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Haden, Vince staying put

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Blast Furnace, Mar 4, 2021.

  1. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

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    It was Varsity by the way and a bunch of NFL playbooks look exactly like what our Confernce ran ..If playing a Team that likes to pass a lot then a 4-2-5 is much more effective than a 3-4 it's really just common sense ..Do you want your 250 lb guys guarding 200 lb guys ? Nope you want some faster and better pass defenders on the field..
     
  2. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

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    Its really more about film study and understanding route combos the same as it is in HS, College, and the NFL..As a DB you know where a specific QB likes to throw on certain routes and where those throwing windows are .. As a Robber the DB does his best to jump one of those windows ..So yes a 4-2-5 is more effective than a 3-4 vs. the pass and as th NFL keeps evolving to the same stuff we ran in HS Defenses will also evolve to more Safety looks and less LB looks..

    Teams have already started moving Safeties to LB'S and getting smaller faster LB'S to give them better coverage guys on the field the 4-2-5 concept is just a natural counter to the passing game..
     
  3. Seven4Steel

    Seven4Steel Well-Known Member

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    Not meaning to argue with you. You have a more specific knowledge of this than I do. But everything is cyclical. Smaller, faster defenses counter smaller, faster skilled position players until offenses begin putting bigger, stronger skilled players on the field that can overpower smaller opposition. A 4-2-5, as you call it, will likely be exposed with RPOs and TE's engaging the line and dropping out into patterns, hanging your "robbers" out to dry, removing at least 2 bodies from the point of attack.
     
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  4. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

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    You make some very good points the weakest part of this Defense is outside runs.. The TE position is going smaller or more pass catching oriented . Of course you must be able to play different Defenses agaisnst different styles of Offenses this is why I have a lot of respect for HS Coaches as they have to play against all kinds of Offenses.. Our conference had 2 Teams that ran spread and zone read concepts focused on quick passing..We had 1 Team that ran Diamond and 1 and it was all QB runs and the screen game .. Of course we had 1 Wing T team playing hide the football .. We had another Team who ran the Pro set they used balance of the run and pass .. We also had a Team run the Georgia Southern Triple Option it is unique in its blocking rules and it's triple option attack..

    So my point is HS is very hard to Coach as you have to be able to run mutiple fronts and multiple schemes and the scheme that I liked the best against the quick passing game was the 4-2-5 ..Then the next week we would play the triple option Team and would play mostly a 6-4-1 with Cover zero or a 3-6-2 cover zero we would switch those up so they couldn't get in a good grove reading their options..
     
  5. Seven4Steel

    Seven4Steel Well-Known Member

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    I didn't play football in HS. I wrestled and rowed crew. Our single A football team was winning back to back to back to back to back state championships in WV running almost exclusively a power I formation on offense and a pretty basic 4-4 on defense. Anyone trying to get cute with schemes or gimmicks got ran over. Maybe HS football is harder to coach these days, but it wasn't that hard to coach back when I was there if you were physically prepared to impose your will on the other teams you faced. Our team was. They played downhill on both sides of the ball. I think a couple seasons we averaged almost 50 points a game and didn't give up more than 10. That wasn't scheme.

    I think you can make things a little too complicated, especially in HS.

    And then there's the NFL, where we played last season with smoke and mirrors because we simply couldn't compete offensively 11 on 11. Coaching football at any level isn't as hard if your team is prepared mentally and physically able to compete. The Steelers were neither.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  6. FootballAnalyst98

    FootballAnalyst98 Well-Known Member

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    How did you like west VA? One of my friends plays for west liberty.
     
  7. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    big difference when you crossed the river in talent. where did you go to HS? i'm from ohio. watched wheeling central win quite a few over there too.:cool:
     
  8. Seven4Steel

    Seven4Steel Well-Known Member

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    Didn't care much for it growing up. Came back and raised my kids here. They couldn't wait to get out, just like their old man when he was their age.

    Sistersville, just before it consolidated. A quick google search gets you some fun facts. Our running back ran for 9 td's and 448 yards against Frontier his senior year. Final score, 76-8. He broke Curt Warner's (Seahawks) records in that game. At some point, he broke most of Warner's high school records. It was a lot of fun watching those guys just bludgeon the other teams into submission. We had trouble filling the schedule with single A opponents and I think we even played AAA teams, but don't hold me to that. I know we scrimmaged AAA teams.
     
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  9. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

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    Ben does it for franchise records.
     
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  10. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    Oh yea I remember Sistersville high. I'm old. I went to st.clairsville. My rb is still 4th all time at Ohio state in rushing. He just won a super bowl ring as the bucs rb coach. He played in the usfl and then for the chargers. The dude was 6-3 240 lbs. back then it was huge. Ran a 10.3 100.:cool:
     
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  11. Roonatic

    Roonatic Well-Known Member

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    Heyward Bey would be better in coverage than Bince.
     
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  12. PWP

    PWP Well-Known Member

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    https://footballtoolbox.net/defense/understanding-the-4-2-5-defense Here is a basic article and it explains how and when the 4-2-5 became popular.As you guys who read it will see it became popular in the 80's to counter the short passing game and the spread .. If you look at some of the schemes then you can see how we tweaked it to be even better against the pass by adding a 3rd. Safety instead of the strong LB.. As I stated earlier by playing press man at the CB and Cover 1 it allows you to put serious pressure on the short passing game...

    So is's not that I am just crazy to think that the 4-2-5 is the future to help play against the spread and RPO stuff it will also have to be tweaked like or similar to how we did it to combat the evolution of the types of Offenses Teams are running..
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2021
  13. FootballAnalyst98

    FootballAnalyst98 Well-Known Member

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    That's how my friend feels. He hates it. I went up there and couldn't deal with it either lol. The school is literally in the middle of nowhere.
     
  14. Seven4Steel

    Seven4Steel Well-Known Member

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    You talking about Tyler Consolidated? If so, look up "boonies" and you'll see a picture of it.

    And think about this, two high schools within 30 miles of each other. Hated each other. Physically fought each other if we shared the same physical space. SHS owned TCHS in football (we kinda owned everyone in football for a number of years). But TCHS thought that every year was THEIR year to grab a W from us. They prepared for one game every season...against us. Their false sense of hope was really cute.

    Then one year later, both schools consolidate and everyone is on the same team. I sure am glad I graduated before that happened. Crypts and bloods, cats and dogs, oil and vinegar, SHS and TCHS. It just doesn't work.
     
  15. mac daddyo

    mac daddyo Well-Known Member

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    Used to race with a guy at Tyler county speedway years ago. Would pass it twice a week.:cool:
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2021
  16. Seven4Steel

    Seven4Steel Well-Known Member

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    Ahh yes, the old oval. Spent quite a bit of time around there in my youth. Didn't go to watch the races much. There were more fun things to do after the lights went out. :hehehe:
     
  17. burghfan58

    burghfan58 Well-Known Member

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    Haden and Vince staying put! Oops, "Haden and Vince staying put!"
     
  18. D0bre Shunka

    D0bre Shunka Well-Known Member

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    They have to keep Haden. He’s still the best we have. Even when he’s beat he’s in there giving it all. That’s all you can ask for from a corner.
     
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