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All this talk about Ben and the O

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by MattyMo9, Dec 3, 2018.

  1. MattyMo9

    MattyMo9 Well-Known Member

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    granted he makes some terrible throws and killer turnovers but Ben is not the real problem.

    We will never win a SB with Tomlin and this defense. They are unable to get turnovers or make any adjustments or stops when they have to.

    Last night was a microcosm of this defense. In that second half the Chargers could have had the ball 50 times and we wouldn’t have stopped them once. Any good QB and offensive coordinator will pick this soft zone apart everytime. It’s why we never beat Brady or the Pats.

    Ben is not the problem. Coaching and defense are.
     
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  2. Junebug

    Junebug Well-Known Member

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    There.....fixed that for ya!

    Sorry, but I'm tired of Steeler fans thinking Ben can do no wrong. He's not "Big Ben" anymore, he's "I am nowhere near the QB I used to be Ben", and at times "I'm really stupid Ben". It amazes me that so many of you are in denial about that. Disagreeing with me on a forum doesn't change what I see on the field. As Steeler fans we need to start looking at where Ben's replacement is coming from........AND SOON.
     
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  3. HeinzMustard

    HeinzMustard Well-Known Member

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    3 of the 4 losses this year can be attributed to INTs thrown by Roethlisberger. I say he is a big part of the problem. How many INTs did Rivers throw yesterday? Brady? Watson? Mahomes? Goff?
     
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  4. bigbenhotness

    bigbenhotness Well-Known Member

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    they throw Int's but not Int's where you are in FG position up in a very important game, instead of just taking the sack or throwing it away lol.
     
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  5. FeedTheMachineFTM

    FeedTheMachineFTM Well-Known Member

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    But ,but ,he had that laser to AB
    I’m in Agreement that Ben is one of the problems
    How many times have the Pats fans said WTF was that Tom ,over the years
    You can probably count them with no hands
     
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  6. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Bens interceptions are definitely part of the problem. The thing is, Ben is also a big reason they win.

    I'm ready for a coaching change though. At the very least Butler.

    Thats an interesting question actually. Steelers would likely never get rid of both, who would you rather see replaced?
     
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  7. bigbenhotness

    bigbenhotness Well-Known Member

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    Ben has 3 types of games.

    1. Lights out unstoppable Ben. = 2014 Ravens/Colts games, 2016 chiefs home game, 2017 Titans game, 2018 Panthers game.

    2. Trying to hard Ben = commits turnovers and either comes from behind to steal it or commits a late Turnover to seal a loss.

    3. Bad Ben = all around clunker. Throwing high, missing open targets, playing antsy.

    This year he has been a combination of all 3 pretty much most games lol.
     
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  8. bigbenhotness

    bigbenhotness Well-Known Member

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    We get rid of butler and then we have to go through the growing pains of the new coordinator so Ben is likely done anyways.

    I say we just get rid of both and start fresh. Get some bad seasons in there while dobbs/rudolph grow and hope for the best with revamping the defense.
     
  9. MattyMo9

    MattyMo9 Well-Known Member

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    If anyone on this forum truly thinks the Steelers would be better without Ben I’m sorry you are dead wrong. He’s not Brady. He makes some dumb throws and costs us sometimes but he also always gives us a chance to score 20-30 points. If we had dobbs at QB we would be lucky to score 14 points a game. I agree Ben is declining but he’s still 10x better than what we have as an alternative.

    Ask your self this question. There’s two mins left and we are down 4 or up 4. Down 4 the ball in Bens hands. Up 4 with the D on the field. Honestly who you going to pick. Ben is not the problem. This secondary and coaching is.
     
  10. HeinzMustard

    HeinzMustard Well-Known Member

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    Any proof of this?
     
  11. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Ben is there best option but I hate when people say that about Dobbs. We don't know what they have in him yet but he's already proved everyone wrong by being on the team still.
     
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  12. MattyMo9

    MattyMo9 Well-Known Member

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    Dobbs is a project. Even if he is to become a legitimate NFL starting QB it will take years for him to develop. The way this season is going I assume Dobbs or someone else will start the replacement process after next year. Ben is not getting extended out.
     
  13. sjromano

    sjromano Well-Known Member

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    This times... a kabillion?

    Yeah, he throws INTs. He's the first one to admit that. And the first one to say he doesn't care. He's a gunslinger, and that's what you get. He's going to win more than lose with his mentality, and it's up to the team (D, ST, whatever) to pick up the rest IMO.

