How does Mike Tomlin compare to other NFL head coaches? There's no doubt the standard has fallen.

You asked I answered

See isn’t it nice to learn about football

 

I agree Mahomes has a team friendly deal until you compare it to the super model’s wife (you see what I did there).

 

You original comment is dead wrong

 

You said something ignorant I fixed it

 

Some people are slow learners I’m sure you are doing your best

 

As Scribe says if you can’t defend your post attack the poster

Pathetic

 

This. Plus passer rating means nothing....it's farce....this is the biggest example: Trubisky’s had a better passing rating last year then Ben had His last year.
Ben Roethlisberger 9-7 ...22 tds, and 10 ints
Mitch Trubisky
2-3 ....4 tds, and 5 ints..
Thats all You need to know about Qbs passer rating. It's a joke...., but people hang onto it trying to make a point that's not there.
Also .....How did Ben have a worse passer rating then P. Manning when He won His last SB....Manning had no TDs, 1nt, and 1 fumble???
Nobody can answer the 1st , or 2nd question....why ...because it's a stupid made up stat.

 

Ok so you are saying Ben was the second worst quarterback to win a super bowl ahead of Manning

Ok I’ll concede to your wisdom and we can put this debate to rest

 

No....I'm saying Qb passing rating is a farce. Explain the other part of what I said.
Trubisky 2-3 win loss ....4 tds, and 5ints..last year had a better Qb rating than Ben's last year 9-7 win loss...22 tds, and 10 ints. Until someone can make that make sense to Me ....that rating/stat is bogus, useless, and stupid.

 

Incompetent, irrelevant and immaterial

- Perry Mason

 

And who is the head of the **** show with all this blame to go around? At what point does the blame fall on the HC? 15 years of no playoff success? 20?

 

You repeating it in every thread isn't going to change anything .

 

Just keep repeating yourself if it gets you attention and that is what you need

 

I'll give your off-season snark level an A++. You're in mid-season form!

 

Maybe I should’ve been more specific with my question, but I was asking how those disappointments were Tomlin’s fault?

The 2011 team went 12-4 but lost to Tebow in the playoffs. How was it Tomlin’s fault that Ben got outplayed by Tebow? How was it Tomlin’s fault that an offense with Ben, AB, Mike Wallace, E-Saunders, Hines Ward, Heath Miller, and etc only scored 6 points in the first half? Was Tomlin supposed to bench Ben? Was he supposed to take over the play calling during that game? How was it Tomlin’s fault that Lebeau’s #1 defense were shredded by a Tebow offense? Was Tomlin suppose to take the game over from Lebeau when things weren’t going right?

2014- They finished 11-5 won the division and lost to an evenly matched ravens team in the playoffs mainly due to no running game and Ben being outplayed by Flacco.

2017- Very disappointing. Team went 13-3 and won the division. They were top 10 on both sides of the ball but laid an egg in the playoffs. Was that on Tomlin tho? Was it Tomlin’s fault that Ben came out flat and got outplayed once again? Ben had 2 terrible first half turnovers that led directly to 14 points. He had a fumble retuned for a TD and he threw a bad pic inside of his own 20 that led to a jax TD. The Steelers also had a bad play call on a 4th and 1 that was basically another turnover. Again, very disappointing loss that I don’t say that Tomlin is blameless for but I put it mostly on Ben because it was the offense that came out flat and gave Jax momentum. You say that they were out coached in that game but didn’t explain how.

After 2018 it should’ve been obvious that the decision to transform into a pass-1st offensive team built around Ben was a mistake. The team never contended led by Ben without a dominant defense.

2020-Ben throws 3 first half picks and puts the team in a hole. I need an explanation on how that was Tomlin’s fault. Or how that was due to poor preparation.

I don’t disagree that the second half of Ben’s career was disappointing and can understand how it felt like the team underachieved. I disagree that Tomlin is the valid scapegoat. It’s more on the organization as a whole and the decision to treat Ben like a “franchise QB”. Ben simply didn’t play up to that standard when it mattered most and the team suffered because of it. Ben was consistently outplayed by the opposing qb in the playoffs. If you look at his career playoff stats they’re average. Somebody with more time could compile his playoff stats post 2010 and they’d probably find that they’re below average. Even in his 2 SB wins, the team was super reliant on Ben. Both teams featured a dominant defense that asked Ben and the offense to do just enough.

This is why I’m so excited about this post-Ben rebuild/reload. Personally, I kinda checked out as a fan after 2017 partly due to Shazier’s injury but mainly because I lost faith in Ben and knew that without a dominant defense he wasn’t going to lead the team to contention as “the man”.

