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At Least We Won`t Have to Make a Logo Change

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by BigBensBigBong, Jun 17, 2020.

  1. steel machine

    steel machine Well-Known Member

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    That damn chop haunts me in my dreams. I'm an avid Pirate fan and those two playoff series against the Braves still bother me. I had the sound turned down but I could still see those damn arms going up and down.
     
  2. steel machine

    steel machine Well-Known Member

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    I like a "women's LIP movement" in the right place.
     
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  3. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    I was right there with you, brother is a Braves fan and we had to be on separate floors. 30 in 30 did Deion and his year of splitting time between Braves and Falcons and the 91 and 92 NLCS and I had to relive those painful memories, the chop, gimpy Sid Bream rounding 3rd, Bonds and Bonilla all but vanishing during both years.
     
  4. mytake

    mytake Well-Known Member

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    I thought the women's lip movement started when God created Eve.
     
  5. 86WardsWay

    86WardsWay Well-Known Member

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    I was the lone Pirates fan in an Atlanta sports bar with over 500 Braves fans inside where the pirates were winning 2-1 with the bases loaded and Sid Bream :facepalm: scored the winning run barely beating the throw to Mike LaValliere by Andy Van Slyke. I slammed my Budweiser bottle on the table and slashed my hand wide open while the whole city erupted in Jubilation. I kept screaming he was safe! He was safe! while blood was flying everywhere. My buddy who was a St. Louis Cardinals fan was telling me it's just a game while grabbing napkins for me to stop the bleeding.

    I still cannot believe to this day that Jim Leyland pulled Doug Drabek out of that game!

    Here's a recap for anyone interested......


    Game 7[edit]
    Wednesday, October 14, 1992 (8:30PM EDT) at Atlanta–Fulton County Stadium in Atlanta, Georgia

    Team 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 R H E
    Pittsburgh 1 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 2 7 1
    Atlanta 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3 3 7 0
    WP: Jeff Reardon (1–0) LP: Doug Drabek (0–3)
    The deciding game of the NLCS featured the third matchup of the series between John Smoltz and Doug Drabek. Smoltz was an MVP candidate for the series, having started and won both of his games. Drabek had struggled in his two starts, failing to make it past the fifth inning in either matchup. However, the Pirates were carrying momentum from their previous two wins, having knocked out Steve Avery in the first inning and Tom Glavine in the second on their way to outscoring the Braves 20-5, and looked to become the first team to win the NLCS after trailing 3-1. The game that followed was regarded as one of the greatest ever, as years later MLB Network ranked it the fourth best game of all-time.[15]

    The Pirates scored first as Alex Cole led off with a walk, advanced to third on a double by Andy Van Slyke, and scored on a sacrifice fly by Orlando Merced. The Pirates would add a run in the sixth as Jay Bell scored on a single by Van Slyke, and the lead held up as Drabek pitched his best game of the series in holding the Braves scoreless. The closest the Braves got to breaking through was in the sixth inning, when Drabek allowed three consecutive singles to Mark Lemke, Jeff Treadway, and Otis Nixon to load the bases. Jeff Blauser, however, lined into an unassisted double play and Terry Pendleton lined out to Barry Bonds in left to end the threat.

    An incident involving the umpires early in the game set a different tone that would come into play later on. In the second inning, home plate umpire John McSherry became ill and complained of nausea and dizziness.[16] After being checked out by the stadium medical staff, McSherry was removed from the game as a precaution and first base umpire Randy Marsh was summoned over from his position to take over behind the plate.[17] The move gave both Smoltz and Drabek a different target to hit for strikes as Marsh had a consistent strike zone that was much tighter than McSherry's. This was also the first public sign of what would later prove to be fatal cardiac issues for the veteran umpire; it was one of five times he would leave games with similar symptoms, and in 1996, on Opening Day in Cincinnati, McSherry went into cardiac arrest and died on the field at Riverfront Stadium while behind the plate.

