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Don't Overreact. Read this post.

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by ThrowToHeath, Dec 20, 2011.

  1. ThrowToHeath

    ThrowToHeath Well-Known Member

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    We lost to a good team. We should have been able to win this game and win the next two to secire the first seed. However, if it were to go this way, I am glad we lost now rather than in the next two weeks. Like the Ravens, we play down to competition, and I fear we would lose to the Rams or Browns who have nothing to lose.

    So we will probably end up with the 5th seed and get to end Denver's run. At this point, we can rest Ben, however we need to play everyone else becase we need the practice.

    Now to my observations from this game:

    -We simply cannot gameplan effectively. We had two games this season that the team seemed to come out with a plan and executed it (Titans and Patriots games), but every other game they have no identity, especially on offense. The Steelers offense is very bad, but they should be very good. They have the talent and players, but they aren't being coached and the gameplan is very bad. What I see out of the gameplan most of the time is long developing pass plays that don't even strech the field. They end up being dump offs or crossing routes which could be called with a quick design. I am not sure why we need to spend five seconds on each passing play before the ball is out.

    -We ran ok today, but we cannot run the football in general. There are situations where I would like to see them run, like on that 3rd and 2 where they bombed one to AB on the sidelines (the lowest % pass you can call). People will look to the good runs and say we need to run more, but those runs were gimmicks. That won't work as a base offense. Also, running up the middle on 1st and 10 which gains nothing would tend to make most coaches throw that out of the playbook.

    -AB is much better than Mike Wallace. The idea that Wallace is unproductive because he is double-covered is moot. Calvin Johnson is ALWAYS double covered and he is consistently successful. Heck even Hines Ward up until a few years ago was always double covered and he found ways to get open without speed and make big plays. Wallace simply doesn't know how to get open yet. AB can get open and makes great catches. AB in my eyes is very ismilar to Holmes, the only difference being that he is going to be much better.

    -The lack of Hines Ward and Heath Miller in the first 3 quarters is killign the offense. Throw the ball to the guys who can get open and drag people with them. I would like to see base formations with Cotchery/Brown and Ward in the slot. GASP I didnt include Wallace. There is reason behind that. Use Wallace as a weapon rather than an everydown reveiver, because right now he is not one. Also, on obvious running downs, use Hines Ward to block. The best run of up the middle of the night was led by Hines blocking. Hines Ward is critical to our success. Look at the stats. We are more successful on offense with him in than without him. Heath Miller is the same way. We need to use these guys.

    -Our defense doesn't pressure the QB at all. Woodly clearly isn't ready to play. Worlids should either be playing DE or not be on the roster. He is slower than Farrior and does not have the skillset to play OLB for us. I am not sure why we drafted him to be honest. He can't pass rush. I hope he gets better, but he simply doesnt have the skill set we need.

    -That being said, James Harrison is vital to our success on D. His absense is noticable.

    -I would like to see Hood benched and Heyward starting. When Heyward is in, he makes plays. Hood does not.

    -People are up in arms over Farrior and Timmons. I agree with the criticism towards Timmons, but I think Farrior is playing much better than people like to think. He is slower than years past sure, but he is faster than OLB Worilds and actually makes plays. Timmons is a complete disappointment. I was expecting him to be a bigger version of Jon Beason this year. He is playing more like a backup. Even Foote is outplaying him.

    -It is easy to blame the defense, but you can't really. Four turnovers and only giving up 20 points is respectable. The offense is to blame.

    -Should Ben have been starting? Yes! Here is the issue. BA should have designed a game plan that fit with Ben's lack of mobility. Which offense can this be one might wonder? Well is is simply the West Coast quick pass that has scored us more points for us and moved the ball better for us this year than the slow developing pass play gameplan. Ben is ultra effective at running it. Why we don't run it as our base package, I am not sure. The Patriots have been running it forever and still dominate defenses. I think Ben deserves many props for playing tonight. He has the drive and desire to win games. I think the team does too, but their coaching staff is hindering their ability to be exceptional.

