Interesting comments from Chris Carter on Mike and Mike

i don't know if we game plan vs the opponents , but i know for sure a lot of opponents had a good game plan against the steelers ...

 

Again Bill might have perfected some techniques the Pats were hardly the only team trying to gain an edge.

From the internets and therefore absolutely true:

2. The Dolphins bought game tapes of the Patriots to study Tom Brady's audibles before a MNF game in Dec 2006. Zach Thomas admitted to knowing all Brady's signals from the tape study. The league ruled that such tape study is okay.

3. Denver Broncos coach Mike Shanahan admitted in 2002 to hiring lip readers to steal signals. He bragged that his lipreaders could get all the signals by the end of the 1st half, sometimes by the end of the 1st quarter.

4. The Jets were accused of cheating by calling illegal audibles in a game against the Ravens. Brian Billick said that the illegal audibles by the Jets resulted in 3 offside penalties.

Being the detail obsessed jerk that he is Belichek isn't going to let someone else out do him on the intelligence front.

 

I don't think Belichek does anything drastically different than other coaches, it's just that he appears to pay extreme attention to even the smallest details. I remember reading last year how before the Pats/Texans game, the Pats mimicked JJ Watt in practice by holding items up in front of Brady and he had to try to throw around or over them. Tiny details like that can make a big difference. It's also no shock that the Pats kept JJ Watt in check that game and beat them easily.

Belichek is a huge scheme guy whereas Tomlin has admitted he isn't.

 

I do agree that Belichek isn't doing anything planning or spying wise that isn't done all over. It is just his attention to detail that makes him better at it that most other coaches.

 

it also helps when you know what the other team is getting ready to do on Offense or Defense
Just ask the guy from Houston

 

But I think the point that 12to88 is making is that BB is willing to go beyond the pale of what is acceptable or "I'll give this spying thing a try" and makes it a more calculated approach to how he plans for a game. Who knows, but one thing Spygate revealed was how detailed the Patriots got and we will never really know how detailed it may have been because the Fuhrer (excuse me Goodell) confiscated the tapes.

Anyway - to some extent it even accentuates BB's coaching credentials even more because you recognize how much the guy is thinking about everything. I mean you know the old saying "If you ain't cheating, you're not really trying!"

 

The Big Three take a lot of heat around here, but maybe our quality control group is lacking? Aren't they the ones who study tendencies in other teams? If our scouting staff is terrible then we have terrible drafts and FA signings, if our QC staff is bad, then our gameplans may also be bad and based on flawed information.

 

I might be wrong about this because I've never been around a football program but I thought the QA group's job was to break down tape into plays and group them by down and distance. I thought tendencies were done by position coaches.

 

I think you're correct.

 

Hang on, I think I'm missing something here.

Is all of this discussion based on what Brady said in an interview? He mentioned they had a gameplan, and that means that we don't?

Not sure I follow.

 

Uh yea, I came to respond to the initial question asked and so far all ive read about is the Pat's , Brady, and Bellichek. But oh well continue on. I actually enjoyed reading the debate above.

 

If you think the Pats still had illegal tape of a 2001 walk through in 2007 then I suspect there is no reasoning with you. Bill might be crooked but he isn't stupid. Anything that damning would have been destroyed as soon as possible.

 

LOL! Actually, the purpose of my post was to stimulate discussion on how much the Steelers actually integrate strategy and scheme into their gameplan. I am of the belief, and Tomlin's own words seem to confirm it, that Tomlin is not very strong when it comes to a) identifying an opponent's weaknesses and tendencies and b) designing a scheme and a gameplan specifically designed to exploit those. Just interested in everyone's thoughts on that. It's turned into a "who's greater, Brady or Belichick?", thread though.

 

Based on watching the Steelers and what Tomlin himself has said, he seems to be of the opinion that we're going to line up and do what we do and were going to make the other team stop us, regardless of the strengths and weaknesses of the other team. He doesn't seem to be a big scheme guy. We have our game plan and it doesn't seem to change a whole lot.

The Patriots seem to be the complete opposite. They drastically alter their game plan every week it seems. They even go as far as to bench or not dress certain players based on what they want to do that week (obviously not their top players).

 

Remember Belichick spent 5 years as HC in Cleveland without Brady. He was 36-44.

 

As for how Belichick will do after Brady, I wouldn't be surprised that they follow each other into retirement.

 

Gotcha.

In some ways, I think Tomlin and all of the Steelers play to that "we're not scheming" front. Of course there will be the same amount of planning that most teams do. It's like it's our "thing", in a way - we've got the gunslinging QB, the maverick SS, and we used to have the violent madman at LB.

But I also wish in a way that, if that's our PR face, then we would go out and out for it on the field as well. If we're going to be a 'fundamentals' team, then go with a reduced playbook and execute those plays better than anyone else. Run no-huddle as much as possible. At the moment we seem to be trying to do a few too many things at once. Kind of like what destroyed Kordell Stewart's career.

 

Ssh! Nobody must remember the Cleveland days.

In the same way, to be fair, that nobody must remember Lebeau's record as a HC.

 

f$$%% the patroits they are cheaters and every victory including super bowls should have asterisks the guys get caught cheating and even on this message board gets props give me a break.we are going to lose a draft pick for something far less egregious than spying on other teams plus a fine once again i say F@#$ the CHEATRIOTS and their tainted legacy that is all

 

It saddens me to say this, Bill is
head and
shoulders way better than MT
Not even close. And when TB retires and if Bill is still coaching he will still be successful.You see, I hate the Pats and Ravens
more than any other teams in the NFL. Because I feel they stand in the way of Steeler success.

 

Maybe he had them and no one has come forward to talk about it after all this time. Although I tend to believe big secrets don't last long..people want to talk especially when they might get a payday for it. I have no idea what he had, he can't prove it if he didn't and wouldn't admit it if he had so I don't imagine we will ever know.