Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Hawaii 5-0, Jan 6, 2020.
Google "Joe Dirt" and "Buffalo Bob".
It puts the Joe Dirt in the hole
So Jenkins is a less player cause he got less money that is winning logic right there so I had to look a few things up:
Here is a player who signed a 1 year 4 mil contract......you know a lot less than the 9.2 mil that we paid Bud. So let's compare:
Mr. 4 mil 6 ff Bud 2
Mr. 4 mil 19.5 sacks Bud 11.5
Mr. 4 mil 58 tkls Bud 68
Mr. 4 mil 19 TFL Bud 16
Mr. 4 mil 37 QBH Bud 17
Mr. 4 mil 1 int Bud 0
So by someone's definition 9.2 million dollar man Bud should have been light years ahead of Shaq Barrett Mr. 4 milion...........I guess I will have to read them numbers again to understand them. @thesteeldeal or @Stone can you help me with this??????????
Yeah we probably could even think that a player making less than Bud could have just as good of production here for a whole lot less money..........just sayin....
I never said that Jenkins is a lesser player because he got less money, so the entire premise of this post is wrong. Your comparison of Barrett and Dupree is irrelevant. Barrett wasn't an option for the Steelers in 2020.
I provided statistical evidence to demonstrate how Jenkins has been a lesser player. Try reading the post again.
You know what it is NYSF? It’s not about the players or the numbers or the abundance of examples of guys flourishing in different systems and scenarios. Some progressing ,some regressing. You never know how a player would do given a different and sometimes better situation right? There’s no evidence until it actually happens right? So even though you may think you have all the facts,you really don’t until it actually happens. That’s why we can all have our opinion and speculate on things.
There is also the hypocrisy in one’s thoughts. Let me give you a example....
We signed Ebron right? For the most part people are pretty happy about that. The thinking is “if” he can only reproduce what he did 2 years ago. It’s gonna be great right and your entitled to judge how likely that is to happen. Then on the other hand, let’s use Fackrell as a example,even though he was just one of the handful of other guys being talked about. He had a pretty nice year 2 years ago as well, no? Now let’s not pretend to think we know all the potential reasons why his 2019 wasn’t as good as his 2018. I recall reading a article I believe that said something about him joining one of his LB coaches he had in 2018 in GB ,now with the Giants. Maybe not having said coach in GB last year played a huge part in his down season? I mean after all Butler seems to be getting a lot of credit for Dupree,right? Unless people want to contradict that thought about it maybe having a impact on Fackrell? Truth is we really don’t know....
The point I’m trying to make without getting too long winded about it is ....We are just doing our best to form our own opinions and speculate based on what little facts we have. Some opinions may have a little more facts behind them but it’s still mostly speculation .unless one owns a crystal ball. I think the best discussions that take place here at TSF is when people can discuss their thoughts and opinions without someone thinking their own opinions are superior to others. We should all respect each other’s opinions even if one is based a little more on fact. It doesn’t matter ,it’s how that person feels and without proof we will never know and that should be respected even if you vehemently disagree. At some point it’s just easier to agree to disagree instead of dragging out the discussion. Which I will admit I’m guilty of as well.....
I’ve seen people criticized and their fandom questioned here because they disagree on something. I’ve seen people here being accused of rather seeing the team do bad, just so they can be right because they disagree. IMO .I don’t think anyone should care more about being right than being a jerk about it either. We’re all Steeler fans here. We wouldn’t spend as much time here as we do if we didn’t bleed black and gold. Let’s try and remember that and respect each other’s opinions if if they don’t align. JMO
stop stop stop.........stop making sense all the haters will have nothing better to do than try and pick apart every little thing you say. And don't you know there are many here that need that feeling(in their own mind) that they are smarter, better and more of a fan than you? I like that idea obout just disagreeing and not saying anything, I will have to try that.........
He’s really not but hey, JMO and that’s what we are here for right
She probably favors the Giants. NFL Blueblood
If she is anything like the girl with the dragon tattoo, she would let you watch but you wouldn't like what's coming up.
Have you not read this board at least the last month, yeah he is right. There are guys that have no way to see it any way but their way. There are guys here that just want to be a know it all and basically tell you you are wrong and know nothing. Guys that get mad if you say something bad against owners, players or coaches. So yeah I will say he is right, I know you don't care for him but he speaks the truth like it or not......
We are here to talk about our team with other fan of the same team but it has become a who has a bigger pee pee of late.
Thanks man! The truth is a hard pill for some.
I thought it was opinions, not right or wrong
And I was talking about his analogy about not knowing how a player will perform. Bringing in an unknown to a system he hasn’t performed in, over a guy who played lights out makes no sense to me outside of saving money.
