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Butterfly Effect and the Blitz

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Rush2seven, Sep 23, 2020.

  1. Rush2seven

    Rush2seven Well-Known Member

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    The butterfly effect suggests that a small change in one part of the system can have a large effect on another part.

    The Steelers defense is bringing the pressure. They’ve racked up the sacks. I read articles stating they’ve blitzed more than any other team thru the first two weeks.

    While pressure is a strength, unproven QBs D Jones and Driskel carved up the secondary.

    To be a blitz, the additional defender has to come from somewhere. That somewhere leaves a gap in the coverage. Risk versus reward. If they get the sack, great. If they don’t, there’s vulnerability in the coverage.

    So, how much of the tendency of the D to blitz has contributed to giving up first downs, big plays, and touchdowns? How much of one DB being out of position is related to having too much field to cover?

    Certainly not every completion the D gives up is during a blitz, but sometimes they do. Can this defense not get pressure rushing just 4?
     
  2. 86WardsWay

    86WardsWay Well-Known Member

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    This Steelers defense gets plenty of pressure rushing 4. The turnovers happen when they Blitz.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
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  3. jamie

    jamie Well-Known Member

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    What really made the Steelers Defense effective last year was that they were able to get pressure with their front four which eliminated this risk on the back end you mentioned. I think in the first game they blitzed to stop the run, why they blitzed so much against Denver, I am not sure. To beat Elite QBs the defense will need to rush 4 and actually “spy” with the 5th rusher. Jackson, Watson, Mayfield and Burrow can all kill you with the scramble. I am sure Tuitt and Heyward are sucking up blockers in the middle so Watt and Dupree can get the glory. Going to be real important this week for the front four to rush the passer but stay in their lanes. Watson to me is more dangerous running then passing. Devin and Minkah need to have big games this week.
     
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  4. shaner82

    shaner82 Well-Known Member

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    Do you have the data/statistics to support this?
    I don't ask this question because I don't believe you, I'm literally just curious to see the stats in different scenarios. I wouldn't know where to find it
     
  5. 86WardsWay

    86WardsWay Well-Known Member

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    Sorry. I do not have any stats to support this. I am only going by my game day viewing and re-watching the game a day or two later. This is solely just my observation.
     
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  6. Rush2seven

    Rush2seven Well-Known Member

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    I’d like to believe they get pressure with four, so, then why blitz so often?
     
  7. 86WardsWay

    86WardsWay Well-Known Member

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    I think it's because they know that QB's can pick this defense apart if they don't send pressure from different angles at alarming rates. Personally, I like that they are getting back to the Blitzburgh mentality cause without it our secondary becomes very exposed often times by MLB's not being able to cover TE's and having the CB's and S's second guessing their assignments. Not sure if that makes sense but it's JMHO.
     
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  8. mytake

    mytake Well-Known Member

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    Watson has already been sacked 8 times, 4 by KC and 4 by Baltimore. Watson's best passing numbers are when it is 2nd or 3rd down and 7-9 yards to go. He only has a 50 QB rating when blitzed. His rating goes down significantly (33 points) when he holds the ball for more than 2.5 seconds in the pocket. It seems like the Steelers defense will need to do a mix of blitzing and coverage. If the coverage can force Watson to hold the ball, or run some delayed blitzes, it may keep Watson off balance. By the way, he has a perfect passing rating on RPOs.
     
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  9. bigbenhotness

    bigbenhotness Well-Known Member

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    I feel like we don’t really get coverage sacks. It seems as others said we rely on the front 7 to get to the qb or we are toast. At least the secondary can get ints now.
     
  10. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    I said this two weeks ago. Another thing is the linebackers are not the best in coverage.

    We have played alot of zone on the backend. Our corners are better in man then they are in zone.

    Like in past years the blitz getting home seems to drop off in the second half of games. Conditioning? Other teams adjusting? Us not adjusting?

    Vince still in coverage. This was not suppose to happen but it still is. Bush hasn't improved as much as we had hoped in coverage.

    DBs are asked to do too much at times. Two of our dbs are credited with 3 sacks in two games.

    It's like death from 1000 cuts. It's not just one thing but at different times it is usually one of these things. We are out thought in the chess match even by backups. The second half of games is the let down so far. Sure seems like a trend so far. Still winning but not always pretty.

    :cool:
     
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  11. Rush2seven

    Rush2seven Well-Known Member

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    To your comment that our DBs are better in man than zone. This, in part, was the impetus for my post. If we blitz, then there is one less defender in coverage and the remaining DBs have to cover more ground and make the right decisions. If they hesitate, the receivers open up and they become vulnerable. So, should they dial back the blitz in certain situations to promote better coverage?
     
  12. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    They have been adding a db often and pulling a dlineman which lets them send a db on the blitz. We play a good bit of 2 down linemen later in the game I have noticed. It removes some pressure from the qb and the opposing O line if they don't send a db. It also helps the opposing qb to get out of the pocket and see the field better. This could be dangerous for us this week.