    Entering the bottom of the ninth, Drabek had only allowed five hits in eight shutout innings and the Pirates were three outs away from advancing to their first World Series since 1979. If the lead held, Braves manager Bobby Cox would have become the first manager in the era of seven-game LCS play to have blown two 3-1 series leads and lost; Cox previously had seen this happen in 1985, when his Toronto Blue Jays lost to the eventual world champion Kansas City Royals after being one victory away from going to the World Series.

    Pirates manager Jim Leyland sent Drabek out for the ninth to complete the shutout, with the middle of the Braves' order due up. The first batter, Terry Pendleton, doubled. David Justice followed by hitting a sharp grounder to José Lind, who was eventually awarded a Gold Glove at second base for the season.[18] Lind, however, misplayed the ball and runners were at the corners with nobody out. Drabek then walked Sid Bream on four pitches, which moved the tying run into scoring position and loaded the bases.

    With the winning run now on base and Ron Gant scheduled next, Leyland made a pitching change and brought in his closer, Stan Belinda, to make his second appearance of the series and attempt to preserve the victory for Drabek, who was responsible for all three baserunners. Gant hit a deep fly ball that was caught by Bonds, enabling Pendleton to score and put the Braves on the board. Damon Berryhill was the next batter and worked a 3-1 count out of Belinda, then walked on the fifth pitch of the at bat, which Marsh called a ball that appeared to be a strike. There was speculation that at least two of the pitches called balls to Berryhill may have been strikes with McSherry still behind the plate. [6][16][19]

    With the bases once again loaded, the Braves sent up Brian Hunter to pinch hit for second baseman Rafael Belliard. Belinda was able to get Hunter to pop out, which brought the Braves down to their final out and put the Pirates one step closer to erasing the 3-1 deficit and advancing to their first World Series since their 1979 championship. Francisco Cabrera, a seldom-used utility player who had spent most of 1992 in the minor leagues, was sent to the plate to pinch hit for pitcher Jeff Reardon.[16][16][20][21][22]

    On the third pitch, with Belinda behind 2-0, Cabrera ripped a foul line drive to left field. After the play, Van Slyke and Bonds got into a brief argument as Van Slyke signaled to the left fielder to move in so he could cut off a potential single and keep the runners from scoring; Bonds gave Van Slyke the finger and refused to move.[16][23][24] Sure enough, Cabrera again lined a pitch to left that dropped in front of Bonds for a hit.[25] Justice scored from third easily, which tied the game.[16][21][24] Bonds came up with the ball, but was out of position and had to throw across his body.[24][25] Third base coach Jimy Williams spotted this as Bream, running on five-times surgically repaired knees and thus, one of the slowest baserunners in the league, got to him at third. Williams decided to wave Bream in, thinking the off balance throw might not reach catcher Mike LaValliere in time for him to tag the slow-footed first baseman. Bonds' throw was indeed offline, which caused LaValliere to move to his right to field the ball just before Bream got to the plate. The extra motion allowed Bream to slide in ahead of LaValliere's tag, and the Braves won 3-2.[16]

    The victory was picked up by Jeff Reardon, who pitched the ninth inning. The loss was charged to Drabek, who took his third defeat of the series--though two of the three the runs he was charged with were unearned, stemming from the Lind error. Smoltz, with his two victories and solid start keeping the Braves in the game in Game 7, was named the series MVP.

    Andy Van Slyke sat motionless in centerfield for several minutes after the game ended, while the Braves celebrated at home plate.[26]

    In the celebration at home plate after Sid Bream's pennant-winning slide, Braves pitcher Kent Mercker was hurt and unable to pitch in the World Series.

    Game 7 of the 1992 NLCS marked the first time (and to date, still the only time) in MLB history that a team which was one out away from losing in a winner-take-all game of a playoff series instead won on the last pitch.[26] To date, Francisco Cabrera is the only player in MLB history to win a postseason series with a hit during an at bat in which he could have lost the series with an out. All other series walk-off hits occurred either with the score already tied (as with Bill Mazeroski's 1960 World Series winning home run) or in a game that was not winner-take-all, as with Joe Carter's home run to win the 1993 World Series, which occurred in Game 6.