    What the Steelers should do this offseason:

    -Franchise Wallace and trade him while his value is still high. Develop AB and Sanders as well as find a physical type possession receiver to fill Ward's role when he retires. Would the Patriots consider trading Gronk for Wallace? I would do that in a less than a heartbeat.

    -Replace BA with a West Coast style coordinator.

    -Solidify both offenive and defensive lines in FREE AGENCY and draft.

    -Focus the draft on finding our next Middle Linebacker duo, ones that can passrush.

    -Begin to think about life without Hampton.

    -Keep our secondary how it is. Don't fix what isnt currently broken. I love all of their corners (except for Allen being owned by Davis this evening), and Gay is playing really well. To those who complain about the secondary, just think that we have the best safty in the league, a highly regarded Free Safty, one of the best shutdown corners and an improving corner that can plan man. Ther are other areas where we need to look at first before we try to make this unit better.

    -Think about our running back situation. Do we need all three of them if we are (and correctly should be) a more passing oriented team? What could we get for Mendenhal?

    -Find a kicker who can kick a 55 year field goal (David Ancient Akers can still kick from that distance) and keep Kapinos over Sep.

    -Cal
     
  2. cory_86

    cory_86 Well-Known Member

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    Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the WestCoast Offense rely on timing, precision and quick reads?
    And Ben is really not the guy to play in a system like that.
     
  3. BLACKnGOLDsince72

    BLACKnGOLDsince72 Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. I don't know what game some of these people were watching last night. They kept Ben in the shotgun most of the night to help better protect him and they ATTEMPTED more slants and short passes than they would have with a healthy Ben. Ben's #1 strength is his mobility and avoiding the pass rush. He's not, never been and never will be a west coast / rhythm type of passer.
     
  4. FeartheBeard

    FeartheBeard Well-Known Member

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    :amen:
     
  5. edog55

    edog55 Well-Known Member

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    I tend to agree with you on a lot of what you said. Get rid of BA is first and for most. I am beginning to believe that Brown is better then Wallace. Wallace has done nothing lately. He caught a pass last night and could not out run the defenders. I thought he would score because he was at least even with them when he caught the pass.

    To me, Mendenhall is a big question Mark. I think they should look to trade him or do their homework and fine a back either through the draft or free agency. Bring in the best person to work with Redman. BA does not give Redman enough touches. He has no clue on how to develop a running game because he is so caught up in passing the football. I have stated that Mr. Rooney needs to step in and tell tromlin to get back to the passing game, or fire Bruce Arians for not listening and going back to his pass happy ways.

    In the pre season all they talked about was how good the offense would be with all the great receivers, this great explosive offense being able to out score everybody. Well it hasn't happened, it doesn't work. How else can you explain the KC debacle, and only 14 against the Browns, and only 3 against the 49ers. People on here are always talking about we can't run the football and passing the football is best in todays NFL. Well I say thats hog wash. BA is not committed to running the football. You can tell that they don't work on it. They spend most of there time pitching and catching the football in practice and Tomlin lets them do it. Mr. Rooney needs to step in and say thats enough, Arians your gone. Arians is killing this team. He has no clue on how to develop a game plan that is capable of winning games against different opponents. Harbaugh and the 49ers showed him how to develop a good game plan against us, screens to the RB's. Was Arians watching the 49er offense? How about what Norv Turner did to the Ravens defense on Sunday night, they put up 34 on them. He showed you how to beat them. Arians couldn't carry Norv's or Harbaugh's jock strap. There are so many examples of Arians ineptitude. I wish KEVDUDE was posting on this web site so he could break it down to you even more about Bruce Arians.

    The answer to the problem which I think will happen after the season is to FIRE BRUCE ARIANS IMMEDIATELY!!!!

    I think Mr. Rooney will take care of it after the season.
     
