Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Steelersfire, Feb 4, 2020.
I'm not familiar with the smoking gun, but if that is legit, it's pretty bad.
The police report has been on their website for 10 years now and hasn't been refuted, I have to assume it's legit.
For all the Salem witch hunters,. where is the DNA evidence if he in fact did rape the harlot? Seems pretty open & shut with credible evidence not so much with the village gossip.
I said I don’t know if he raped her or not. His behavior up to that point was disturbing at best.
While I appreciate the literary reference, calling her a harlot is a bit much. He is fine and put his sins in the past, but she is a harlot forever? The victim-blaming on this thread is disappointing.
I never said he raped her. I said all along that I don't know. I'm not sure anybody really knows all of what happened in that room. The reports have both of them as being so drunk they don't remember much.
Look at the behavior that got them to that room, especially the bit about having his guys bring her to him, lock the door and then guard it from the outside.
Literary reference, your a hoot formerscribe. No, it's more of a black eye on history in that time & place. Like what this thread evolved into.
Edit: she may be a harlot, she may not be one. Ben may have sinned, he may not have. Do you like playing the all seeing god with your judgements?
I took the use of the word harlot as a reference to The Scarlet Letter. My apologies if I gave you too much credit.
Reading those reports he’s an assclown rapist lol.
when do celebrities take advantage of people? I don’t believe it. Not until he leaves the Steelers
The real question is did they cuddle afterwards?
No witch hunt, just a police report. I drew my conclusions from there. I have never used the word 'rape' regarding Ben and what happened that night btw. I think his actions alone that night (according to the police report) speak for themselves.
I stand by what I said. Specifically, the mere passage of time and having Ben become one of the elder statesmen/ future HOFers of the sport would have naturally changed the perception of him. I'm not saying he deserves that, but I'm saying it would have happened. AB ruined that process. If AB had merely waited a year to bomb on Ben like he did, no one would have taken it seriously. Today I still hear people primarily blame Ben for the dysfunctional locker room and team chemistry - and that's just ridiculous at this point. It's amazing what can change in a year. And Ben doesn't get enough credit for staying quiet with AB taking pot shots all year.
I personally have no desire or need to defend Ben the human being. He is what he is, warts and all. That wasn't the point of the thread.
As to the rape (which also wasn't the point of this thread btw), there are 2 seperate questions:
1) Did it happen?
2) Assuming it did happen, is it possible for someone who does something terrible to be redeemed? Celebrity or not.
Ben has seemingly been happily married for almost a decade with 3 kids. Is redemption possible for him ever?
Kobe is basically being deified worldwide. But that police report seemed more clear cut - the girl had bruises on her neck. I'm curious why anyone would view Ben differently?
I personally believe Michael Vick could and should be forgiven. Rape is obviously less clear cut but intent to do evil is way harder to clarify in those cases.
This is such an unfortunate scenario. I detest celebrities who use their good fortune to influence justice, be it a traffic ticket or forcing unwanted sexual advances. I also detest the people in our society who are so enamored with celebrities that they think it's special to be in the presence of a celebrity and they play games with a celebrity until it reaches a point where they finally wake up and then they want to cry foul.
It's so unfortunate that we have to endure this as part of our beloved sport of football! Thank you NFL for taking over monopolistic control of football in America and making it a corrupt, despicable, ****show!
they kept fighting on who got to be the little spoon
So the only correct usage and context for the word harlot is The Scarlet Letter? Seems a tad myopic, in my opinion.
Browbeating people on an internet message board by trying to act scholarly and cerebral comes across as narrow minded and pedantic. And yes, I understand the hypocrisy in my statement. It was on purpose.
I'm not willing to assume the same thing as I dont know anything about the source. I wouldn't consider it a validated or authenticated source for a court case. Or for that matter, even for a research paper in college.
I have respect for people's conclusions, from every side. I don't respect the labeling of someone who might be innocent, the girl or Big Ben.
Based on what you personally observed?
Yet you were fine doing it to her, if only for effect, earlier in the thread.
No, I was just saying I thought he was making a literary reference rather than seriously calling her a harlot, though using the anachronistic term also works as an historical allusion. My issue was with him referring to the woman as a harlot, but I considered that he might not actually mean it that way because he was making a literary reference.
I'm not acting like anything. I often write in a scholarly manner because I am a teacher. When I am working, I model the proper use of English for my students. Sometimes that spills over into my message board posts.
Based on police reports made public at the time. To be fair, I also strongly defended him regarding the other accusation.
Nice assumption about what the other person meant by the use of a term. I hope you teach and expect your students to verify and validate information before they write about them as fact vs a personal opinion or unfounded conclusion.
Your comments on here can come across as condescending and "I'm smarter than the rest of you." If that is what you are going for, then you nailed it. And if so, then own it. If it isn't what you intend, then consider this as simply feedback. For whatever its worth...
First off, I'll qualify that I dont know the law in regards to police reports or what information in them is considered public information. Were the police reports actually made public by the authorities or did someone get paid by some questionable "news" tabloid to leak some personal stuff? I'm just trying to understand the validity of sources.
Disco I think you might be combining the two separate incidents. The hostess at te golf resort in Nevada was the one bragging to coworkers that she was going to sleep with him and I believe some other things as well (like attempting to get pregnant) ithe was after the incident that she filed charges of assault which were disputed by her coworkers. The Girl in GA had the DTF button on and was reported as being tipsy when her party ran into Ben's party and the girls reportedly followed them to the next bar. I'm not sure there was ever a report of her bragging to her friends that she was going to do him. There were a few accounts by her friends that they were concerned and tried to retrieve her only to be put off by Colon and the off duty State trooper
572 pages of the Georgia Bureau of Investigation report were released to “The Smoking Gun” as part of an open records request.
Just an FYI