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Cowher and Ward: Steelers are soft

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Blast Furnace, Oct 14, 2014.

  1. deljzc

    deljzc Well-Known Member

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    He has been given an opportunity to "build his own team". No 2008 draft left. No 2009 draft left.

    There was NEVER a draft class under Cowher that disappeared as fast as those two have. Never. And Tomlin/Colbert have had it happen not once, but twice. In BACK-TO-BACK drafts.

    This ins't a NOW issue. You seem to think I suddenly decided the Tampa Bay game or the Cleveland game is the reason for my angst and dissatisfaction when nothing could be further from the truth. I have watched. I have given them the benefit of the doubt. I have advocated staying the course and seeing what happens (even if I've disagreed with many of their decisions).

    You are one year behind me and I'm not sure why. I really don't understand what is going to change in the next 12 months to make you think Tombert is the future.
     
  2. pastorbob

    pastorbob Well-Known Member

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    TO me itsnot so much the w/l record its the attitude or more apply the lack of a Steeler attitude. AS a very young fan9PRE-nOLL YOU HAD TO RESPECT THE STeelers even though they had a terrible record no-one wanted to play us because of our attitude,we came to kickbut! I remember us having a qb who made must lbs look like wusses and some-one saying if we could get at least half the team to showup sober and not hung-over we could beat any team in the league.WE had a bad attitude.WE were Art Rooneys team and no-one pushed us around.Now we get pushed around and embarressed every other game.I could handle 8-8 or even 7-9 if we played tough hard-nose Steeler footbal again.Not Tomlin wussball!
     
  3. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    Hey look! Munchak is on the current coaching staff!!!! Brilliant! Now all they need to do is get that Harbaugh guy and Lewis and they'll be set!!1
     
  4. Wardismvp

    Wardismvp Well-Known Member

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    We can do better at the HC position and we
    must. MT/KC are not the answer. Lets hope
    DAN ROONEY/Art II finds the right man for the job, who has the vision to return the Steelers to greatness which would include playing disciplined, smart,tough,physical,fundamental, exciting football.
    We are not even close to seeing the above and won't be under these two.
     
  5. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    I swear, some of you do not remember the bumbling, stumbling, rumbling days of some of Cowher's teams playing undisciplined, sloppy, and mistake riddled unfundamental football. You know what he did when he needed to?

    Doubled up on padded practices with back to the basics. Same thing Tomlin did before the new CBA was signed.
    .
    Guess what he cant do now?
     
  6. shaner82

    shaner82 Well-Known Member

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    So then he finds another way to fix it. Just because he can't do what Cowher once did doesn't mean he gets a pass for this horrid play. Every coach in the NFL plays by the same rules. Lots of coaches have their guys playing sound, fundamental football without complaining about the CBA limiting them. Coaches adapt if they want to keep their jobs.
     
  7. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    Never said he gets a pass.

    Read again I said he's done it before with success, but it's different now. Also, I think he did it last year around the bye week as well and they had a better second half of the season.

    The issue is that he's limited in how many he can have in one week and in total for the season. He has to be judicious about how and when he puts them in pads. I think he's trying to get to around the bye to do it since it would have been damn near impossible the last few weeks since they were on the road.

    I don't know why the team needs a kick in the butt to get going, but they do. Possibly because they don't have those vocal leaders in the locker room anymore. Leading by example doesn't always work.
     
  8. freakfontana

    freakfontana

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    yes but should have started in training camp not in the middle of the season, when we already are in trouble ..
     
  9. shaner82

    shaner82 Well-Known Member

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    My point wasn't so much him getting a pass, it was that Tomlin needs to find other ways to get the guys going, to get them to execute better. The CBA doesn't allow him to do the things he once did, but it's the same for every coach in the league, so he needs to adapt like every other coach has. Forget about waiting for the perfect time to have 2 a week padded practices, if that's what he thinks our saving grace is, we're in even bigger trouble than I thought.

    I'm not a coach, I'm not close to the team so I don't have much to offer in terms of a solution, but there has to be something other than an extra padded practice. That's not going to be the thing that saves this team and it's not what's hurting this team.
     
  10. Da Stellars

    Da Stellars Well-Known Member

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    Yeah this is something I have a problem with... I went to camp for the first time, and I know some people are saying Tomlin had a physical camp, and to be honest I think I have had harder practices... it seemed really tame to me.

    I can't see how they really had a chance to sharpen their skills.
     