    The March 1993 issue of Baseball Digest pronounced it the greatest baseball comeback ever,[27] as did John Smoltz immediately after the game.[16] A 2006 study by the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette pronounced Cabrera's game-winning single the eighth-"clutchest" hit in MLB history.[28] ESPN called the Pirates' defeat the eighth most painful in baseball history.[29] Don Ohlmeyer, the former head of NBC Sports and President of NBC West Coast, supposedly called the event "one of the most exciting baseball moments he had ever seen," albeit regretting the time of day it took place.[30]

    Game 7 was the last postseason game for the Pirates until 2013, when the team faced and defeated the Cincinnati Reds in the National League Wild Card Game. The Pirates also went 20 years without a winning season after 1992. Game 7 was the last Pirates game for Bonds and Drabek who left via free agency, signing with the Giants and Astros, respectively.

    Until 2008, the Braves were the last team in Major League Baseball to win a seventh game after blowing a 3–1 series lead, and only the fourth of eleven total to do it up to that point. That year, the Tampa Bay Rays won Game 7 of the ALCS after blowing a 3–1 lead to the Boston Red Sox.
     
  6. steel machine

    steel machine Well-Known Member

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    I still cannot believe to this day that Jim Leyland pulled Doug Drabek out of that game!

    And I loved Leyland but me and a few family members were calling him every name in the book. I still wish he put Wakefield in. I think he said he could go and the Braves couldn't handle that knuckleball.

    I knew even back then that I lost my chance to ever see my boys win a WS again. Didn't think we would go on a 20 year losing streak. The WC teams were not strong enough to go the distance.
     
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  7. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    For those that worried this would turn into a political thread. It didnt. It turned into a Pirate thread.:roflmao::roflmao:
     
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  8. BigBensBigBong

    BigBensBigBong Well-Known Member

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    I don`t watch/follow baseball anymore. Seems ridiculous to care about any given regular season game because there is a 162 game schedule. At least the NFL is short and sweet and every game matters.
     
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  9. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    I thought it would turn into a thread about nose tackles again. Fat guys matter. :cool:
     
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  10. KnoxVegasSteel

    KnoxVegasSteel Well-Known Member

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    Especially that gawd awful atrocity of the murderous thug that sits in front of M&T bank stadium. That thing need to be toppled and shat upon.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  11. KnoxVegasSteel

    KnoxVegasSteel Well-Known Member

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    That might be worse. In related news, white bread is now called bread that fully reflects and scatters all the visible wavelengths of light.
     
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  12. jeh1856

    jeh1856 Beer is good

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    Are we still allowed to call people rednecks?
     
  13. Da Stellars

    Da Stellars Well-Known Member

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    Redskins, I think should change the name. Seems wrong to me. Although I will say I have a friend with indigenous ancestry and he is a lifelong Skins fan and doesn’t seem to have a problem with the name, so WTF do I know?

    I don’t think there is any thing offensive about the Chiefs as a name on its own. Same with the Braves and Seminoles.

    Cleveland Indians is a peculiar name just cause no one really says “Indian” anymore. They retired the Chief Wahoo logo, which was a good move IMHO.
     
  14. 86WardsWay

    86WardsWay Well-Known Member

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    I'm more of a hillbilly but you can call me what ever you want.

    Not offended for over 50 years.
     
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  15. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    I've been through this process twice in my life. In 1991 my high school came underfire for our Redskins nickname. The school was already well over 100 years old with some proud traditions as well as sport championships but it was a public school and with state and federal money funding it you can't have a negative stereotype as a mascot. Just like you said most of the students who were of Native American ancestry had little to no problem with it but broader activism is what brought the subject to the forefront. My senior year the Redskins had been retired, we were just GFC and the following year in 93 the became the Knights.

