Hackett

My Friend how do We explain the totally different way We play Lamar on D compared to How we run D on Burrow???.....If not Xs, and Os.....or for very recently the change for Carolina???

 

Who was available when Cowher left? It's always going to be a crapshoot, Tony Dungy rose through the Steeler ranks very young, became our DC, then bounced around a few years before he got his shot. Right now there are 3...and likely more openings by the end of the year. If Tomlin would step down because he just felt it was time (unlikely) do you not think the Steelers job would be one of the best opportunities out there? I don't have names in front of me, but there are a host of people that would salivate getting an opportunity here, and given the last 2 we hired I think it would be likely a young, somewhat surprising choice found during the interview process.

 

My biggest problem with Him has been discipline....but I've watched it become lax across all teams including Belichick teams, and I'm wondering how much control they really have anymore about that type of stuff in general.

 

the people who keep asking “name a replacement”. There’s one in this thread.

 

If You hate Tomlin....how do You love Payton????
This baffles Me???
Answer please

 

So a play is called. It is designed to get the ball to DJ. Pickens man falls down. In your opinion don’t let the defense dictate what you do. Therefore the ball goes to DJ.

 

Chuck Noll was king of discipline.

Bill Cowher didn't need to control it.

Mike Tomlin doesn't know how to reinvent it.

That's society these days.

 

I don’t care if the next coach is better or worse. It just needs to be a different coach. Tomlin will not win another Super Bowl ever. Since I know this that means it is time to move on. If the next guy is worse we don’t need 20 years of crap we need to turnover the coaches faster. No we shouldn’t fire a coach ever year but a lifetime contract is just as bad.

 

I'm starting to believe this is true.

 

Wait did You mean to actually say You don't care if they are worse, or did You mistype that???

 

I want someone different. I don’t care who. If the next coach is worse I assume we would fire him relatively quickly. Tomlin seems to be good enough to not get fired. Which apparently is a 500 team that either misses the playoffs or gets destroyed in the wild card round.

 

You know this is the Steelers. If they signed a Guy....more than likely they would be here until the contract plays out....no matter what. So You better hope they aren't worse.

 

Pretend next season we have a new coach. I will go into the season wondering what will happen and anything is possible good or bad. If Tomlin is there next season I know we will be 500 and suck. Therefore literally anyone would be better.

 

People are clueless. We hire another coach it's for 5 years minimum.

 

Exactly. It's pretty much how They/We roll. I actually like it that way. I think many teams get to antsy, and make poor decisions.

 

Honestly, this is a terrible analysis and just seems like cranky old man bias. And I'm 59, so I know what old man bias is. The Steelers don't have more discipline issues than other teams...they have less. Tomlin might be a "players coach" to the media and fans...but the man carries authority and commands respect. I have been the leader of an organization for many years. I know how wrong judgment from outside can be and how ignorant people sound to those on the inside.

 

That's a false dichotomy.

 

I'm trying to wrap my head around it. He claims Tomlin will never get to another SB but, is okay with getting a coach who is worse......what's worse than never getting to the SB?

 

I agree with what you’re saying. It’s not a good thing though for the future of our franchise that the best coaching jobs he’s done since 2010 is taking weaker Steelers teams to .500 records. The 2013 season that was marred with injury started 2-6 went 8-8. We all suffered the Deer and Duck season to .500. And this year we’re on the verge of .500 after starting 2-6 and benching our starter for a rookie.

The players play for him, that’s for sure. I just don’t know if that’s enough in today’s NFL. Lots of young talent to contend with, and those guys bring more than just being a great player’s coach. I think the only way it can truly work is if you have 2 ultra-talented coordinators, and if we want to get back to contention we will need to up our game in that department.

 

I'm not a Tomlin hater. I personally like the man. I think he has a great deal of integrity, and he appreciates the job he has and the legacy and history it represents. Those qualities don't win football games, I know. And I wish he would tighten his ship up a bit. Some of the stunts these guys pull like Edmunds running into the end zone and drawing a personal foul should never happen. Or Allen's bone headed stunt against Carolina. Those things lose games, it should be dealt with. That said, as others have pointed out, this team never fails to play hard for the guy. There is something to be said for that.

All that said, make no mistake about it. These next two drafts and free agency periods are by far the most important of his career. This team needs an influx of studs at a number of positions if it is going to challenge Cincy and Baltimore for the division title. I honestly think these two areas have been his undoing over the last 10 years, particularly his drafting of secondary players. The second thing is the choices he has made for his coordinators and position coaches. He needs younger, cutting-edge minds that have a handle on these modern offenses. No more retreads or promotions from within because assistants have put their time in, like Butler and Austin. Cowher was never afraid to can coordinators or assistants if he felt they weren't getting the job done. He had his warts too, like being stubborn at times, but he generally surrounded himself with pretty good coaching staffs.

 

Oh I’m a Tomlin detractor and believe this entirely. We don’t have a specific “culture or discipline” issue that sticks out in this league. We are middle of the pack, and probably on the good side of that. The players love and respect Tomlin like a father figure. That part is wholly true, and it’s Tomlin’s greatest asset. The problem is that it’s all that Tomlin brings to the table… is that good enough in today’s NFL?

If we stick with Tomlin we NEED to have high-end coordinators around him. Use Tomlin’s greatest strength and supplement his weaknesses.

 

That's fair.

 

I think there's a lot of valid points in saying keep Tomlin or let Tomlin go and so on. Personally, this season and 2019 are Tomlin's best two years of coaching. This team could've tossed in the proverbial town earlier in the season and didn't. Tomlin's biggest strength carries a ton of weight I think and that it's his message really doesn't get stale and his team just battles for him. It means a ton to the saltiest of veterans like a Cam Heyward to the rooks like George Pickens to not be Tomlin's first losing roster. That sense of pride the roster has is a great character trait and that stems from having a coach like Tomlin. This team could've easily thrown in the towel at 2-6. I'm really not a fan of how any of the three QB's were handled this past offseason, preseason nor the regular season.

I think Khan, Weidle and Tomlin need to get together after the season and really dig in on what the roster & staff needs to look like next year and beyond (I'm sure this happens at the end of every season, but this one just feels a bit more paramount than usual, probably because of the change in the front office). They need upgrades at all three coordinator positions. The only coach that I feel should be safe going into '23 is the OL Coach Pat Meyer. I'm not against bringing back any of the other assistant coaches, but I'm not opposed to letting them walk either.

 

Agree.

I also think the “this would never happen under Cowher” is overplayed. There were plenty of discipline issues under his tenure.

 

I don’t disagree on needing a fresh take. But I’m still not sure results on the field show specifically that Tomlin isn’t an X’s and O’s guy. There are multiple reasons for poor performances visible on the field, not all about scheme or design (though some for sure).

Im also not sure about the blowout claim… 2020 we had games winning 38-7, 36-10, 27-3. The lack of big wins is more due to the QB position imo.