Lebeau needs to go

DL will retire after this year. I firmly believe he will step down. It's not his system, but he doesn't have the talent to succeed right now. It's not his fault we truly have not one true NFL CB on the roster

 

Let's not forget that our defense has been riddled with injuries. You can't blame that on a coach.

 

Exactly. If we are making a change, then let's actually make a CHANGE.

 

When the GB Packers won the SB, they were missing half their defence. Injuries aren't an excuse and I'm so sick of it being used as an excuse for this team. Our injuries are young guys who have never proven a thing anyway. We're not missing anything with them being out because we've never even had them producing anyway.

Lebeau needs to put his players into the best position to succeed. How is dropping Harrison and Worilds into coverage all the time putting them in a position to succeed? You don't force your players to adapt to your system, you adapt your system to the players that you have on the team. We are blitzing 34% of the time on 3rd downs, that's it. That's not typical for this defence or for Lebeau. He's playing conservative to try to avoid giving up big plays, but we're giving them up anyway.

 

IMHO he is dropping them into coverage sometimes because they are not getting the penetration they need to get to the QB. We have all seen this all year long. They simply do not have the personnel to get to the QB. Harrison showed flashes but he looks like he is being double covered. People to talk about how the coaches on this team never make in game adjustments. I think dropping back into coverage is their means of making adjustments..

 

I don't you have to worry about it, I think this is Lebeau's finally year, I think he may be ready to hang it up. Because I can almost bet that Kiesel, Taylor, Harrison, and Polamalu will either retire or be gone.

 

The Steelers should recognize they are not a dominating smashmouth defense anymore and they should try to do things that complements the offense more. That implies being more of a risk taking team that can create some chaos. They did it in the Houston and Baltimore games a bit and though they gave up their fair share of yards in those games they still made a positive impact.

Because the thing is the conservative approach that LeBeau is taking isn't working anyway. As I noted in a previous posts, the Steelers are one of the worst teams in the league in giving up explosive plays (20 yards or more) and have been one of the worst for going on 4 years. When the team constantly gives up big plays you can't just blame the players - it has to be on the coaches as well.

 

I think earlier in the year he had an interview w/the Post-Gazette where he said he was already thinking about coming back next year.

 

Then that is one really bad adjustment because James Harrison couldn't cover gun safe.

 

He has needed to go for a while now. His defense is not tough to figure out. Fact is, any, and I mean ANY, QB who is remotely accurate can torch this D. And that is not because of lack of pressure. The middle of the field is ALWAYS wide open. Every single play. Only when the other team gets to the 15 or so does it tighten up, but only due to being in a confined space. Now, is Butler better, I doubt it. But there is no way in hell that the Steelers go outside after they have strung him along this whole time. They should, but are loyal to a fault.

 

I agree on some points you made shaner. I like dom capers approach, always have. it seems we keep the LB'ers back for coverage because the DB's can't cover as well, which hurts the pass rush. keeping them back hurts the pass rush but he must figure it should help the secondary. since the pass rush isn't getting there coverage would help the backend, but hurt the pass rush. kind of a damned if you do damned if you don't scenario.

it's funny you mentioned Matthews blitzing though. they talked about it during the GB vs NE game that he's been moved into the middle more this year for coverage so edge rushing by him has been down, but they mix it up with him blitzing from the middle in with coverage and he's been doing a good job from that perspective. something we don't do enough of. I remember them doing some of this with Harrison a few years ago and also Timmons doing it a lot more in the past. as we saw last week Williams put some licks on brees coming up the middle late. I'd love to see some more of those types of blitzes mixed in and keeping the offenses off guard more. we seem to do much better when we blitz from different spots instead of straight LB's playing so much coverage. I think we could make some of this a better fit with our LB'ers by doing that.

trouble is the corners really can't be trusted in coverage, nor can the safeties. I think safety is as big of a problem as corner too. I do believe with shazier on the field we can mix it up from the middle but he's been non- existent on the field. it sure seems like his hands are tied with players talents to do much more than he is and I think that's the bottom line.

scratch da beard now and we may see it get worse. our DE's are being counted on for more pass rush and they are not getting there like they thought. this just throws more burden on the system.

bringing players from different spots on any given play will create a weakness somewhere, but we are at the point of where we are getting burned either way so why not keep the pressure up in that way and let the chips fall where they may. we just can't stay undermanned and keep doing the same thing. send Williams, send spence, send Harrison from the inside, send Timmons into the qb's face, send ike if he can't cover, play the shark, play webb in coverage, send gay, send blake. mix it up and keep them off guard and hope for the best, I'd say.