    Next was the fight between the NCAA and UND over the Sioux nickname and imagery. It was a long nasty fight because of the 100+ history of the school, several tribal ceremonies gifting the name to the school, testimony about how the name was a source of pride to many Native Americans in North Dakota and so on. Again lots of NA didn't mind but the claim that it wasn't use to degrade Native Americans was laughable at best due to things like NDSU students making t-shirts with a kneeling NA brave orally satisfying the NDSU bison. The instate rivalry had lots of examples like that. Eventually after long legal battles and millions of dollars spent for and against the name was retired and Fighting Hawks became the new nickname and logo. Side point it was really awkward to see ESPN showing UND men's hockey in the Frozen Four wearing generic North Dakota jerseys but the fans behind them decked out in Fighting Sioux gear splashed all over the screen.

    As with anything there are those who don't care or who aren't offended and it just isn't a big deal for them. They are also those that see a bigger picture and are moved to educate people.

    One thing I have always found fascinating is how the natural progression of Native American culture seems to have been completely stopped by the introduction of European culture to the country. Its like it has been stuck on pause for the last 200 years or more. Among the plains tribes the traditions of the past are very much of the present and so little if any progression from those traditions or building upon them. Its like they are waiting for something.

    Sorry about the long post guys just letting the mind wander where it will today.
     
  16. Da Stellars

    Da Stellars Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely the derogatory Sioux T-shirts were offensive. I think that is why I mentioned "the name alone" of Chiefs doesn't seem offensive to me, but at the same time there certainly might be applications by the fandom that could be offensive. But I feel you shouldn't throw out the baby with the bath water in that instance. There certainly is no malice naming your team Sioux, and you will always have idiot fans making dumb fan art, like Calvin and Hobbes pissing on the Browns logo for example.

    I think if you really want to get historical... Vikings and Spartans were awful people. Vikings raped and pillaged, and Spartan society was based on enslaving their Greek neighbors.
     
  17. Iowasteeljim

    Iowasteeljim

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    I'm offended by everything...even myself now for typing that!
     
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  18. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    Don't you remember a few years ago that all the animal mascots in the NFL and college came under fire? There are groups that will find offense in anything. Nothing is sacred and nothing is off-limits. The scary thing is that once the door is opened, it won't shut. Once a team caves and allows their mascot/identity to be desecrated, the others will topple like dominoes.
     
  19. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    How could you be so insensitive to yourself? That is offensive. I'm organizing a group to protest you and your blatant xenophobia even though you exhibited no xenophobia.
     
  20. KnoxVegasSteel

    KnoxVegasSteel Well-Known Member

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    mmmm, Xena....
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 1
  21. 86WardsWay

    86WardsWay Well-Known Member

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    In general. That is exactly what is happening in the USA right now with everything. Don't like something. Trash it on social media and to will be gone in a matter of days.

    Craziest thing I seen with the protesters is trashing Stevie Ray Vaugn's statue in Texas. Stupid Anarchist don't even care who they attack just as long as they destroy something, anything.
     
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  22. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    End your comment with GO STILLERS!! :herewego: to keep it "on topic" or I'll wrap a chain around it, pull it down, set it on fire, and claim I'm peacefully protesting that you capitalized "Anarchist."

    GO STILLERS!! :herewego:
     
  23. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    xena.jpg
    Looks like a peaceful protestor if I've ever seen one.

    GO STILLERS!! :herewego:
     
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  24. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

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    The Rooneys are getting blasted from both sides now.

    Go Stillers! :herewego!:
     
  25. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    I can't see this going well for the NFL in general. When you start taking sides, you sew divide. The NFL is in a bad spot because if they do nothing, they anger the protestors. If they side with BLM and the resistance, they alienate themselves from the sane. Either way, they lose. We're in for some dark times because I don't see how we stop the country from being ripped apart. There definitely needs to be change. But the country shouldn't be destroyed in the process. You don't build bridges with bombs. You don't bring people together with anger and violence. And you don't combat injustice with lawlessness. The message is being lost in the delivery.
     
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