BUMP - Ben's Clock Management (sigh...)

QB's call timeouts all the time rather than spike the ball. I've seen hundreds if not thousands of times where a QB has immediately called a timeout after a play rather than running up to spike the ball. Like I said, both those guys need to learn some clock management skills.

 

Seriously. It's embarrassing that Ben does this and doesn't seem to realize his mistakes. For a quarterback, it's pretty need to know. And it's simple, too. But the coaching staff, who is supposed to specialize in this stuff? Where is the timeout? How are you so stupid? I've said it before, I'll say it again: appoint someone not stupid on the field to take charge in the play/timeout/spike scenario. Heath Miller is on the field every play, knows his stuff, and as a tight end will be able to see what was going on and make the call. Ben can look to him and Heath can either call TO on his own, do the spike signal, or just hurry up to the line to run a play. Ben is clearly incapable. So is Tomlin. It's embarrassing that I even have to propose such a stupid solution, but since the traditional avenues have been exhausted, this is all I have left.

 

I wasn't implying that a QB can't call a time out, didn't think that needed clarifying, I meant that Bens not at fault here, don't you think Tomlin could call a time out by the time Ben gets everyone lined up and spikes it? Every team practices a 2 minute drill, It's obviously a philosophy the coaching staff imparts on them.[/quote:29y0q4y7]
Whoa, TE. Back that trolley up. Ben is absolutely at fault here. He is first in the line of defense against retardedness. As the QB on the field, who usually is calling the plays in a hurry up offense, it's his call whether to run a play, spike the ball, or call timeout. He butchers this decision all the time. Yes, the coaching staff can overrule him in one way only, and that's by calling timeout. And they do that sometimes (in the Super Bowl after Holmes' big gainer, and other times). So sometimes Tomlin saves us from wasting a down as well as seconds. Other times he wrongly lets Ben do his thing and it costs us. They are both at fault, but Ben is first in line to make the call (which 99% of the time has a clear right and wrong answer and is not a matter of opinion), and he's also the one that messes up more frequently. He simply hates calling timeouts and does not understand the value that downs carry over timeouts at certain points of the game.

You're right, when he is not overruled, that means the coaching staff approved. Or they thought he might fake it, or they didn't want to step on his toes, or they just didn't have their stuff together enough to even know what was going on. That doesn't mean they told him what to do, though. It's clearly Ben making these calls. It's become literally predictable. Our guy goes down with 30 seconds left and one timeout remaining at the 5 yard line? Cut to: Ben doing the spike signal and hurrying up the offense. Why take three shots into the end zone with 30 seconds when you could have 2 shots into the end zone with 15 seconds and a timeout? Embarrassing.

 

While we're at it, from the 9 yard line, if you're going to waste a down with an incomplete pass, why not throw a fade route? You don't need to call a play or have good pass protection for that. It takes an extra 3 seconds and the clock will stop no matter what. Can't be that hard to have a code word for "fade."

 

Snack, I was thinking of this post when I saw Ben spike away yet ANOTHER opportunity for a touchdown when time was NOT YET of the essence, and I'm glad you bumped it. Inside of a minute to go, we seem to lose our minds relative to other teams and as close as our games tend to be, it's hard not to get worked up when we don't take full advantage of every opportunity available to us.

Beyond spiking the ball with a minute to play or so inside the 10 yard line (which not only costs us an opportunity to score, but leaves unnecessary time for our opponents), I'm also surprised (or, I guess really no longer surprised) when we choose to call our timeouts near 2 minutes. I'm going from memory here, but I think we took a timeout at 1:45 on 3rd and relatively long. I never see other teams do that. It's okay to have some urgency, but keep the clock running so that in case you don't convert on the next play you haven't left the other team just under 2 minutes and a full complement of timeouts. I go back to the opening game against Atlanta couple of years ago I cited in my earlier post. The game was tied and we were driving in fourth quarter for a go-ahead score. Having just got a first down at about our own 40 with the clock running, we call a timeout with 2:04 to go instead of letting the clock go to the 2-minute warning. I was dumbfounded. Who does that to preserve 4 seconds.....on offense? We proceed to get sacked on the next 2 plays and end up punting back to Atlanta with about 1:45 left. It just seems we do things a bit randomly sometimes (and PLEASE don't call a timeout on defense with 2:43 left and the clock running!!!!)