  6. DDinAZsteel1

    DDinAZsteel1 Well-Known Member

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    DOn't agree with everything in your post, but I do agree with AB being much better than Wallace. And it's not even close. Wallace has let the exposure get to his head. He is a terrible blovcker and shows randy moss effort half the time. That is unacceptable and very surprising considering they have studied under one of the best ever in Ward! I agree with trading #17, tho we don't trade so I know it won't happen.
     
  7. troybellringer55

    troybellringer55 Well-Known Member

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    Big Ben doesn't need to be playing, I admire his grit, but his ankle is limiting his side to side ability, which what makes him a QB like no one else without this he is just an average big target QB. Let the ankle heal, dixon or batch need to play and let him rest.
     
  8. ThrowToHeath

    ThrowToHeath Well-Known Member

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    We used a West Coast style offense against the Titans and the Patriots. In both games, we drove the ball down the field and scored. The idea that Ben isn't a West Coast QB is simply inaccurate. If you go back and watch the game footage, we are at our best when we are running a fast pased, West Coast scheme. This requires coordination and gameplan, which we simply lack. See a pattern?
     
  9. rukus4ever

    rukus4ever Well-Known Member

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    My, my... what a fickle bunch we are.

    Everyone on here talking about the problems with Wallace and Mendenhall. Without those two players, the Steelers offense wouldn't be what it is, right now.

    AB is getting free because of extra attention on Wallace. And if I had a nickle for everytime Ben under-or-overthrew Wallace I'd be making more than Ben.

    I think it's time to start paying attention to the fact that part of the issue is Ben. Now, I'm not saying sit him, or trade him. I'm just saying there's a fair amount of blame to go around... and a great deal of it goes to Ben.

    BA is a problem, huh? Is that why there were so many open receivers that Ben couldn't get the ball to?

    Mendy's a problem, huh? Is that why he was pulling 4+ yards on some rushes when he was having to barrell through his own offensive line AND the 49ers defensive front? Hell, on one play he had to run the opposite way of the play because the god-awful O-Line couldn't block and just created a blockade made up of them and the 49ers defensive front. And Mendy STILL ran for about 7 yards.

    Ben has turned into an INT machine. He is currently over 50% INTs/TDs... or under 50% TDs/INTs... however you want to look at it...

    The problem here is not the ability of personnel. The problem here is FOCUS and DISCIPLINE.

    Turnover ratio, poor red zone performance, lack of splash plays, poor blocking, PENALTIES!... there is a lack of intesity in the play of the Steelers, right now... and I don't know what's causing it. But I know the issue isn't one of talent.

    Someone tell me why the INT that flew off Heath's hands could have been avoided if Ben had simply checked-down to Mendy who was standing there doing jumping jacks with no defender within 5 yards of him.

    Yeah... blame everyone else but Ben. I see that's the name of game, around here. Tomline sucks, BA sucks, Mendy and Wallace suck. But who's the offense running through after the ball is snapped? Exactly.
     
  10. bigsteelerfaninky

    bigsteelerfaninky Well-Known Member

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    Dude no one but Ben would have played last night.....I don't know why you are criticizing him.....I appreciate him going out there and playing for my team even though he is hurt and unable to friggin walk
     
  11. rukus4ever

    rukus4ever Well-Known Member

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    BigSteeler... please do not misread me as not wanting Ben to play. As I stated I'm not saying trade him, or sit him. I am saying I have as much faith in the others on the team as I do in Ben, as a Steelers fan.

    I just don't buy the whole "get rid of everyone but Ben" BS that's thrown around all the time (or at least that's the way it seems to me). People seem to be overly critical of everyone on the team but Ben, and I think that is very unfair.
     
  12. BLACKnGOLDsince72

    BLACKnGOLDsince72 Well-Known Member

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    Well another post that should be deleted for spouting off with too much common sense LOL! Actually I can't wait for BA to go either because I'm anxious to see who the next scapegoat is going to be and to the poster who said Ben has what it takes to efficiently execute a west coast offense game in and game out LOL !! I love Ben and glad we have him but west coast offense isn't his game at all. Everyone wants to hold that Pats game up as an example. Poor example when trying to compare it to last night's game. Big difference between the 49ers D and the Pats D who pretty much suck this year. The 49ers were all over the short passing game knowing Ben's primary objective last night was to dump the ball short and avoid taking hits. Some of these folks make these comments with total disregard of who we're facing on the other side of the ball both in personnel and scheme. If something worked in one game it just automatically will work in every game LOL!
     