It is a longer story and I am sure you have been reading it, there is some "opinions" on the whole tagging Bud thing vs finding a cheaper guy in FA. I am sure you know what I am talking about.......
That is a good point to add to the mix. It is nice to look at the shiny object on another team, but those pieces don't always fit as well once you add them to your team's puzzle. Dupree has proven that he can be extremely productive in the Steelers' system. None of the players brought up as potential replacements have done that.
Well there is truth to a guy going to a new team and doing better we see it all the time why?
2018 with Denver - 13 gms, 0 int, 0FF, 3 SK, 28 TKLS, 6 TFL, 7 QBH
2019 with Bucs - 16 GMS, 1 INT, 6 FF, 19.5 SK, 58 TKLS, 19 TFL, 37 QBH
Tanneyhill is another and how about right here with Mincah, he is a DPOY candidate here why not with the Dolphins? How many guys left here fro FA and didn't do as good as they did here, so yeah there is truth what steeldeal did say.
Speaking of someone saying something look at these numbers for Barrett. Judging by his 2018 nobody would sign him to replace their highly paid star and then look at his 2019 number I think that thinking is wrong. So Shaq got "less money in 2019 cause he was an inferior player due to his sack numbers" how did that work out in 2019????? It can happen you can find players, that is the point that was trying to be made.
Watt took what, 3 weeks to out produce him from either side? The next guy up will match Dud or be more productive. Especially if he is a high round pick.
So anybody who isn’t as good as TJ Watt isn’t extremely productive. Got it.
Let's not get into Dud's productivity compared to his peers.
20% of the time....the other 80% people wanted to run him outta town. Many,many were against the 5th year option. I doubt that would of been the case had he been that productive....jmo
Worst move: Placing the franchise tag on Bud Dupree
After failing to reach the top-60 in pass-rush grade in all four of his NFL seasons prior to 2019, Bud Dupree had a career year in 2019, generating a 76.3 pass-rush grade that ranked 24th among players at his position. Dupree made more impactful pays with a load of sacks and fumbles, but he wasn’t consistent on a rep-to-rep basis. After all, pressure rate is far more predictive of future performance than sack totals are, and Dupree ranked only 63rd in that category last year. In other words, this screams, “buyer beware.”
This is like the people who think the Steelers should be drafting quarterbacks in the sixth round every year because that is when the Patriots got Tom Brady.
Yes, occasionally guys who are undrafted or late picks eventually turn out to be something special. James Harrison proved that here. Of course, that is also why so many Steelers fans got excited about Adeniyi. I know I fell into that trap. The team even gave him Harrison's number! By your logic, the Steelers should have just handed him the job even though he couldn't even beat out Chickillo the last two seasons and he is still looking for his first regular-season sack in the NFL.
Fitzpatrick and Tannehill are not good comparisons because they both had much better pedigrees than guys like Jenkins, or Fackrell, both third-round picks. Both were caught up in the mess in Miami and it isn't as if Fitzpatrick was disappointing for the Dolphins. He simply wasn't being allowed to settle into one position, something the Steelers let him do. Fitzpatrick was a can't-miss draft prospect in 2018. His resume was light years ahead of the guys you are trying to prop up. Tannehill was also a first-round draft pick.
Nobody said players coming in from elsewhere can't be great. That wasn't the point. Projecting player production isn't about finding a sure thing. Those don't exist. It is about finding a higher likelihood of success. That is part of Dupree's appeal to the Steelers. They have seen him do what they need him to do in their defense. That isn't the case with any of the cheaper replacements you wanted them to sign.
Your argument also assumes Jenkins would have taken that same money to play for the Steelers rather than take the prove-it deal he settled for with the Jets. That is a dubious assumption at best.
Some fans don't like that Bud got tagged, and will make over $15 million next season. Clowney had 3 sacks last season, and there are reports he wants $20 million a year, at least Bud produced last season.
If Bud produces like he did last season, will people want the Steelers to sign him long term then?
No brainer for me, hoping they actually get an extension worked out before this season. I don’t think his last season was a fluke. As much as it will cost now, another good season would price them out.
I can tell ya my answer and it isn't much different than what I have been posting. Let's see TJ will be a FA and is a NO BRAINER to get signed long term. Ben will eat up 41 mil, Haden 15.5, Tuitt 14.9 and MP 14.4. we have 27 guys signed at 168.9 mil and 46 mil of cap space and the rumor is it could go up 30 mil so maybe 76 mil of cap space. We have to sign 24 more guys and 2 of them Bud and Watt could see 20 mil.......so no I am not wanting Bud if he will cost us that much especially if he has another "good" season. jmo
I would not mind if they signed him to what he is worth, not what he can get on the free agent market.