Don't get me wrong. We have a lot going for us, and I'm grateful for the positives. It's just this aspect of the game seems so common-sense and easy to fix -- I just don't understand why we can't do what so many other teams seem to be able to take for granted.....

 

Whoa, TE. Back that trolley up. Ben is absolutely at fault here. He is first in the line of defense against retardedness. As the QB on the field, who usually is calling the plays in a hurry up offense, it's his call whether to run a play, spike the ball, or call timeout. He butchers this decision all the time. Yes, the coaching staff can overrule him in one way only, and that's by calling timeout. And they do that sometimes (in the Super Bowl after Holmes' big gainer, and other times). So sometimes Tomlin saves us from wasting a down as well as seconds. Other times he wrongly lets Ben do his thing and it costs us. They are both at fault, but Ben is first in line to make the call (which 99% of the time has a clear right and wrong answer and is not a matter of opinion), and he's also the one that messes up more frequently. He simply hates calling timeouts and does not understand the value that downs carry over timeouts at certain points of the game.

You're right, when he is not overruled, that means the coaching staff approved. Or they thought he might fake it, or they didn't want to step on his toes, or they just didn't have their stuff together enough to even know what was going on. That doesn't mean they told him what to do, though. It's clearly Ben making these calls. It's become literally predictable. Our guy goes down with 30 seconds left and one timeout remaining at the 5 yard line? Cut to: Ben doing the spike signal and hurrying up the offense. Why take three shots into the end zone with 30 seconds when you could have 2 shots into the end zone with 15 seconds and a timeout? Embarrassing.[/quote:j4xfwogx]

Actually, I just recalled a quote by Ben that he hates burning timeouts, so he is at fault here but I still don't believe he is doing anything that Tomlin is not approving of, as I said, he can just call a TO if he sees Ben setting up to spike and does not want him to. Every team practices these situations, I have to believe that this is a philosophy they share, save the time outs. Again, I don't approve of this but it's clear Tomlin does or it wouldn't be happening. Maybe Haley can improve this area, is anyone familiar with his clock management? TTF, you spent time watching KC film, did you notice anything?[/quote:j4xfwogx]

Even if Tomlin is approving of this idiotic behaviour, that doesn't excuse Ben. Ben is not a drone, he has a mind of his own and he knows what needs to be done. He's said it openly in the past that he needs to start using timeouts instead of spiking the ball, so he clearly knows it's a problem, yet he continues to do it. I personally don't care if Tomlin approves of it or is just too damn incompetent to know what's going on, I expect better from a veteran QB. I also expect better of Tomlin, he's been around long enough to know better. Both are to blame equally. It needs to stop, it's costing us points.

 

I have been very critical of Ben since SB43, but I have to say that I have no problems with his current play. I really just wanted to him to make reads faster, and get rid of the ball quicker. Also, I wanted to see more check-down. He's doing that. And his completion percentage is very impressive. I think Ben is playing at a very high level, right now, and I am glad to see him getting closer to his potential. He's become an even greater asset to the team, and still maintains his scrambling, gun-slinger style, when necessary. I believe it's a great blend of pocket passer + athletic go-getter.

I honestly don't pay that much attention to his clock management. I think he usually does a pretty good job. But, I will pay closer attention.

Go Ben! And...

HERE WE GO STEELERS! HERE WE GO!!!

 

They are both to blame because they both should have become smarter than this when they turned 9. And yes, in a way Tomlin sometimes (on the occasions Ben goes through with it and a timeout is not called from the sidelines) does "approve" by way of not interrupting. Does he like it and think it's the right thing to do? Or just letting Ben be Ben and trusting him? I don't know, but you're right that by looking at his actions, he's passively approving. But it seems like you're phrasing it as if Tomlin has actually told Ben what to do, like it was his idea to spike it. That may have happened somewhere along the way in there, but I think the notion that this is the way it's planned and Tomlin is in on it is way off. It's what Ben wants to do. You can see it. Tomlin either stops him or doesn't. And like you said, Ben has basically admitted he's allergic to timeouts. You'd think he got an extra 50 grand for every timeout he doesn't use at the end of a game. I don't understand that for the life of me.