  11. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    We look at the teams success differently. Prior to 2012, Tomlin was great, don't care what you or anyone says, he went to 2 SB's and won 1 of them, had three 12-4 seasons, I have no problem with him prior 2012.

    Its when the team became old and started phasing them out that the transition began. Maybe you have no faith in the players taken in the last 2 drafts, I do, I think Tomlin should be allowed the opportunity to see the benefits of what those two drafts produce. And they still need one more draft to fix this thing.

    I think we're mixing two different arguments, Tomlin the coach, I am much more sure about, Tomlins drafting, I'm iffy on but he doesn't do that by himself, so it's harder to judge. There was an article that broke down the Steelers draft process, Colbert absolutely makes the final decision, Tomlin of course has input but how much Colbert lets that influence him is anyones guess. The only thing Colbert doesn't have any say over is who the Rooneys take off the final list for character concerns before giving it back to Colbert.
     
  12. JAD

    JAD Well-Known Member

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    Blast, do you really think one more draft is going to fix this? When you say Tomlin was great the first couple of years, who were his players and how did they get there. They were Cowher's players with toughness and leadership. Since Tomlin now has mostly his players how are they doing?

    I just don't see this getting better with another draft, if anything it will be more of the same 8 and 8 type of team. Not making changes in the next year or two will only delay things. Just my opinion though and time will tell.
     
  13. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Im not going to rehash the Cowhers players debate, been beaten to death, suffice to say that plenty of coaches have inherited good teams and did nothing with them.

    It's not just next draft, its the next draft combined with the last two.

    JJ
    Bell
    Wheaton
    Shark
    Williams
    Shazier
    Tuitt
    Bryant*
    McCullers*

    All those guys are players you can build around, I'm a little less certain about Bryant and McCullers but they have a lot of potential and could turn out to be big contributors.

    Next draft, focus on the secondary, oline, TE and maybe another LB.

    Throw in Timmons, Heyward, AB, Ben, DD, Pouncey (hopefully Worilds) and I like the future of the team.
     
  14. Steel_Razorback

    Steel_Razorback Well-Known Member

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    Putting aside the validity of Coach C/HW's words... given the years of Tomlin-speak fans have been blessed with during pressers, is it any wonder many place stock in the opinions of two folks that in one way or another represented the quintessential Steeler? If Coach T spoke to the fans / media with respect and integrity this kind of commentary wouldn't carry so much weight. Who among us wouldn't instantly gain tremendous respect for the 5.75 million a year Coach T. if he took this moment in his career to verbally demonstrate NFL level professional knowledge, expertise, leadership, and evaluation.

    Not to stir things up but does anyone really feel Cowher and Hines have no insight into the inner workings of this team? Besides keen game observations I'll bet they each have a dozen different ways they could find out what is going on in the locker room / behind the scenes. Wouldn't be shocked if they talked weekly with old friends that happen to be team insiders. What they said smacks of truth in the same way what Terry Bradshaw said about Ben riding motorcycles did. Time for the active Players/Coaches to man up the Steeler way and to use that truth as fuel.
     
  15. freakfontana

    freakfontana

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    cowher and ward probably knows more what is going in the locker room than tomlin .....
     
  16. Busman

    Busman

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    They did not forget to play it against Tampa cause I was there. It was awesome. Always gets the crowd energized. I submit to Steeler fans we should change from using Renegade to this

    [video=youtube;O1eOsMc2Fgg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1eOsMc2Fgg[/video]
     
  17. JAD

    JAD Well-Known Member

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    Busman, you made my day with this, thanks I needed this...
     
  18. SteelerJJ

    SteelerJJ Well-Known Member

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    I remember watching Cowher's 2002 secondary of Brent Alexander, Lethon Flowers, Chidi Iwuoma, Hank Poteat,Dwayne Washington etc. getting toasted (Remember Rich Gannon going 43-of-64 for 403 yards?) They weren't soft. They just weren't very good. Same thing now.
     
  19. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Thats not funny! :lolol:
     
  20. TerribleTowelFlying

    TerribleTowelFlying Staff Member Site Admin

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  21. blountforcetrauma

    blountforcetrauma Well-Known Member

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    Yeah it is..... sadly....
     
  22. Steel_Razorback

    Steel_Razorback Well-Known Member

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    :roflmao:Busman that's hilarious. And Freak you may be right...
     
  23. Wardismvp

    Wardismvp Well-Known Member

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    Great Post!
     
  24. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    :this!:

    This guy said it! How quickly we forget.
     
  25. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Not everyone! 7-9 and 6-10 back to back seasons sucks, don't care how you slice it.
     

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