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Cockrell over Boykin.

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by TheSteelHurtin2188, Sep 21, 2015.

  1. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    I read a Steelers message board cause I'm a fan of the Steelers, not as an opportunity to criticize everything they do.
     
  2. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    Yes DWill had three TDs each at the goaline and Bell got injured on a dirty hit other then that he was holding up just fine. Harrison is 38 years old so he is not the future so its time to give Jones the snaps and see what he has considering his play is on par with Harrison and he is only going to get better the more snaps he gets. I would say Heyward is absolutely in the top 10 when it comes to DEs. On the law of averages the more you play the more your average is going to go down. That is like comparing a guy who had a 100 at bats to a guy who has 500 at bats. Gilbert rated out as the tenth best RT last year per PFF so there's that. Back to Jones real quick if two players have the exact same stats yet one player has played roughly 20 less stats than the other who should be on the field? And you can take your English lesson and shove it up your ass.
     
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  3. MorrisFoster

    MorrisFoster Well-Known Member

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    You probably should have realized that a topic called "Cockerell over Boykin" was going to be critical and skipped it.
     
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  4. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    Like pull Ben for Vick? The fact is Cockrell played 40 snaps in one game and Boykins 11 in two. Also Cockrell got here after Boykins.
     
  5. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

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    Cockerell looked good , he needs to play . Boykin will get his chance soon and should push Cortez to the bench. We play better when he is not on the field we play better when Shamarko is not on the field . We should be trying to trade both of them right now .
     
  6. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    Also please show me where I said Cockrell was better than Boykin. I simply stated that he played more snaps than Boykin and that coupled with Boykin not logging a single snap in NE it seemed that Boykin was in Tomlin's dog house.
     
  7. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    we are all steelers fans but aren't under the assumption that just because you are a steelers coach means everything you do is right. we get rid of coaches and hire coaches and if just because you are a steelers coach means what you do is always right then we would never fire any coach ever and we would win the SB every year. this is a place to not only talk about what they do that's right but equally talk about what they are doing wrong. i believe we all want the best for this team every year. :cool:
     
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  8. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    i think the part where you said he isn't working out steel hurtin. when a guy misses some practice, he usually plays less, it doesn't mean he's not working out, it means others are more integrated into the game plan at that point. :cool:
     
  9. MorrisFoster

    MorrisFoster Well-Known Member

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    The fact that Jarvis can't take the ROLB spot from 38 year old with severe back problems speaks volumes.

    PFF ranks Gilbert 10th best? Is that your basis for saying he will become an "elite" RT?

    The value of a DE is usually determined by QB pressure generated. Heyward is a good player but I don't see other teams putting up 10M for a guy with no Probowls or 10 sack seasons. So when Tuitt explodes Steelers will be paying Top 5 QB money to their 2 interior DEs? Seems like a recipe for success. Heyward is making double what Aaron Smith did.

    I will stop with the English lesson because I JUST told you how to use "than" and you still got it wrong kind of like your assessment of Gilbert as becoming "elite."
     
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  10. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    Well so far he isn't working out. Sorry he didn't look like the player we thought we were getting in the preseason either. The way our corners were getting beat in NE they could have thrown him out there even if was still shaky with the playbook. Out of 151 snaps on defense so far he has been out there for 15 snaps.
     
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  11. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    So Aaron Smith wasn't great because Heyward has already tied him for sacks in a season. I mean if you just want to go by sacks then there is your answer. You clearly don't understand the job of a 3-4 DE in the Steelers system. Also I think Jones should be starting over Harrison maybe that goes back to your theory of the coaches don't put the best player on the field.
     
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  12. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    as i have said before, he looked better in his first preseason game then he has since he's started getting coached here. :cool:
     
  13. MorrisFoster

    MorrisFoster Well-Known Member

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    Uh my point is Aaron Smith was amazing and made half of Heyward's money. 3-4 DE in a two gap occupies blockers to free up the OLB in a pass rush situation and collapses the pocket.

    I guess Heyward must suck based on this definition because Jarvis has 3 sacks in 23 games and was usually playing beside Heyward.

    3-4 DE more likely to get sacks in a one gap where D tries to penetrate. A Smith was amazing at holding at the point of attack against double teams.