 

What I'm suggesting what might be the case is that it's a philosophy they all agree on. Every team practice these drills correct? It seems to me that this is a philosophy they agree on, no? But you could be 100% correct too and it's just Ben going into Ben mode while he runs the hurry up. I just find it hard to believe that when they practice those situations that Tomlin doesn't correct Ben, "now Ben, these things are called time outs, they will stop the clock for us, you do't have to spike it every time". But, we already know Tomlin is a poor clock manager so maybe we need Haley to say that.[/quote:3l401uoa]
You're right, it's hard to believe. I still don't understand how it's happening. Every fan knows what to do. I'd bet most of the team knows what to do. I'd bet half the guys hustling to the line for a spike are all thinking, "This is totally retarded. We're going to waste a down? Why don't we just call timeout?" Haley has now been here for at least 2 of these situations, and I didn't see him doing anything. He can't call a timeout himself, but he could tell Tomlin to do it. No way Tomlin turns that down. His OC, his playcaller, asks for a timeout and he's going to say no? That wouldn't happen.

Whatever's going on, it's a pathetic mess.

 

You're right, it's hard to believe. I still don't understand how it's happening. Every fan knows what to do. I'd bet most of the team knows what to do. I'd bet half the guys hustling to the line for a spike are all thinking, "This is totally retarded. We're going to waste a down? Why don't we just call timeout?" Haley has now been here for at least 2 of these situations, and I didn't see him doing anything. He can't call a timeout himself, but he could tell Tomlin to do it. No way Tomlin turns that down. His OC, his playcaller, asks for a timeout and he's going to say no? That wouldn't happen.

Whatever's going on, it's a pathetic mess.[/quote:kkwpmybd]


Snack you are being very funny today ...but I get what you are saying. Its football 101 and we seem to be unable or unwilling to figure it out.

 

Actually, I just recalled a quote by Ben that he hates burning timeouts, so he is at fault here but I still don't believe he is doing anything that Tomlin is not approving of, as I said, he can just call a TO if he sees Ben setting up to spike and does not want him to. Every team practices these situations, I have to believe that this is a philosophy they share, save the time outs. Again, I don't approve of this but it's clear Tomlin does or it wouldn't be happening. Maybe Haley can improve this area, is anyone familiar with his clock management? TTF, you spent time watching KC film, did you notice anything?[/quote:2ekrvoz5]

Even if Tomlin is approving of this idiotic behaviour, that doesn't excuse Ben. Ben is not a drone, he has a mind of his own and he knows what needs to be done. He's said it openly in the past that he needs to start using timeouts instead of spiking the ball, so he clearly knows it's a problem, yet he continues to do it. I personally don't care if Tomlin approves of it or is just too damn incompetent to know what's going on, I expect better from a veteran QB. I also expect better of Tomlin, he's been around long enough to know better. Both are to blame equally. It needs to stop, it's costing us points.[/quote:2ekrvoz5]

So you're saying that if the coach wants to employ the practice of spiking the ball to preserve TO's that Ben should just ignore him? I already said that Ben is at fault here too in my last post but to suggest that he violate instructions from a coach is silly.[/quote:2ekrvoz5]

I have a very hard time believing that Tomlin has specifically instructed him to save timeouts by spiking the ball. In the 2 minute drill, generally the coaches allow the QB to decide what to do and how to get it done. If Tomlin has specifically instructed Ben to do what he does, then the blame is on Tomlin and slightly on anyone else that hasn't spoken up against such a philosophy, but I have a very, very hard time believing that. More than likely, it is 100% Ben's call whether to call a timeout or spike the ball. If I'm correct, and I strongly believe I am, Ben is an idiot for doing it, and Tomlin is an idiot for not correcting it after the 28th time. They are both equally to blame. Either way, I'm done arguing who's fault it is because that doesn't matter to me, but what does matter is that somebody, somewhere needs to step in and stop this. If need be I will drive to Pittsburgh and threaten to kill kittens every time Ben spikes the ball, it just needs to stop.