    I also saw alualu has some knee trouble so we may see more of this two down linemen sets which I don't think bodes well for this matchup. To be honest in this one, I'd like to see us use Davis a little more at SS and move Edmunds down for vince and take Bush off the field on passing downs. leave the front 5 on the field to keep Watson in the pocket where he's vulnerable. Houston likes their TEs. Smith one of their TEs is dinged up for them. :cool:
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
  13. uncblue012

    uncblue012 Well-Known Member

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    I think it's by-plan. Even Lock, though solid, isn't an elite quarterback. It seems fairly obvious that the Steelers are OK giving up big plays here and there knowing the rush is causing turnovers. I'm guessing the plan changes against elite-level QBs.
     
  14. Rush2seven

    Rush2seven Well-Known Member

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    I like your thinking. Question is, is it optimistic or just crazy talk that Butler will have a different plan based on who the opposing teams lines up behind center.

    They stayed in man against the Giants to stop Barkley from running the ball. That worked. Watson is one of those QBs that require a hybrid approach. Let’s see if the plan changes based on that.
     
  15. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    A few short years ago, we couldn't create turnovers, I think there is a strong focus on turnovers and it's working.....so far:cool:
     
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  16. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    I'm ultra critical of the secondary but not because we give up plays or yardage, because guys who should know better are committing stupid penalties which can change the outcome of a game.
     
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  17. Rush2seven

    Rush2seven Well-Known Member

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    They should show improvement as the season continues and be really good come February
     
  18. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    The dumb penalties have been a problem so far this season, but for the most part the guys in our secondary have a track record of smart play, so the current issues can (and I think will) be overcome. If we had a lack of talent back there, I'd be a lot more concerned.
     
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  19. Vox Ferrum

    Vox Ferrum Well-Known Member

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    Houston is only 7/19 on 3rd down conversions. Let's see if we can get off the field, or do we let him keep drives going. This could be the key to the game. D had got to start getting off the field or the wear and tear will start to show.
     
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  20. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    I'm not seeing good tracking by our corners. They are either bailing out on the first stutter step or biting too hard on the wr's break. Their reaction to the first move is too slow and poorly anticipated. This puts them in a trailing position far too often, trying to make up space as the ball is released. There is also a lot of miscommunication when passing off receivers in and out of zones. All this is magnified when the front 7 don't disrupt timing. When the qb has time to go through his progressions, our coverage breaks down and there is usually someone uncovered. When the timing is disrupted, there isn't enough time for a receiver to get to a soft spot in the zone or to get enough good separation to not have the pass contested. That's obviously pretty basic and can apply to any team. We, however, are just about the best at disruption from our front 7. This covers up a lot of the secondary's deficiencies. But when we don't get home, the secondary simply cannot cover.

    And this isn't new this year. This happened all last year as well.

    We do have a better offense with Ben, and can swing time of posession in our favor if we're clicking. The more time we chew up on offense, the less time the front 7 has to cover for the secondary, and the fresher they will be late in the game. I really think that conditioning was a factor in our first 2 games. TJ and co. were gassed and their pressure on the qb diminished late in both games.

    But something fun to think about is that we will have some games where the defense puts it all together. That's going to be fun to watch. Our D doesn't have to hit on all cylindars to come up with a dominating performance. And some games they won't. We just need the offense to do their part when that happens.

    I know I complain about the secondary a lot. But I'm still hopeful and encouraged about the prospect of this season.
     
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  21. Rush2seven

    Rush2seven Well-Known Member

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    There’s been a lot of talk about the penalties this week. On the last drive they could’ve cost the game. Let’s see if there’s a distinct difference this week. They don’t necessarily need to play less aggressive, just smarter.
     
  22. KnoxVegasSteel

    KnoxVegasSteel Well-Known Member

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    Having an O that can consistently put up 26+ points a game has more of a benefit for this D than more blitzing.
     
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  23. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

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    I think the rules almost force you to blitz . Defenses cant really get physical so you must bring heat unless you have shut down CB'S ..Chances are if you have coverage CB'S then you don't have good run support ...The best Defense to play vs the current game is Single High ..The Single high allows you to blitz and cover at the same time ...Our problem is we don't have a Safety who can play single high is why I say we should look to convert a WR to that spot...

    Most College Safeties are more run stoppers and not really fast enough to cover enough field while the ball is in the air .A converted 4.3 WR could be taught to play that position IMO... If I was a NFL GM I would draft a Big fast WR with bad hands late and try and make the conversion.. It's going to start happening soon IMO ..
     
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  24. JAD

    JAD Well-Known Member

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    So you would put a guy like Chase and convert him to safety?, To me this should be done at the high school or college level instead of taking that precious time to develop and change positions. We see some players now like Edmounds who people say give him time he is new and young, if he had changed positions in the NFL it may take 4 to 5 years for them to be good at the new positions. Look at Bud Dupree, it took him 5 years to learn one positions in the NFL.
     
  25. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

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    No as Chase was a decent College WR and he can be a true NFL WR..All the time in the world will never make Edmounds a good single high Safety .. Teams all around the NFL are getting gashed by the pass as stated a single high is the best way to get pressure and cover ..https://walterfootball.com/draft2020S.php look at these guys and look at the 40 times they are just to slow to play the position the way it needs to be played..

    Converting to Single high would not take a miracle IMO The reads for a deep single high safety are very easy the key is after they diagnose the play do they have the speed to get to the spot to make the play ? A lot of Teams are already moving these bigger slower Safeties to LB or playing them more at the LOS as stated the next step is to get more speed back there..

    If the Colleges are not giving you options for the position then I think it's prudent to try and create your own option ...
     

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