    But I will admit recently it seems they come at the worst times. That one last night though. SMH
     
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  14. Junebug

    Junebug Well-Known Member

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    So........ How much longer do you think Ben can/will play? Seems line you think he's invincible and can play forever! Personally, I think we need to seriously start looking for his replacement. Also, why is it when someone on here criticizes Ben, you'd think we just insulted your mother or something. There some serious Ben worship going on here. He's a player, he's getting old, he's not as good as he used to be. Seems like when he retires, a lot of you will just roll over and die.
     
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  15. sjromano

    sjromano Well-Known Member

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    That's not it at all. It works both ways, you see. There are some on here that won't hesitate to place blame on Ben for every thing that goes wrong in a game, even if he had absolutely nothing to do with it.

    But that's certainly not me saying he's Superman and will last forever. Nor that he is blameless for our current woes. He definitely is. But it's rather delusional to think he's the *main* reason.

    And for those of us that have lived through "those times", we know what it was like without Ben, and we appreciate the unique dynamic that he brings. I, for one, have accepted that he is a gunslinger. And along with that comes those times when it just doesn't work.

    Wait until he's gone, and then come back to me and tell me how much you wish he was still around.
     
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  16. More Balti

    More Balti Member

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    If they didn't have Ben they wouldn't have a chance. I agree that he's thrown some bad ones but he's not the problem
     
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  17. GoalLine

    GoalLine

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    Shroedinger's Steeler Fan - both wins and losses are simultaneously the result of Ben and in the event of a tie like this year, within the same game.
     
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  18. knab70

    knab70 Well-Known Member

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    Ben most likely could play the role of a QB till he's 45 as to taking the team to a championship, never again! He'll most likely will milk the remainder of his contract and keep Steeler Nation in distress.
     
  19. Junebug

    Junebug Well-Known Member

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    For his sake, I hope he retires before he's floundering around at QB, like a lot of guys who hang on too long. It's just a bad look, and puts a stain on his career. People will soon go from talking about how good he is to wondering why he doesn't just retire and quit embarrassing himself. He's getting close to that time.
     
  20. Junebug

    Junebug Well-Known Member

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    Been following the Steelers since the early 1970's. I KNOW about "those times". I lived through them. Bradshaw, Harris, Swann, Blier, Joe Greene, Ham and Lambert, and all the rest. I hated that they had to retire, I wish they could have played forever, but I also know when someone is nearing the end. Some here don't. I know it's hard for some of you to believe, but there WILL be football AFTER Ben. He's just another player on a football team. They have a lifespan. Ben is entering the golden years, and IMHO, needs to think about hanging it up soon. He will be replaced.......it happens. Such is the NFL.
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2018
  21. biggbunch68

    biggbunch68

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    And Tomlin woudnt have a job
     
  22. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    The talent is there on defense.... mostly anyway.


    The issue is not personnel. The issue is schematics. Guess who is in charge of that?!



    Keith Butler has GOT to go. Like Dave Mustaine's lyric from the song "Train of Consequences" from the album "Youthanasia":


    "I hocked my brains, packed my bags and headed west!"



    I have stated it before and I will state it again. Keith Butler, I thank you for all you have done. Thank you for allowing the younger players to contribute early. Most of all, thank you for reviving "Blitzburgh" these past two seasons. It was one incredible ride. However, like all rides, they must stop at their final destination.



    We have effectively reached that destination.
     
  23. ThrowToHeath

    ThrowToHeath Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget that Ben led the final offensive drive right down the field to score the touchdown to tie it up. That put the point total at 30. Needing more than 30 points to win a game, even in today's passing league, suggests that there are problems with giving up points.

    Granted, some of the points opposing teams score do come off turnovers by our offense (not just Ben, but fumbles from people like Conner too).

    I do think our defense has been playing betterish recently, but the clear lack of turnovers has been frustrating over the last several years. Also, the inability to shut down the opponents best players and big TEs. Fort played ok, but why was he matched up so much against Allen? Scheme and adjustments just seem to be a problem. Rivers even said post-game that we hardly ever make adjustments.

    As for Ben, he has led us so many times to wins from behind in the fourth quarter. Sometimes, we come up short.
     
  24. TheMatrixHasYou

    TheMatrixHasYou Well-Known Member

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    Even if coaching is the problem, which it isn't, how does change make the team better?

    Which guy should we hire who won't ever lose a game?
     
  25. InBenWeTrust

    InBenWeTrust Well-Known Member

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    We still beating the Patriots
     
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