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Adams be Fitzpatrick trade

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Kurt McCammon, Jul 27, 2020.

  1. Kurt McCammon

    Kurt McCammon New Member

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    Long time stalker to the posts first time posting. Curious to people’s thoughts of the Adams trade compared to Fitzpatrick. To me seems like Colbert got a deal didn't give up as much. Thoughts ?
     
  2. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    The Adams trade vs the Minkah trade should be an easy assessment. However, it is a bit more intricate than others are willing to give it credit for. There are different circumstances in play here.



    To start out, Jamal has already established himself as arguably the best Safety in the NFL. In terms of skillset, outside of being a true Single High Safety, there really is not anything he cannot do as he acts as essentially a "fifth 'backer" of sorts; similar to how Troy was used albeit with lesser range than Troy. Also, he was a two time All Pro before landing in Seattle; Second Team in 2018 and First in 2019. Jamal was more decorated than Minkah which likely inflated the trade value as a whole. As such, the price to acquire Jamal would have been steep to begin with.





    As for Minkah, the major aspect many ignore is that Minkah is still on a Rookie Contract. In addition, while Minkah showed flashes of being a budding star as a Rookie, where he would be used was why so many were critical of the trade. Turns out, like Tyrann Mathieu, Minkah can be deployed anywhere. The major difference between Matheiu and Minkah is that Minkah has more athleticism, size, versatility and instincts than Tyrann did when he entered the league. However, that still did not deter those to critique the trade; some even calling him a luxury pick up. Turns out that said statement was wrong in the long run for the 2019 season.




    In short?! Too early to tell for me as odd as that sounds. The first aspect is how those traded picks will help the likes of Miami and New York in the long run. Too many assmptions and no evidence is the current issue for problem number one..



    The second aspect to this equation is the amount of impact each player can provide for the team. Minkah has been an instant, impact player thus far. Not much is known as to how well Jamal will perform with Seattle in his inaugural debut with the Seahawks. However, given Jamal's style of play similar in ferocity to Troy, I doubt Pete Carroll, Troy's College Coach, will have much of an issue. Even so, anything can happen; COVID-19 interference doubly so.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
  3. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    I think the Steelers got a much better deal than the Seahawks. For me it’s not even close.
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
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  4. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Welcome to the board, well, to posting anyway :drinks:

    Colbert definitely, only cost 1 first rd pick and Minkah paid immediate dividends, great trade.

    Could come out smelling even better if Adams flops in Seattle.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    This is what I am waiting on.



    I definitley agree that the Steelers have the better trade deal between Minkah vs. Jamal.... thus far. However, this proverbial race is not over just yet. How well Jamal Adams can perform in Seattle for this season will provide better clarity for me.
     
  6. KnoxVegasSteel

    KnoxVegasSteel Well-Known Member

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    Just based on the pay difference and number if 1st round picks exchanged, it isn't even close. We are talking about arguably the 2 best safeties in the league and 1 of them is behind 30 other guys on the pay scale for safeties. Granted he is on a rookie deal, but still, we are talking about value right now. Plus, the fins got a decent CB with that 1st round pick but is he going to be a top 10 or even 20 CB? Who knows. The steelers made a better deal by a long shot.
     
  7. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    Minkah was exactly what Pittsburgh needed and he fitted their defence seamlessly, great trade, no qualms whatsoever about what they gave up.

    Adams is on a HOF trajectory, he is a phenomenon and I think he will be amazing in Seattle if he can stay clear of injuries. Seattle gave up a lot though. I would not have made that trade quite frankly, given the position he plays and the amount you have to pay him relatively soon.

    I don’t think you give up multiple first rounders for anybody except a QB tbh. The Bears did it for Mack and you could argue it worked for a season but they have slipped back in to mediocrity again, albeit the Trubisky pick in 2017 was probably even more damaging. Has there ever been a situation where that kind of huge trade worked out and put a team over the top? I can’t think of one.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. Wardismvp

    Wardismvp Well-Known Member

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    Not even close and I really like Jamal Adams.
    Seattle gave up too much.
     
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  9. KnoxVegasSteel

    KnoxVegasSteel Well-Known Member

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    You make a really good point. I can't think of a situation where giving that much up for 1 player put a team over the top. However, there are so many examples of just the opposite. I would have to look up who the raiders got with the draft picks they acquired for Mack but nothing jumps out at me. Of course the most epic of all time was when Ditka traded away every pick of the saints to get Ricky Williams. Ricky was more interested in the ganja and touring with Fish. Ditka finished a miserable 15-33 in 3 seasons coaching the Aints.

    On a side note, Ditka should have just left well enough alone when the Bears fired him. But after sitting out of coaching for 5 years, he must have felt like he had something to prove. What he proved was that he should have stayed out of coaching. It still didn't keep him out of the HOF, but sure didn't help.
     
