Is Aaron Donald as good as people say he is?

A dominant DT isn't that important, look at JJ Watt in his prime, give me a franchise QB.

 

J.J. Watt is not a Defensive Tackle. He is a Defensive End. For that matter, he was the best player in 2015 when he was tearing NFL Offenses asunder.

 

I blame John Harbaugh for that honestly. Lamar is still young. Sitting Lamar out in the final week of the 2019 Season was nothing but a slap in the face to whomever Baltimore had to play that division week. Sadly so, it just so happened to be a team that could take Baltimore's best strength and use it against them.



Regardless of what Lamar has, the same has to be applied for Mahomes then. Do we all know the same Patrick Mahomes if pieces like Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce to succeed?! Such an argument for both is unfair in my opinion.


Every QB needs some form of assistance to succeed. Neither Mahomes or Lamar are different. Their play styles are. More importantly, how they win the same.



Again, never before in the 100+ NFL History has the league seen QBs under the age of 25 win NFL MVP in their second season. I understand that is getting obnoxious to say but that is the truth. By virtue of their accomplishments, Lamar is the direct challenger to Patrick.



Unless DeForest Buckner or someone else somehow close the gap, Aaron Donald is unchallenged in his domain currently. Therefore, the next best comparison for a player like Donald is to match them up against the top overall players at each respective position. Considering every position currently has a direct peer competitor except him, Aaron Donald has to be the best due to his unrivaled status.



Until a direct threat opposes Aaron Donald, expect more of the same.

 

Hmmm, Mahomes vs Jackson is not really a competition for me.

Consider the spot that KC were in vs the Texans in the playoffs. Mahomes brought them back in to it from 24-0 to win at their ease.

Jackson faced a somewhat similar challenge against Tennessee and he bottled it when he had to abandon the RPO. He is a good passer but not a great one, and it’s a passing league. Don’t get me wrong, he is phenomenal, but if you play QB for a championship team you need to be able to put the team on your shoulders when you are in a tough spot. To date, he has not shown that he can do that. That Ravens offence is completely built around him to play to his strengths and it works to an extent but to win a SuperBowl you will need to win a shootout at some point.

I’d fully accept that the KC offence is a better setup at the skill positions and that should not be disregarded but can anybody really see LJ coming back from 24-0 against playoff caliber opposition to score 51 points regardless of what receivers he has? I can’t.

 

Speaking of Aaron Donald..............his nephew Elliot Donald just committed to Pitt FB program. Just hoping the gene pool runs deep in that family.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...r-pitt-star-aaron-donald-commits-to-panthers/

 

Again guys, in the 100+ League Year History of the NFL, only two players have won that award, in their second season, below the age of 25. For that matter and, this is something that surprised me, there is something else here. Since 1957 when the League established the NFL MVP Award, only two players have ever won the award in a unanimous vote.


The first is Tom Brady in 2010.


The second is Lamar Jackson.



That is it.



Therefore, by virtue of their accomplishments, both Patrick and Lamar are peer competitor's. To be the undisputed number one, nevermind being the best in the game, one has to be unrivaled at his position. Had Lamar not had the season he did, Patrick takes that no contest.



For me, until someone shows otherwise, Aaron Donald is unchallenged in that regard. No other player in his position can replicate what he provides.

 

Lamar had a spectacular regular season as the Ravens ran over teams at their will, he was unplayable while it was all on his terms.

There is no doubting his talent, but there are probably ten or more quarterbacks I’d put under center over him if I need a fourth quarter comeback or if I am chasing a significant deficit. Until he can show that he can do that there is still a question mark for me.

We have seen it in two playoff games now, and even at Heinz field last year that he folds as soon as he doesn’t have the run to open everything up for him. The Steelers would have won that game last year if they had anything at all on offence. They kept the Ravens to under 200 yards on the ground iirc, that was before Tuitt went on IR, Lamar threw several picks as he was forced to pass.

Defensive coordinators on the better teams are too good to let Lamar run riot for the rest of his career. I expect to see adjustments this upcoming season, Lamar will have to adapt and become a better pocket passer. He may well be capable of doing that but I want to see it before anointing him as good as Mahomes. I am sceptical however.

I agree with you 100% on Donald btw

 

If M. Vick had a team around him, he had NFL MVP wrapped up before hitting 25. Lamar is following in NFL running QB footsteps. Jim Haurbaugh took an rpo QB farther than his sister.

 

We will have to agree to disagree on this one.