 

Mac - this is what I have thought too. As others have pointed out we seemed to leave the middle of the field wide open with slants and then a missed tackle or two and the guy is off to the races on a run or pass. At least with some middle blitzes - it may not get home, but you have a better chance of getting the QB to move. I always felt this was the way to play Brady because though Brady moves well in the pocket he is awful when moving laterally and I would suspect other QBs have this trouble as well.

I have also thought a few jailhouse blitzes might be warranted as well just to mix it up.

One thing for sure Harrison and Worilds cannot cover anyone and taking them out of the pass rush seems to be putting them in a position where they lose their ability to do what they do best and are forced to do what they do worst.

 

Yup.. Now you see my point. Exactly. He can't get to the QB either so its six in one hand half a dozen in the other.. Double teams are not helping JH get to the QB either

 

at least moving him and others around to rush from different spots can force o-lines to make mistakes in assignments. I think things like this would go a long way into helping him in coverage as well as other players. confusion is a plan to help guys from having to do things they may not be as good at. if I were a TE or slot receiver catching a ball on a slant and Harrison were the end result, weather he's blitzing or not , I'd take notice. so would the o-line. not just Harrison either and that's what mixing it up would bring.

 

This is exactly why I think DL needs to go. He has 1 system and if you don't have the right players, no matter how good, it isn't going to work and he has no other alternatives. Look at Rex Ryan, his team gets spanked by the cheatriots and the next time they play they win and stop Brady because he makes adjustments, LeBeau was good but now that the NFL knows how to beat it he can't seem to do anything different. When you have such a poor secondary you would think getting to the QB would be the very thing to help but instead he has LBers covering slot receivers , TEs and RBs, that will fail almost every time. As far as saying Butler's LBers not doing very good, I disagree, I think they are hampered by a poor D-line who has a good one in Heyward and then the next best player is Keisel who is 36 and now gone most likely for good. You can tell how bad the D-line is when Cam Thomas is a starter, he shouldn't be on anything other than a bus out of town, complete waste of money. The problem I find that is worse than the secondary is the D-line, and I say that because the only way you stop the run is to sell out, bring the safeties up and have the line backers with their hands in the dirt and it leaves poor CBs with no help trying to cover, that is a big problem and DL know only of the days when you got CBs that could hit so receivers so hard as to knock the ball away but the new rules doesn't allow for that and besides, our guys are that bad they are usually 5 to 10 yards away from the receiver making the catch anyway. It is time for a fresh new perspective.

 

I think Drew Brees exposed this defense for what it is, and you all want to go to the playoffs with these keystone kops???? And I do agree this should be Lebeaus last season, understanding Tomlin doesnt have the guts to tell him it's time, so Art Rooney needs to send him off...

 

I think the same can be said for the LB'ers though. we have two up and comers on the DL. heyward and tuitt. then with a guy like keisel we had something going on there.

NT has been a downgrade without mclendon. if he can't stay on the field, we are behind the 8 ball and it puts more pressure on the DE's.

our LB'ers are supposed to be the playmakers in this defense. JH as good as he was and as good as he is playing at 36 is still not up to snuff for this type of defense.

Williams and spence and moats are not starters that can make us a star studded LB group and worilds is nowhere near worth the 9+ mil he's being paid. these guys are not the playmakers that this defense should be built around. they are all more complimentary type of players, not the strength as it was intended they be.

our safeties should be making more tackles against the runs as well as plays in coverage. there is also nothing wrong with good run supporting corners, if they can also play coverage. it's really not so much the scheme as who we have to run it with. key spots have hampered it all year. these guys shouldn't be our starters, but the good backups we used to have. trouble is to much has been invested into them as more than backups and they are not really up to that task.

moats, JJ, and worilds should be playing better than they have. if we had shazier next to Timmons and worilds, JJ, moats and JH as a rotation on the outside playing well we could have had a better season. Williams and spence as part time players and fresh legs would have gone a long way.

mclendon being healthy with Thomas as a part time player could have made us better up front. make no mistake, injuries have hurt us, but some of these vets didn't elevate their games either. when they had a chance to step up and above a backup level they just didn't. all of the DB's included.

we were and are too young at to many spots to have these guys play above and beyond in this system. it's not the systems fault. it's a player problem. young at some, old at others, backups as starters, injuries at key spots, and not being able to evolve as a unit will make a scheme seem old and washed up.

