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Creating a new offense to beat the Chiefs

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by SDOT, Jan 11, 2022 at 11:44 PM.

  1. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    Do you even pay attention to what anyone else says? You twist everything someone says to fit your argument instead of taking people at their word for what they say. I was addressing your statement that he has neglected the run game his entire tenure....which is flat out false (as exemplified by post season awards for players on the roster, rush attempts, and drafting). I never said one word about how the Steelers have done the last three seasons. The last three seasons dont define his entire tenure...Let's assume you meant in drafting of players (which you didnt). We could go back and look at past drafts and you would still be wrong. The picks may not have worked out as well as we hoped but that doesnt mean he was neglecting it. No matter how you spin it, either way you're wrong. Do you know what the word ENTIRE means or not???
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2022 at 10:14 AM
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  2. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    passing to the RB's and TE's will be the make or break us of the day. we have to move their defensive players everywhere trying to cover what we are doing instead of us trying to figure out what they are doing defensively. we can't throw 2 yard routes and then try to run for two yards and then punt. :cool:
     
  3. SDOT

    SDOT Well-Known Member

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    Exactly, Ben liked the short passes last year but once teams figured him out he quit trusting his reads. That's why I think this strategy will work. He takes 2 seconds and if he doesn't like it just give it to Najee and have him run for his life. If it works it will open up the short passes.

    The new C definitely helps but I highly doubt they will be able to line up and go hat for a hat and run effectively on the Chiefs. Lets pretend they do. You think the offense last week is a winning formula? Struggle for 2-3 yards a run. Then need a miracle throw on 3rd. That's not beating the Chiefs.
     
  4. FosterMorris

    FosterMorris Well-Known Member

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  5. FosterMorris

    FosterMorris Well-Known Member

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    Straw man. Tomlin has never prioritized having an effective running game. Stay on topic please.
     
  6. steel machine

    steel machine Well-Known Member

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    That last line gave me a good laugh. IMO the only chance we have of winning is defensive and special team scores. And I'm guessing we will need more then one to have any chance of winning this game.
     
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  7. FosterMorris

    FosterMorris Well-Known Member

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    Your name has "Real" in it but you almost seem like you are trolling.

    TOMLIN DRAFTS RB IN ORDER TO BENEFIT THE PASSING GAME NOT THE RUNNING GAME.

    You realize that, right? Like that is the reason the RB are 230 and can catch passes. Smaller backs cannot pick up the blitz like Najee and Bell can.

    Najee caught 74 passes. Seventy... four...

    It's why he was drafted. He is an every down back that excels in the pass game.
     
  8. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    First of all...why he drafts them is totally irrelevant and beside the point. Did they get used in the rushing game or not and did the ones who made the pro bowls not finish in the top 5 rushing yards and attempts those seasons or not?? I mean what coach doesnt draft a RB who can benefit/help in the pass game?? The running game is a given if a coach is drafting you. Diversity is achieved by what you can do out of the backfield. James Conner certainly wasnt a great downfield ball catcher. He was average at best (and no one denies that) so you really have no idea why Tomlin picks who he picks.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2022 at 10:43 AM
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  9. Rush2seven

    Rush2seven Well-Known Member

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    Expect subtle changes that have a significant impact
     
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  10. FosterMorris

    FosterMorris Well-Known Member

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    Ben's 1st year:

    Steelers 1st in rushing attempts 2nd in yards

    Ben's last year:

    Steelers 28th in rushing attempts 29th in yards.

    Do you see a difference in support from the running game for Ben?

    People who say the Steelers should run over the Chiefs are not realistic. The Steelers have not had that ability since Cowher with the exception of the span when Munchak was OL coach (and the Steelers could run the ball but didn't).

    ...

    I don't care about individual stats. That comment from you isn't even cogent. I said that Tomlin uses one back so that one back will always have high production because they get all the touches.
     
  11. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    didn't we have the top RB in the league and top WR in the league at one time? i don't think lev bell was just for the passing game. he helped in the passing game but he ran the ball just as well. we had a top WR too at that point. we don't now. makes a big difference in how you can run the ball when there is no downfield threat. you also don't just let a long time franchise QB hand it off more then he throws it. we also had a good line coach and two first round linemen in their prime back then. you can only do what your personnel can do for you. :cool:
     
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  12. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    First of all, stop using words you dont know to appear smarter then you are. What difference does it make that's it's one back or multiple??...you're still wrong and of course there's a huge difference between Bens first year and his last year and that has nothing to do with Tomlin and everything to do with the front five. Are you really comparing a line that included a future HOF on it to this one?? You think if this team had Alan Faneca and Jeff Hartings on it they wouldnt be running more and far more efficiently?
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2022 at 11:02 AM
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  13. SDOT

    SDOT Well-Known Member

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    We had no defense. We scored a lot but so did the other team. Plus; horribly coached, mental errors, and bad luck.
     
