence doesn't deserve blame. He'll, I've been blasting the defence this year, but the offence is also responsible for our current place in the standings. The defence isn't always going to hold the other team. The other team gets paid to make plays as well. We need TD's instead of FG's. We haven't been very good in that department, and until that improves, the offence deserves some of the blame.

As for Ben being in the MVP conversation, he's not quite in that category. Sure, he hasn't thrown many INT's, but he's trailing in yards and TD's. Rodgers has only thrown 1 more INT but has 8 more TD's. That's a huge amount after only 7 weeks, especially when considering Rodgers started slow and looks to be back on track now. Brees is also having a great year and is right up there with Rodgers as the early favourite for MVP (at least for QB's). Plus Eli and Brady have quite a bit more yards and slightly more TD's.

Ben is having a great year, and if he picks it up perhaps he'll be in that conversation, but he's not there right now, the stats just don't support it.

 

Of course they're responsible, just as responsible as the offence. I don't think anyone in here is saying the defence doesn't deserve blame. He'll, I've been blasting the defence this year, but the offence is also responsible for our current place in the standings. The defence isn't always going to hold the other team. The other team gets paid to make plays as well. We need TD's instead of FG's. We haven't been very good in that department, and until that improves, the offence deserves some of the blame.

As for Ben being in the MVP conversation, he's not quite in that category. Sure, he hasn't thrown many INT's, but he's trailing in yards and TD's. Rodgers has only thrown 1 more INT but has 8 more TD's. That's a huge amount after only 7 weeks, especially when considering Rodgers started slow and looks to be back on track now. Brees is also having a great year and is right up there with Rodgers as the early favourite for MVP (at least for QB's). Plus Eli and Brady have quite a bit more yards and slightly more TD's.

Ben is having a great year, and if he picks it up perhaps he'll be in that conversation, but he's not there right now, the stats just don't support it.[/quote:c8fv72di]

LOL, that's hysterical that you don't even think he's in the conversation, not that he is MVP but that he doesn't even deserve consideration. He's currently ranked 5th in the league but hey, not in the discussion. And I already said that I feel the offense can improve but lets approach this a different way, if you had to pick one that is more responsible for our record, which would it be?[/quote:c8fv72di]
The best stat Ben has going for him as far as I'm concerned is the fact that he's the best in the league on 3rd down. THAT is the money down in football. Brees is throwing a lot of picks and his team is losing also. Mike Wallace with 7 drops in one game doesn't help Ben's numbers either. Antonio dropping a touchdown doesn't help him either. Mike Wallace dropping that tipped ball in the end zone doesn't help either. If you look at the TDs that Ben's guys have dropped he would be much closer to Rodgers in that aspect. Also Tomlin didn't say that Ben WAS the the MVP but that he was having and "MVP type SEASON" which is true. It's not his first one either. In 07 Ben would've been the mvp hands down if Brady didn't go completely Jedi on everybody and throw 50 tds.

 

Turnovers are always killers. Even with that mistakebthe team had the opportunity to win the game.

Whether losses fall on offense, defense, or special teams none the units did enough to win the games that were loss.

 

No, it's not even remotely debatable, definitely having an MVP season. He's thrown 3 interceptions this year, I'll say that again, 3 interceptions. Do you expect a QB to never throw an interception? Because he can't improve too much on that. He also has a 98.6 QB rating and ranked 5th in the league, thats better then Brees, Eli and even Brady.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but no QB is going to drive for a wining score every time they get a chance but I'll refresh your memory that Ben has 21 fourth qtr comebacks and 28 game winning drives, that's more winning drives then any current QB not named Brady and Peyton. But hey, if your expectations are such that he should do it every time, then yep, he's failing.

Seriously? You're going to bring up the Raiders game? You're going there? 31 points, defense sucked, nuff said.

Poor coaching and more poor defense cost us the Titans game.

I'll keep drilling it into you guys until you get it, 47 4th qtr points SUCKS! When the offense hands the lead to the defense in the 4th qtr, it's the defenses job to hold it or are they responsible for nothing?[/quote:1h491cw0]
If Ben's having an MVP season then he should win mvp, correct? mvp doesnt boil down to qb rating and ints. Bens not putting up monster stats and steelers are 3-3. He's not the mvp because there are qbs with better stats and qbs teams that have better records. We will see what happens going forward.