John Harbaugh in my opinion is to blame for not having the Ravens ready for the game against Tennessee. Not starting anyone against Pittsburgh turned out to be the Ravens' undoing. Again, Lamar is only a little under two seasons in being the starter. Having someone like that sit for three weeks will yield devastating consequences.

 

Doesn't Lamar take any of the blame for the last 2 years aql?
Lamar didn't lose the games himself but he didn't win them with his so called MVP talent either.

 

He has like a 40-50 qb rating in the playoffs. He’s choking

 

His best years may be behind him. Only the running QBs that adapt have MVP careers. Steve Young, Terry Baldshaw, even Doug Flutie would take the reins of a sputtering offense & move it.

 

Optics everyone. Optics.


Had Lamar actually played against Pittsburgh in the final week, we are likely talking a different outcome against Tennessee. As stated before, regardless of his performance, Lamar is not a seasoned veteran that can just sit out. He needed that game time in the final week to maintain his performance streak, the offense included, heading in. The fact that Baltimore looked so sloppy in the First Half against Tennessee ultimately played into Mike Vrabel's hands.



Lamar's Ravens were blowing teams out no doubt. However, they did so due to their readiness game in, game out. Sitting out the final week was a disaster for the entire Offense. Again, I put that on Harbaugh.

 

Year one?! Yes.

Year two?! No.

 

I think Peyton Manning's Colts sat out the final game one year when they had a bye also. Not to mention the 2017 Steelers.
Both got beat.

Edit: 2006 Colts was it.

BUT both these teams put up a better fight than Lamar could muster...

 

Not in terms of that of course. However, we need to look at this as a whole and not by just mere records alone. Again, both are MVPs before the age of 25. Both have been in the playoffs for the first two seasons. More importantly, both have accomplished feats that few others have within their second season.



We must not look at just mere playoff success. We need to look at all feats and accomplishments of both. Furthermore, we must factor in others key points as well; Head Coaches in this case. Andy Reid and John Harbaugh are different no doubt. That said, John Harbaugh saw to Baltimore's demise in 2019. Had that not had happened, who knows how the 2019 NFL Playoffs would have looked like.



At any case, me and you are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. While the general consensus is that Patrick Mahomes is the clear cut best QB, due in part to what the league has seen with Lamar Jackson, I am not so convinced. Until something major occurs to Lamar that causes him to regress, for me, Lamar and Patrick are peer competitors.

 

You are 100% correct. Both the 2006 Colts and 2017 Steelers gave their respective foes a greater challenge. Here in lies the major point of emphasis; Lamar's lack of experience. Starting a little over a season is woefully small. Gaining that extra experience could have made the difference. For that matter, Baltimore's entire Offense should have been playing that game; a half at the very least.

 

I think the single biggest thing that makes Mahomes the clear winner is that he has gone to the big game and won it. Leaving aside the fact that his range and passing skills are superior to Lamar Jackson in my opinion, Mahomes has done it in the playoffs and SuperBowl.

I feel that Mahomes is one of those rare talents that elevates all around him, like Brady, Peyton, Wilson etc. It remains to be seen if LJ is that.

They are both fantastic, but if a new league was starting tomorrow and you have the first pick in the draft there is only one name going on that card for the vast majority of people.

 

Mahomes was a dumb play away from potentially winning back to back rings

 

He was. The Chiefs are in good shape this upcoming season, bringing nearly everyone back. I don’t think Mahomes has won his last ring, albeit the same was said about Rodgers and the Packers after that 2010 SuperBowl win.

When all is said and done I simply cannot countenance how anybody can consider LJ his equal at this point but it is good to hear different opinions on the matter. Personally, my top 5 QBs are

1. Mahomes
2. Wilson
3. Rodgers
4. Watson
5. Jackson

LJ is a rare talent but once again he just has not shown that he can win through the air when he has to. If he does it this year then fair enough. Hollywood Brown is potentially a talent to rival Tyreek Hill and by all accounts he should be healthy going in to 2020 so let’s see what they can do together. I don’t think their 2019 formula of racing in to the lead and burning the opponent off with their relentless running attack will win a SuperBowl. The better teams are too good on both sides of the ball for that.

 

Glad you’re giving wilson love. He’s so good I would take him over Ben in a heart beat and I love Ben. He does more with less kind of player.

ravens formula is great and all but like others mentioned LJ is going to have to air it out from behind some games in order to win a ring. Mahomes and the chiefs not only did that but their defense was elite in shutting opponents down. That’s fantastic coaching

 

Thats just due to bias. It's no way manning in 2014 ahouodbt have been unanimous. He missed it by 1 vote because a Boston reporter wanted brady to be the still only unanimous. He was revoked after that.