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  14. FosterMorris

    FosterMorris Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't matter who is carrying the ball. What matters is team production. The Steelers have not prioritized rushing the ball at any point in Tomlin's regime. You don't get to say the 29th rushing attack is effective just because Najee has Pro Bowl stats because it is illogical.

    ...

    You might think the following interview question was asked after 2021 when the Steelers passed on an All-American center in the 2nd round but it was asked after the 2008 draft. A lot of people had the Steelers taking 4x Pro Bowl tackle Duane Brown who as a 14 year starter over Mendenhall.


    Mike a lot of us we want an offensive lineman to protect Ben. How does he protect Ben?

    * *

    MT: You know there are two schools of thought to protect a quarterback. You can get linemen or you can get him weapons. People that people have to account for. Obviously with this pick we've gotten a weapon. So what he is able to do on a football field will help our quarterback and our football team.


    From Tomlin's own mouth: he protects the QB with receivers. The OL is an afterthought.

    And you think Tomlin has had no impact on the OL being bad his entire regime except 2014-2018?!
     
  15. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    They had no defense when??
     
  16. SDOT

    SDOT Well-Known Member

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    Our defense was terrible when we had AB and Bell.
     
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  17. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    Excuse me...are we talking about drafting men to protect Ben in the pass game?? or help with the run game?? Stay on topic or make it make sense.

    Oh yeah, last I checked Maurkice Pouncey, David Decastro were both pretty good in run and pass block during their prime.
     
  18. FosterMorris

    FosterMorris Well-Known Member

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    Once again you focus on individuals over team.

    I just stated that the Steelers could run the ball under Munchak but chose not to. Pouncey and Decastro were there the whole time.

    I think you've almost got it. Yes, the Steelers had the ability to run the ball with 2 arguable HOF linemen. 15x Pro Bowls and 4x All-Pros between them. Yes, they had the personnel but they chose not to. The center through the right side of that OL was the best in the NFL from 2014-2016 IMO. DIDN'T RUN THE BALL THOUGH. Right? Had the personnel. Had the ability. Didn't do it... so that is COACHING.
     
  19. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    Meh. They weren't the worse (altho certainly not defenses I would have confidence winning a SB with). You had a really good defense in that disappointing 2017 year.


    Team Defense Ranking- Source: Pro Football Reference. Points allowed ranking in ().


    2013 - #13 (14)
    2014- #18 (18)
    2015 - #12 (11)
    2016 - #12 (10)
    2017 - #5 (7)
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2022 at 11:35 AM
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  20. bigbenhotness

    bigbenhotness Well-Known Member

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    Need to control the clock being down 3 scores


    - Steelers 2016-2020 playoffs lol
     
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  21. bigbenhotness

    bigbenhotness Well-Known Member

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    We needed shazier. Still would’ve lost the week after though
     
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  22. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    No, I been got it because they still did their best to plug where there were issues which is why people like Villanueva ended up on the team who also ended up being a Pro Bowler. You dont have future pro bowlers if theres no coaching involved and you certainly dont have first team players. You dont have rbs going to pro bowls if they're game is simply catching balls out of the backfield. I'm trying to think if there ever was one ...I dont recall.
     
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  23. FosterMorris

    FosterMorris Well-Known Member

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    Should have kept Lebeau. You give Lebeau Watt, Dupree, Heyward, Minkah, Haden, Tuitt as Pro Bowl type players and strong performances from Nelson, Alualu, Edmunds and Hilton I think Lebeau would have that the best defense in the NFL. Definitely wouldn't given up almost 40 points to Baker Mayfield!

    (Lebeau is 80. I'm not actually advocating for him just pointing how much better the coaching used to be.)
     
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  24. SteelReal

    SteelReal Well-Known Member

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    Steelers have finished with the number one defense 4 times under Tomlin and no less than #6 10 out of 15 seasons. Not sure what game you're talking about where Mayfield scored 40 points on them, but if it's in reference to last year's playoff game then I would like to see what Lebeau could do against 5 turnovers.
     
  25. FosterMorris

    FosterMorris Well-Known Member

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    :facepalm: Villanueva was a Pro Bowler because he didn't kneel for the anthem. At one point he had the highest jersey sales in the NFL. He was above average and decent as a LT. That's it.

    Najee didn't get voted to the Pro Bowl. I said he had Pro Bowl stats. He's 4th in rushing and 4th in yards from scrimmage in the NFL.

    Najee also had the most touches in the NFL at 381. That's a lot.

    ...

    Just say "The Steelers 29th best rushing offense is an effective unit and Tomlin has made sure to support Ben in his declining years."

    Stop rambling about Najee. Najee played 980 snaps and had 381 touches. Next most was Joe Mixon with 697 and 372.

    Najee being overwhelmingly used the most did not improve the Steelers run game which was 29th best. Twenty... ninth... best... say it. Say it out loud. Then think about that. What choice do the Steelers have but to rely on a short passing game Sunday?!
     

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