  13. Rush2seven

    Rush2seven Well-Known Member

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  14. steelers5859

    steelers5859 Well-Known Member

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    I was wondering if anyone has notice this. He spends to much time jawjacking with the opponent that he doesn't concentrate on the routes. His head is swelling way too big. I heard his interview with him and Brown before the monday night game and he seems like he has a little cocky attitude. Even before the 49ers game he gave them a little "bulletin board" material which you should never do. I would trade him only if Sanders is completely healthy.
     
  15. rukus4ever

    rukus4ever Well-Known Member

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    He spends too much time blowing away opposing DBs so Ben can over/underthrow him...
     
  16. ThrowToHeath

    ThrowToHeath Well-Known Member

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    When the Steelers use quick passes to move down the field, they score points. Go ahead and throw out the Pats game, but look at the Titans game. Those are the two clear examples of the offense performing how they should be performing this season. Each of the other games were offensively disappointing.

    Clean your glasses people. We are not scoring with the power run or the slow developing pass plays. We need short timing routes that move the ball down the field. Also yes, Ben is very good at doing this, you just aren't use to seeing him do it.
     
  17. SteelEd

    SteelEd Member

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    ThrowToHeath....Put your money where your mouth is.....you are the one over reacting.

    To make all the moves you have outlined would require a complete overhaul of a good machine...in otherwords...if ain't broke, don't fix it!!

    You remind me of my wife...every time our car gets a flat tire she says we need a new car...I say , NO, we need a new tire...dear!

    There is only one thing wrong with both our offense AND our defense.....INJURIES...this entire season.

    Offensive line...outside linebackers...inside linebackers...defensive ends...AND NOW...our QB.

    Yeah, yeah, I know. The standard is the standard. But anyone with half a brain including Tomlin knows "it ain't so". Just look around. We are week in a lot of positions because we are playing second stringers. "The standard is the standard" sounds good to the media but it certainly ain't "cuttin the mustard".

    So ThrowToHeath....we don't need to rebuild the machine...we just need to fix the one we got....dear!
     
  18. ThrowToHeath

    ThrowToHeath Well-Known Member

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    Umm, ok. If you think our offense is a "good machine" then alright. Perhaps you are accidentally watching the Packers or Saints and getting the colors confused with the Steelers. No our offense is not a "good machine", although it should be.

    My only major "change" that I would like to see happen is to trade Wallace **gasp**, "but we can't trade the fastest receiver in the NFL!" Well then we either need him to start putting in effort like Brown does on non-fly and post patterns, or get a QB who can throw to him deep. Would you trade Wallace to the Pats for Gronk? I think I would.

    Also, your injuries comment is moot. All teams suffer injuries. Outside of perhaps O-Line and Ben this past week, our offense has been healthy. The problem however is, that even when we are healty, we aren't producing like we should be.

    On a side note, I am going to take a step back with my opinions and analysis because I get the feeling that I am upsetting the fans that may still be living in the 70's, and I fear they may be mods and ban me for suggesting non-power run and long developing pass play offense ideas.
     
  19. rukus4ever

    rukus4ever Well-Known Member

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    Mike Wallace scored a TD off of one of those kinds of passes against the Bengals (2nd game). He caught a couple of those passes against SF and got YAC. I think your 2nd point about the QB is more relevant. Wallace can't control who Ben throws to. All he can do is get open. To the point about it being Ben... the first pick @ SF: Brown was open on a crossing route, but Ben went to a double-covered Wallace, right at the goal-line. Wallace got some of THE crappiest passes from Ben. Even when he does do fly/post patterns Ben's arm is FAIL the majority of the time.
     

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