Now we can get back to the fundamentals. Steeler football. Complimentary physical football featuring a dominant defense and running game. Let’s see if Tomlin can reload with a solid core that will create another 5-6 window where where the team is good enough around the QB to contend without a “franchise” guy.

 

I think you said it without saying it quite a bit. Tomlin’s teams often came out flat and complacent on defence - his “supposed” specialty as a player in college and a coach before arriving in Pittsburgh. Especially the defensive backfield - our traditional weakest part of the D.

Often it felt like the Steelers only played one of the two halves well. Against Jax they had a great 2nd half and put up 41 points if I remember correctly. You gotta win that game with that point total against Blake Bortals. Even if Ben threw some maddening picks, as he was always accustomed to do (1-3 pregame) as a late career gunslinger. The defense was FLAT a lot with and without Shazier; even though that was a giant loss for the team chemistry. Tomlin never looses his teams ear which is an asset, but they often seem to feel they can coast and at some point put their foot on the gas resulting in too little too late.

And let’s not talk about his game planning, 4th quarter time management, and wicked bad challenges in crucial moments. It’s almost universally accepted he suffers there. He is accused of letting the inmates run the asylum a bit and often too much of a “players coach” whatever exactly that means. And maybe that’s where you could link your criticisms of Ben to Tomlin. Name a good quality coach that came out from under Tomlin’s wing? Some came to him already good and coached up well, but they all left for either greener pastures of flamed out.

It’s him being a general or lack there of that people question.

It’s not like baseball, Ben didn’t play against Tebow (or Bortals), our lackluster defense did - Tomlin’s “specialty”.

 

You didn’t even address my points. You just posted more random Tomlin hate. Lebeau gets all the credit for the legendary defenses while he was coordinating but none of the blame for the let downs huh?

Tomlin isn't beyond reproach and there’s certainly times to criticize and nitpick. The bottomline tho, the underachieving during Ben’s second half of his career was mainly due to him not playing up to the hype as a “franchise QB” when it mattered most in the playoffs. He got outplayed by Bortles, Mayfield, Flacco, and etc at a time the team was built around him and the offense, not the defense. A decision that was over Tomlin’s head. Scapegoating coach for that isn’t valid.

 

My point to the original comment was the Steelers don’t win the super bowl in 2005 without Ben. Every acts like the team carried him which is complete BS

 

You are to stupid to have a conversation with. You said Ben gets zero credit for the 2005 ring. He is a major reason they were in the game. If the Steelers didn’t draft Ben they would have 4 rings.

 

Here is your original ignorant post since you have a bad memory. This is complete BS. They don’t win the super bowl in 2005 without Ben. Why don’t you ask the Bus about that

 

No

Actually I didn’t say that

Learn to read while you are still in school

 

I like how you keep putting quotes over franchise. If you are saying Ben didn’t get LOTS of justified flack then you might have very selective hearing/reading. I even just said he was good for 1-3 maddening picks. Every GREAT franchise QB’s skills decline. That’s why every one except for Ben has eventually been shipped off to another team. I love that the Steelers kept Ben, but most of us admit it was a year or two too long.

I don’t know tangible evidence you are asking anyone to prove about Tomlin; did he have to trip over his playbook like Mr. Magoo? Watching his teams with a good knowledge of the game should be enough. The sample size is quite large.

And yes, Lebeau did get criticized, not sure where you were. That’s why he was shipped off and once he left Tomlin has never made a better defense than the bulk of Labeau’s from his second stint here. People look at Lebuea’s entire run. Fans KILLED Ariens and his batch formation and deep air attack his last two years and he went on and enhanced his career and legacy big time. In short - THEY all get criticized and usually justifiably.

Give me some type of the concrete example from any other coach that was correctly criticized in the realm of what you are searching for and I think you’ll get plenty of people dropping examples fitting Tomlin.

 

Agree with this. No way do the Steelers beat the Bengals, Colts and Broncos in succession without Roethlisberger in '05. That was a helluva run regardless of the sub par Super Bowl performance.

 

You basically said Ben is as incompetent as Tomlin. Which means your IQ is about the same as Ben’s QB rating in the 2005 super bowl

 

No

Actually I didn’t say that either

Learn to read don’t post bull****

And don’t get into a pissing match about IQ with internet strangers

There is always someone smarter bigger faster and richer

Your probably bigger and faster I’ll give you that