 

A good coach adjusts his scheme if his players can't execute it. Lebeau has a great football mind and with the right players he probably could have a top 5 defence again, but you can't always count on having the right players to fit exactly what you want to do. Sometimes you have to make adjustments, sometimes huge adjustments, and sometimes you need to scrap everything you want to do and do something completely different. We simply aren't making any adjustments on defence. We keep doing the same thing over and over and it's failing every time. It's been failing for years now yet we keep forcing a square peg into a round hole.

 

Originally Posted by Bleedsteel
LeBeau`s record speaks for itself...

As much as it drives me crazy, that we play too far off the recievers at the line of scrimmage...

When the Players do their job, and make the tackles, the system works.

Missed tackles, have been a recurring theme, that lead to long runs, and big pass plays.

When our defense is played right, it works.

LeBeau is NOT the problem.

I do hate to say it, but i think Troy`s time has finally come...

He`s neve been a textbook tackler, but he`s been missing the knockouts more and more often, and he doesn`t have the speed he used to, to make up for mistakes, when he guesses where the ball is going.

Dick may be accountable, for still giving him more freedom than he deserves right now, but that`s about as far as I will go in criticizing our D.C.

And I think having Lake as a D-backs coach will still pay off in the long run.
Just my humble opinion.

GO STEELERS!

I agree 100% with both of you, just keep in mind that
We have to play far off the receiver cause they keep getting burned.

I would love to see some receivers getting hit off the line and disrupting their routes.

 

We can only hope that he does. I appreciate everything Lebeau's has done but I think we need a different voice for our defense. Sometimes you just been around to long and players stop listening. I believe in his system, but we don't have the talent to run it, he's fell on deaf ears to the players, and it's time for Butler to take the reins and see what he can do.

 

I wouldn't get rid of Lake either. It isn't his fault they didn't sign his best player. (Keenan Allen) McCann and Blake has looked ok. Taylor has bad habits and you can't fix him. He's done. Gay has been our best corner. Now, if he can get Allen to get out of his funk we would be alright.
I don't know if he has any word in the draft but someone needs to start listening to him and whoever is picking our corners need to stop.

 

he has made some adjustments, but again, these same players are not good enough to run that either. I do believe DLB is doing what he can to right this ship but we are outmanned at to many spots no matter what we do.

mike Mitchell,will allen, an old troy,an old ike, underperforming cortez allen, William gay, antwone blake, brice McCain, dan McCullers, cam Thomas, shaun spence, Williams, an old JH, moats, a rookie Stephan tuiit, an injured mclendon, adjust what you will but it's still not enough to make these guys a top defense in any scheme at this point.

 

You want to rely on scrub castoffs like McCain, Blake the Steelers safety play is terrible and Lake is coaching these guys. Lake couldn't develop guys like Cortez who is supposed to be the #1 CB. My problem with LeBeau is his defense was only aggressive against Carolina and Baltimore, when they're aren't aggressive the defense gets exposed. If your defense can't stop a washed up Michael Vick, that's the only game Vick was good this season then your defense has major problems. LeBeau sticks with ineffective veterans too long also example Ike.

 

I agree Mac, these starters are not good enough to run the system. I still think Lebeau needs to step down and maybe someone else can reach these players. I think Lebeau is too close to them. Ike stinks and should of been benched. Allen stunk up the join and they took him out. Cam Thomas shouldn't be on any roster but he's still in there. Why does it take so long for them to decide to bench a player? I think it took them too long to bench Allen. When we had the fumbling problem last year Tomlin didn't hestitate to take players out but if it was a veteran he would let them work through it.