  10. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

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    Jimmy Johnson's trade of Herschell Walker was more epic imo. It worked out well for the Cowpies.
     
  11. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

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    Bettis. Can't remember what the Steelers gave up though.
    T.O. payed off for the Eagles also. Got them to the dance.
    Maybe not blockbuster trades but did pay off for acquiring a star player.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
  12. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    Bettis was a steal though, they swapped second round picks and I think they gave up a third for him. They virtually stole Bettis.

    Of course there are instances where trades have worked out, the question I was posing is whether there is one where a team sells the farm for a player and it works out?

    The Mack trade, Jamaal Adams, Jalen Ramsey to the Rams. Bad business as far as I am concerned, and not the way to build your roster / franchise.
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
  13. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

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    The only instance I can recall that involved selling the farm working out for either side would be the H. Walker trade.

    Trading for a superstar helps in the brand image department. Good for newer franchises that have limited history. Teams that relocate also benefit from the star appeal that a player can bring.

    Agree about Seattle giving up too much. It probably won't look bad for Seattle because the Jets still need a pigskin prophet to make it work. Gase has a chance to become the next great football mind but I have my doubts.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
  14. steel machine

    steel machine Well-Known Member

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    I just hope we get to talk about the pros or cons in January.
     
  15. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    The Minkah trade will go down as the second-best Steelers trade, only behind Jerome Bettis. Speaking of the Bettis trade, Labs was quoted as saying, "Nobody from the Steelers was indicted for robbery that day, and the statute of limitations since has expired.” Hopefully, a similar quote will be said about the Minkah trade 7 years from now.
     
  16. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    We gave up a second round in 1996 and a fourth round in 1997 in exchange for Bettis and the Ram’s third round pick. Grand larceny.
     
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  17. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    Where would you rank Farrior and Hartings?
     
  18. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    Weren't they free agent signings, not trades?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    You might be right, my days have been mingling together lately. Pretty sure I need normal routine again
     
  20. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    As far as acquisitions (trade or free agent) go, if I'm right in a few years, they will easily rank below Minkah's acquisition. As of right now, they both produced more for the Steelers than Minkah has just from a quantity standpoint.
     
  21. jeh1856

    jeh1856 Hello

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    He is.

    I had the same thought initially.

    :drinks:
     
  22. Mike T

    Mike T Well-Known Member

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    I take Minkah all day long.

    WE traded a 1st for a stud player that is also a high character guy

    Seattle traded 2 1st round picks for a stud player that is very low on the character side.

    lets not forget that Adams wants to be in Dallas. He wanted a new contract and now that hes going to seattle all of a sudden hes OK with not signing a new contract? why do you think that is? he wants to be in dallas.

    I just simply would not trade for anyone ever that has bad character or leans way to much onthe ME ME ME side like this guys does.
     
  23. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    Not sure Adams is a particularly bad character tbh. He was in a really bad situation in New York, a team going nowhere and he wanted out. I’d have an issue with the way he went about it but at the end of the day he is a winner and I think he would be a real leader in the right environment. Seattle is perfect for him.

    Re the contract I think he or his agent put out an informal list of teams that he would go to and play on his rookie deal for another year. He knows he is getting paid one way or another.

    Joe Greene did not want to play in Pittsburgh when they drafted him and caused a huge fuss at the time, Jim Kelly did not want to play for the Bills. Nobody questions their character now, in fact they are regarded as the best players in their franchise histories. Both threw their toys out of the pram after they were drafted however. It’s not that unusual.

    Bottom line is that the Jets suck from the top down and no elite players want to play there. Douglas may turn it around, but in the age of player power it’s no surprise to see their best players acting out right now.

    If the Browns suck again next year just stand back and watch the meltdown as their stars look to jump ship. Social media has given these guys a platform to complain and put pressure on their employers and the trend is only going one way.
     
  24. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Thats not really apples to apples. Those guys didn’t have contracts yet, Adams did and made a stink to get out of it. That’s not good character IMO. Play out your contract and cash in when you are a FA to the team of your choice. And now that he see’s he got his way behaving like that, whats from stopping him from doing it again the next time he isn’t happy.
     
  25. SteelersFanIrl

    SteelersFanIrl Well-Known Member

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    Not apples to apples but there are similarities. I agree Adams should not have acted the way he did but acting out and demanding a trade is not a new thing for NFL players as Steelers fans know only too well. I think he was immensely frustrated in a dysfunctional environment and I can understand wanting out.

    Re his character I am not aware of any legal issues or issues in the locker room with teammates etc. I think his one and only problem was being with a team that was not performing and not improving. I can understand his point of view. It does not excuse his behaviour. I don’t think that will happen in Seattle.

    I’d agree that this is becoming a worrying trend whereby players can air their grievances on social media and engineer a trade for themselves. Not sure what can be done about it unless the league deem it to be bringing the league in to disrepute and start issuing heavy sanctions
     

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