My bubbles not busted. If were gonna play by your rules in rregarding Ben getting done at the end of the 4th qt then shouldn't the same rules apply to defense? Especially considering offenses have a clear advantage over defenses. You made my point that the offense failed yourself by stating no qb is going to drive down the field everytime. Yes, the expectation is that the offense should be able to drive down the field to win a game if necessary. The expectation is that the defense should be able to stop a team from scoring when necessary (this is becoming more difficult due to the rules that favor offenses). Oh Ben delivers in crunch time on 3rd downs but not when it mattered most in the final mins of the 4th qt. Go figure.

The defense sucked vs the raiders and so did the offense in the 4th qt and when it mattered most. Ben plays a role in the wins and losses. Fans like to give Ben most of the credit when the team wins but absolve him of his role when the the team losses.. Ben certainly didn't have mVP performances when it mattered most in the 4th QT.

 

Of course they're responsible, just as responsible as the offence. I don't think anyone in here is saying the defence doesn't deserve blame. He'll, I've been blasting the defence this year, but the offence is also responsible for our current place in the standings. The defence isn't always going to hold the other team. The other team gets paid to make plays as well. We need TD's instead of FG's. We haven't been very good in that department, and until that improves, the offence deserves some of the blame.

As for Ben being in the MVP conversation, he's not quite in that category. Sure, he hasn't thrown many INT's, but he's trailing in yards and TD's. Rodgers has only thrown 1 more INT but has 8 more TD's. That's a huge amount after only 7 weeks, especially when considering Rodgers started slow and looks to be back on track now. Brees is also having a great year and is right up there with Rodgers as the early favourite for MVP (at least for QB's). Plus Eli and Brady have quite a bit more yards and slightly more TD's.

Ben is having a great year, and if he picks it up perhaps he'll be in that conversation, but he's not there right now, the stats just don't support it.[/quote:1783mfaj]

LOL, that's hysterical that you don't even think he's in the conversation, not that he is MVP but that he doesn't even deserve consideration. He's currently ranked 5th in the league but hey, not in the discussion. And I already said that I feel the offense can improve but lets approach this a different way, if you had to pick one that is more responsible for our record, which would it be?[/quote:1783mfaj]

Im with you 100%! I think Ben is having a remarkable year. I love Haley's game plan- its working against opposing d's and its keeping Ben upright. Im not too worried about the run game. We have had a different starting RB in at least three games this year. Dwyer did great on Sunday night and Mendy should be coming back soon.

Having said that, I love what the D did against the Bengals- hope they can keep it up because the prior games were horrendous!

 

No, it's not even remotely debatable, definitely having an MVP season. He's thrown 3 interceptions this year, I'll say that again, 3 interceptions. Do you expect a QB to never throw an interception? Because he can't improve too much on that. He also has a 98.6 QB rating and ranked 5th in the league, thats better then Brees, Eli and even Brady.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but no QB is going to drive for a wining score every time they get a chance but I'll refresh your memory that Ben has 21 fourth qtr comebacks and 28 game winning drives, that's more winning drives then any current QB not named Brady and Peyton. But hey, if your expectations are such that he should do it every time, then yep, he's failing.

Seriously? You're going to bring up the Raiders game? You're going there? 31 points, defense sucked, nuff said.

Poor coaching and more poor defense cost us the Titans game.

I'll keep drilling it into you guys until you get it, 47 4th qtr points SUCKS! When the offense hands the lead to the defense in the 4th qtr, it's the defenses job to hold it or are they responsible for nothing?[/quote:3cwa8qt7]
If Ben's having an MVP season then he should win mvp, correct? mvp doesnt boil down to qb rating and ints. Bens not putting up monster stats and steelers are 3-3. He's not the mvp because there are qbs with better stats and qbs teams that have better records. We will see what happens going forward.

My bubbles not busted. If were gonna play by your rules in rregarding Ben getting done at the end of the 4th qt then shouldn't the same rules apply to defense? Especially considering offenses have a clear advantage over defenses. You made my point that the offense failed yourself by stating no qb is going to drive down the field everytime. Yes, the expectation is that the offense should be able to drive down the field to win a game if necessary. The expectation is that the defense should be able to stop a team from scoring when necessary (this is becoming more difficult due to the rules that favor offenses). Oh Ben delivers in crunch time on 3rd downs but not when it mattered most in the final mins of the 4th qt. Go figure.

The defense sucked vs the raiders and so did the offense in the 4th qt and when it mattered most. Ben plays a role in the wins and losses. Fans like to give Ben most of the credit when the team wins but absolve him of his role when the the team losses.. Ben certainly didn't have mVP performances when it mattered most in the 4th QT.

 

Damn, and i thought it was more than obvious that it was our defense that has been the issue this season.