It's not Ben and the offense!

Guess not....

 

Well I THINK what he is trying to say is that our Offense is not TOTALLY innocent in our losses. I know we all agree on that but I think the majority of the time it has been the Offense that's been our shiny spot. I actually think the Philly game was an example of where our D really helped us a lot too. Ryan Clark's forced fumble of Vick on the goal line in retrospect might have even been the game winner. But overall the D has not been up to what we as Steeler fans consider "up to snuff".

 

No one didn't say the defense didn't have "issues" just because the defensee had issues doesn't team the offense didn't have issues also. People just like to pick sides. My point all 3 units didnt do enough to help this team win the games they loss.

 

I guess my opinion is, while the offense can still improve, at least they took steps forward from last year. The defense is the same, if not worse, then last year and going all the way back to the Super Bowl v. Green Bay. This is just SO frustrating to me. I think we are all pretty much saying the same thing here. The D has big issues but the O also has some room for improvement.

 

I agree. The defense had injuries to it's two best players. That certainly had impact on the defense. When one unit isn't performing well it's up to the strength to do it's best carry the team to win games. That's what good teams do. Good teams find ways to win games. The season isn't over so we shall see.

 

Of course they're responsible, just as responsible as the offence. I don't think anyone in here is saying the defence doesn't deserve blame. He'll, I've been blasting the defence this year, but the offence is also responsible for our current place in the standings. The defence isn't always going to hold the other team. The other team gets paid to make plays as well. We need TD's instead of FG's. We haven't been very good in that department, and until that improves, the offence deserves some of the blame.

As for Ben being in the MVP conversation, he's not quite in that category. Sure, he hasn't thrown many INT's, but he's trailing in yards and TD's. Rodgers has only thrown 1 more INT but has 8 more TD's. That's a huge amount after only 7 weeks, especially when considering Rodgers started slow and looks to be back on track now. Brees is also having a great year and is right up there with Rodgers as the early favourite for MVP (at least for QB's). Plus Eli and Brady have quite a bit more yards and slightly more TD's.

Ben is having a great year, and if he picks it up perhaps he'll be in that conversation, but he's not there right now, the stats just don't support it.[/quote:3cz0ivfk]

LOL, that's hysterical that you don't even think he's in the conversation, not that he is MVP but that he doesn't even deserve consideration. He's currently ranked 5th in the league but hey, not in the discussion. And I already said that I feel the offense can improve but lets approach this a different way, if you had to pick one that is more responsible for our record, which would it be?[/quote:3cz0ivfk]

If I had to pick, I would say the offence is performing closer to expectations than the defence is, but believe me, the offence still gets part of the blame for our record. Special teams also needs to take some of the blame, they don't get off the hook either.

As for Ben being MVP, he isn't putting up enough stats to support that. I don't care that his WR's are dropping easy TD's, that will never show up on a stat sheet. Unless Ben starts throwing for more yards and more TD's, he's not going to be in the discussion, and no, he's not currently in the discussion right now. Yes, he's 5th in total yards per game amongst QB's, but he's 10th in TD's so he's not even quite at the top as for as just QB's go. Then if you include every position into the MVP category, there's no room for the 5th-10th ranked QB in the conversations.

If Ben starts throwing for more yards and definitely more TD's, then he can put himself into that conversation, but how can you even say he's in that conversation now when he's somewhere in between the 5th and 10th ranked QB in terms of the stats that truly matter for the MVP award, and that's just at his position?

 

See you seem to be giving the defense a pass. You did it when talking about the raiders game by basically blaming the offense for not scoring in the 4th quarter. The offense scored 31 points! The defense allowed 34 points! There's NOWAY that team should be putting up those kind numbers on us!! 31 points should have been more than enough to put that team to rest.

Now you're trying to say you agree with FeartheBeard's post but you conveniently write that our D's two best players had injuries and that has had an impact on them. What about the o-line injuries the offense has suffered? There's definitely room for improvement on all sides of the ball but the OP's point was that some are pinning it more on the offensive side when it should be obvious that the D is struggling more.

 

Why are we trying to defend one side of the ball and blast the other side? Does it really make a difference? It's a team game that requires execution from everyone who touches the field, offence, defence and special teams. If all 3 don't execute, it's going to be tough to win most weeks.

 

Yes, when it's replying to what the OP wrote. He's stating that some are blaming the offense for our troubles when it's the D that has been the biggest gaffe in our game. Some happen to agree with him.

 

i agree there is enough blame to go around on all 3 phases of our team. it's a team game. we win as one and we lose as one.

 

You can toss a lot of blame for the raiders and titans losses on DL, if you remember the game winning drives in those games they are almost identical, the steelers for some reason blitz everyone up the middle leaving the middle of the field wide open, therefore leaving the crossing pattern wide open for the catch and run into field goal range.

 

LOL at this thread.

If it had been started in October of 2011, or if a certain someone else was still in charge of the offense, I would bet ANYTHING that the tone would be completely different.

 

Of course it would be. The last 5 years, the playcalling was holding us back. This year, the playcalling is helping us succeed, although the execution is holding us back a little bit. The offence this year compared to last year is day and night. Just look at Heath Millers numbers compared to the last 5 years. We're finally using him to his potential.

Look at what Bruce Arians is doing in Indy. He's barely using his TE's. Coby Fleener, who is very talented and already has a ton of chemistry with Luck, is being wasted. His RB's are being wasted as well, not that he has a pro bowl calibre RB on the roster, but Donald Brown showed last year that he can put up some big numbers. Bruce Arians is awful!

 

I didn't give the defense a pass they didnt play as well as expecfed. However, you can't ignore that the units two best players didn't play much.