    I guess if yoyr ROLB sucks then your RDE has to go get those sacks?
     
  14. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    If you translate Smiths money to today he would be up there. You can't compare two players who were in their prime almost ten years apart in the NFL. The cap has sky rocketed since then along with the players salaries. So are you saying Haggans and Woodley sucked because Smith got sacks as well. This is Jones third year and that is when most OLBs in a 3-4 really flourish. This is the Steelers first year in a one gap system. He has looked stronger this year and looks to be playing football and not thinking so much. He was thrown into the fire his first year and struggled. He looked good to start the year last year until he broke his wrist and couldn't do any upper body lifting and lost strength last year. Remember when everyone said Timmons was a bust because he couldn't beat out Foote and didn't look good when he was out there. How'd that work out?
     
  15. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    Oh I don't agree with everything the Steelers do. Just for me personally I try to make it my soul purpose to beat them up over every single thing.
    I tend to take the more supportive approach. But again that's just me.
     
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  16. darcrav

    darcrav Well-Known Member

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    really?
    Well Glenda knew something about a pulled groin.
     
  17. JackAttack 5958

    JackAttack 5958 Well-Known Member

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    That's the first time a DB has broken up a pass in the endzone since...;) :roflmao:
     
  18. MorrisFoster

    MorrisFoster Well-Known Member

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    @ SteelHurtin - I have no idea where you get this Vick vs Ben thing or what you are talking about.

    Yes you can compare players salaries in different eras as a portion of the total. Aaron Smith signed acontract worth 4.5% of the Steelers cap for 2007 (the year he signed it). Heyward signed a contract worth 6.9% for 2015. So Heyward's salary is 50% more than what Smith signed.

    There aren't a lot of teams who heavily invest in 3-4 DE. The Jets have two of the best 3-4 DE in football, don't pay them close to their market value, and they still suck. Wilkerson and Richardson are going to get more than Heyward so I guess they will stick with Fitzpatrick?

    Heyward makes more than AB, Gronkowski, Von Miller... Etc.

    I'm gonna stop now. Any time you argue with a homer who is so blinded he puts "Marcus Gilbert" and "elite" in the same sentence you come off looking like the bad guy.

    Gilbert for 1st team All-Pro! Pay Heyward double! Bell for HOF!
     
  19. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    Sorry that wasn't you you were the one saying we should bring back Rainey. When did I say Gilbert was elite. Could he continue to grow and become elite yeah he could. Heyward's is the leader of this defense and there is no question about it. Smith while great wasn't the leader that Heyward is. Heyward's is worth every penny gives the defense that attitude that it has been missing. You can call me a Homer or whatever at least I have never changed my argument. Jones sucks because he can't beat out Harrison and Adams is better then Gilbert even though he could never beat out Gilbert. Coaches don't put the best players on the field they go by pedigree but in the next sentence you say Gilbert got beat out by an UDFA 7th round pick in Beachum. Jones sucks because Heyward get sacks even though up until the middle part of last year Jones had and old Beard playing next to him. Call me a Homer if you want I'm cool with that. I'm cool with trusting a team that has been the most consistent team in the league for 40+ years. I think they know just a little bit more about the game then we do.
     
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  20. blountforcetrauma

    blountforcetrauma Well-Known Member

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    LOL! Well it is certainly a step forward from Mitchell just looking at a wide open rat and turning back around!
     
  21. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    Cockrell played 24 snaps yesterday and Boykin played 2. What's everyone's excuse this time.
     
  22. Da Stellars

    Da Stellars Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I noticed this too first hand when I saw him in the HOF game. Might be the quickest first step on the team.
     
  23. SteelerGlenn

    SteelerGlenn

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    I'm sure we'll get the standard "coaches are idiots " comments.
     
  24. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    I didn't notice Cockrell much yesterday except when he lined up at the beginning of each play. I'm going to take that as a positive.
     
  25. TheSteelHurtin2188

    TheSteelHurtin2188 Well-Known Member

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    Most likely and I for one thought Cockrell played well yesterday. Maybe we found a diamond in the rough?. I wonder what the coaches are going to do when Allen is health?. I wonder who gets a helmet and who doesn't. Allen is a better tackler than Boykin and as the fourth corner you are going to play special teams.
     

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