Mike Tomlin

Guess Rod Woodson, Dermontti Dawson, Jerome Bettis, Troy Polamalu and Alan Faneca were average joes!!!

 

I don't care, it was green font, Cowher had top 5 rushing teams and top 5 defenses and did nothing.

 

If green font means it's meaningless, you should just set your default font to green. You will have to be sure to convert Twitter to green as well.

Just sayin

 

Green font means sarcasm, duh

 

A lot of daggers get thrown MT's way. but I believe last year was really a great year of Coaching (going 8-8) with all that team faced. This year he has really continued that with the covid crap, and even the change in bye.

I just read in Asked and answered that the Steelers all time after bye weeks are 19-12. Noll was 1-1, Cowher 8-7, Tomlin is 10-4. I include that simply because I have read so many rimes how the Steelers come out of a bye unprepared, yet the record does not reflect that. That said when was the last time this ream had a P/O win, and went deep into the P/O's? If this team gets to and wins the SB it may just cement MT into 1st year HOF status when he retires, if not I still think he gets there, but may have to wait a bit, JMHO.

 

You're honestly saying that Cowher didn't have a few less than stellar teams during his tenure? Teams that he made into competitors despite an overall average roster?

 

You ain't real brite is ya?

 

What years didn't the Steelers have talent under Cowher? I know the Steelers had a few down years under Cowher. Just because they had down years didn't mean they didn't have talent.

 

No one is disputing Cowher had down years. We are disputing that Cowher didn't have talent. Point out the years so we can check the rosters.

 

Split hairs much? The worst team in the nfl has talent.

 

You lose pimpin. Check the facts before you start posting "fake news". It's par for the coarse for you tho. I don't expect much to change.

 

Imagine Tomlin saying this after a blowout defeat...

 

I have a better idea! Since you want to argue for the sake of arguing it is clear that no matter what roster I bring up, you will say it had talent....thereby "thinking" you have proven your point. Why don't you go back and show us how every Cowher roster was heavily talented?

 

Just admit you were wrong believing Cowher had "limited talent"

 

I remember when he got fired by Green Bay, there were some Steelers fans wanted to fire Tomlin, and hire McCarthy with him being from the Pittsburgh area.

 

I don't recall too many playoff losses or missed playoff births that fell on Ben's poor play. I do how ever recall our defense getting lit up early, sloppy play, blowouts, losses to bad teams, horrible penalties, and bizarre game plans. If you are losing big early and forced into passing on all downs... don't care who you are, most QB's will not do well in that situation. That's why big comebacks are rare....especially in playoff games.

 

We had talent on defense.... consistently put up the best defensive stats most years under Cowher.

We had talent on the line and at RB....consistently near the top of the league in rushing stats.

The most important position on the team? Well how bout that defense!

 

The only serviceable QB's we had during the Cowher years...Neil O...and well uh Tommy Maddox?

We were consistently winning the division and in the playoffs under Cowher with horrible QB's. Not many coaches can say that. Any honest person who actually watched all of the games during this time would admit that is a fact. No one expected us to do anything because of the crap QB's we had....and crap is probably being too generous. The turnovers were unbelievable. Teams knew we couldn't throw the ball and we still would beat them. winning 10+ games per year with no QB is pretty impressive. When our QB's actually played respectably we were fighting for SB's and in Ben's case winning a couple.

 

This is selective memory recall.

What's consistently true of the Steelers is that in most of their playoff losses turnovers were usually the difference in the out come of games.

 

Again, look at his regular season numbers versus his playoff numbers. Heck, just compare his TD% and INT%. Regular season 5.1 TD% and 2.6 INT%. Playoffs 4.4 TD% and 3.6 INT%. Regular season he has a TD to INT ratio of almost 1.95. Playoffs it falls to 1.25. As a general rule Ben has underperformed in the playoffs. Sure he faces better teams in the playoffs but compare him to other franchise QBs. Drew Brees goes from regular season 5.4 TD% and 2.3 INT% to 5.2% and 1.9%. TD to INT ratio goes from about 2.32 to about 2.83. That's right, he gets better. And yet a lot of Steelers fans think Payton is a better coach than Tomlin even though Payton has had the demonstrably better QB in the regular season who ups his game in the playoffs versus Tomlin having a guy who isn't as good in the regular season and then gets worse in the playoffs. Oh, and Tomlin has accomplished more with the inferior QB play. I am not saying this to run Ben down. Ben is clearly the best QB we have had since at least Bradshaw. I am glad we have him but I get tired of the playoff failures falling all on Tomlin when Ben has clearly not been as good as he needs to be in the playoffs. Heck, if you really want to feel annoyed look at Joe Flacco in the regular season versus the playoffs. Flacco has wildly outperformed Ben in the playoffs, with a 5.6 TD% and 2.2 INT%. The facts are that Ben has not just failed to elevate his play in the playoffs but has actually gotten worse. It is what it is. If Tomlin deserves to be blamed for the playoff failures then Ben absolutely deserves some blame as well.

ETA: Rodgers goes from 6.0 TD% and 1.4 INT% to 6.1% and 1.8%.
Brady goes from 5.4% and 1.8% to 4.5% and 2.2%.
Wilson 6.2% and 1.8% to 5.4% and 2.6%.
I think I could probably keep doing this but the point has been made.
All vastly better than Ben's.

 

That won't happen. The argument is subjective, so they place the burden of proof on you. When you don't provide them with some statistic or a brightly colored cartoon to back up your side of the argument, they'll skip and dance around the hickory stump victoriously, squealing like little pigs.

"WEEE WEEE, LOOK AT ME!!! DANCING, DANCING AROUND THIS TREE!! STONE IS WRONG, JUST SING A SONG, BECAUSE WE'RE RIGHT, AS RIGHT CAN BEEEEE!!"

 

It's not about your perception of QB's but how well those QB's did or didn't play. There were times in the past that the Steelers QB's played well enough to help the team win. Kordell had a couple of decent seasons within the confines of the team. Our hopes were high that Kordell could help lead the team to a championship.

 

When the QB doesn't play well it's hard to win games. Add in turnovers and it's a wrap. All people need to do is follow the turnovers to determine the main reason why the Steelers lost the large majority of the time in the playoffs. Hard to win when you beat yourself.

 

Those numbers don't lie. But they might not be painting the most accurate picture either. Personally, I don't think Ben has played his best ball in the post-season. So I'm not disagreeing with your premise. But there's a LOT that those numbers don't explain. They don't take into consideration injury/health of the offense. They don't address TOP or defensive performance that can alter playcalling. They also can't indicate performance of his supporting cast. Could Ben's numbers diminish in the post-season because his supporting cast isn't playing as well? Absolutely.

Again, I don't disagree with the premise that Ben doesn't rise to the level of post-season competition, just that statistics can be misleading.

 

Yeah, I was just trying to show that in general Ben has not been as good as he needed to be in the playoffs and that played a big role in our losses. Now, there are definitely extenuating circumstances. One major one was that we almost always had major injuries to key cogs, but if that is a defense of Ben it is also a defense of Tomlin. My overall point is just that you really can't put the blame on Tomlin without acknowledging Ben's share. People like to cite the lack of recent playoff success with a franchise QB as a way to drag Tomlin but that franchise QB has been at least a part of the problem.