The offense and the defense didn't do enough to win vs the raiders. 31 points wasn't enough to win vs the raiders it is what it is.

The op stated it's not Ben and the offense when it's clear the offense failed just like the defense failed in the losses.

 

Last year:
PPG 21st
YPG 11th
RZ TD% 17th
TOP 1st

This year so far
PPG 17th
YPG 11th
RZ TD% 17th
TOP 2nd

Aside from a slight improvement in PPG, offensively this team isn't any better this year than last. And the litany of problems listed above are exactly the same ones as last year...and in years prior...yet it is suddenly all the defenses fault.

 

:bs: Not me! If BA would have shown some competence in his play calling like Haley has I would have been thrilled.

 

those stats are nice, but you have to remember they are still trying to get a full grasp on Haleys offense. this is his first year and hes got a lot of young guys at skill positions. the 2 vets are Ben and Miller and they look pretty good so far.

if those stats are the same in 5 weeks with no sign of improvement than it wont look so good, but 6 games in is way to early to start comparing Haleys offense to Arians.

if they can eliminate all the drive killing penalties and all the dropped passes, this offense looks much better than anything we saw from Arains offense. this offense is much more balanced. i kn ow they are still passing more than running, but a lot of those passes are short passes which work just like a run.

 

Exactly. There just didn't seem like there was a proper plan in place when watching BA's offense. My blood pressure thanks the Steelers for replacing him

 

He has no shot at MVP unless the Steelers win the division and make a play-off run. MVPs come from teams that are winning.
He is having a good year and I like the way the offense is going. The Defense is not what most Steeler fan want to see. Some of that is because the league has marginalized defense as a whole by tweaking all the rulles toward the offenses to get more scoring. Man I hope the NFL doesn't follow the NBA.

The offense does need to score in the 4th qtr, regardless of what has happened up until that point in the game. If the offense does not score in the 4th and continuously gives the ball to the other team in the 4th, combacks against us will happen. This is not just a Steeler issue, but an issue for every team. I have seen it in many other games this year. Watch other game too - derfenses can be good, but none are shut-down now-a-days, because the rules favor the offense so much. We need to take advantage of these rules too.

BTW did anyone see how the TB receivers go up and get the ball last night. With Williams and Jackson, Freeman just throws it high near them and they go get it. While Wallace has the speed to beat a defense, he does not do that type of thing.

 

I agree, unless Ben starts putting up close to record breaking stats and the team wins more games due directly to his play he's not going to be MVP. The precedent is set in regard to previous MVP winners at QB.

You are right in regard to 4th QT leads. The rules put defenses at a huge disadvantage. I staTed before that the days of consistently dominating defenses are probably over.

Wallace doesn't appear to have the hops to go up and get the ball.

 

I don't know if people aren't grasping the point of this thread or if they are just playing favorites. One of the things I hate about message boards is peoples inability to be honest and objective. Case in point, I have always been a defense guy, love love love the defense but I'm backing the offense in this thread because it is painfully obvious the defense has sucked and not carrying its weight. The offense has done its job every game, could they have done more? Of course but at what point does the defense have to do its job? They haven't, the offense has. If you had to pick which unit is more responsible for our slow start and you don't pick the defense as your answer you are not paying attention. As for Ben, I notice that the 2 people who are trying to discredit him are two of his biggest detractors, I would expect nothing less from them on that topic. Bens is indeed having a remarkable year, if he keeps this up he very well may win the MVP.

And yes, more of what we saw from the defense last week [/quote:ytk1vtiw]

Where the hell did I discredit Ben? Take your blinders off. I'm honest and objective, you are being neither in this thread. Ben is not in the MVP running and I posted the stats to back that claim. Not only are we a .500 team, but we're also 17th in points for per game. That alone would remove Ben from MVP running unless he had the most TD's and passing yards. He's 5th in yards for, and 10th in TD passes. There is no way in hell any QB will win the MVP award if he is 10th in TD passes and 5th in yards per game. Not only will the QB's above him in the stats department get voted in as MVP before him, but so will the top RB's and WR's. I have not discredited Ben once, in fact, I just made a thread a week ago talking about how he's having a career year. Simply put, if you actually take your blinders off and look at the stats, Ben is not in the MVP conversation. Stats do not lie, and stats are all that matters when we're talking MVP.

So if Ben keeps his current pace up, he has a 0 percent chance of winning MVP. If he starts throwing for more yards per game and much more TD's, then perhaps he will be in the conversation by the end of the year. There's no chance in hell they will give him the MVP with a little asterisk that says "Was actually the 7th best QB, but his WR's dropped a lot of balls, so we're giving him the MVP."

We can sit here and talk about how he's played at an MVP level and his WR's have let him down, but that's completely irrelevant and will not be taken into consideration whatsoever when voting for MVP. He either has the stats or he doesn't, and right now, he doesn't. Depending on how you view it, he's at best the 5th rated QB, and at worst the 10th rated QB. Either way, that is not good enough to be MVP. TD's and yards carry the most weight, not passing rating, not completing percentage, and not INT's, although those of course do get factored in. But if he is 10th in TD's thrown at the end of the year, you will not hear his name mentioned for MVP by anybody.

 

There were PLENTY of drive killing penalties in the past years. The Oline didn't just start to look like trash this year. But those things were conveniently over-looked as were other mistakes including the drops. And how can it be more balanced? They were 16th last year running the ball 42% of the time, while they are 22nd this year running the ball just 38% of the time. The short passes are just a characteristic of Haleys offense. The results are just about the same...so far. Hopefully it gets better, but as of now, results wise, this offense is strikingly similar to years past.