Stop restructuring, make the hard decisions

I really don't agree that the Steelers are in such a 'dire' position as some think. Injuries and turnovers last season are what kept the team out of the playoffs. The talent was there for the most part but the focus was not.

 

I remember a time when we let some good to great players go. Woodson, Holmes, Gilden come to mind.

I Agree with SBD... no need to keep this thing together when it's obvious we are getting a bit long in the tooth on some of these players. Tomlin it's time to win with your drafts!!! Let the young guns have a shot. Example.. A. Brown, M. Wallace, These players can and will step in to perform.

THen again we haven't had the best drafts either.

 

Steelbydesign- we are kindred spirits as we both seem to hate the boatload of restructures we've made the past few years. We both know its like dancing with the devil as sooner or later you have to pay the piper. I'm gonna differ from you on a few points and offer my nonrequested opinion just for discussion sake.

Don't compare us and our monetary situation to the Bengals. Yes they are 40 mil under and we're over and we were an 8-8 team but we all know at the start of the season we were SB contenders. At RB mendy didn't return as hoped,mentally or physically, and we all know mendy is a very solid RB when not dancing. At WR wallace and his lackluster attitude & performace hurt this team. Ben's injury or should I say our QB squad's injurys held us back as did the injurys to Gilbert/adams/colon on the OL. ( beechum was a pleasant suprise though)

On defense Troy was again out as was James H. and Woodleys Hammy/ankle.

If all these would have been healthy and in the right mindset we may have seen ring 7. Gone are Wallace and Mendy. Colon is also most likely gone as is James H. Though we may be able to keep James depending on Lewis's contract size.

Either way we still are contenders. We're rebuilding, yes, getting younger and talented in areas but doing it and remaining as contenders is hard and if not for an unpresidented number of KEY injurys we could be champs. As long as we have Ben and a young talented improving OL and Top ranked defense we must not throw it all away for rebuilding sake. Do some restructures, cut some fat, draft some talent and fight for the next ring.

I say this because of experience. I remember the Steelers when we were just bad, became good then became a DYNASTY then started rebuilding and became bad again for far too long as the 49ers, boys and skins became the leagues dominate SB teams. We are back were we belong, on the top level of the league and with a few smart choices we can not only stay there but reign for years. It takes good fortune and luck as everyone has to deal with injurys, the cap and free agency but doing it and staying on top is nearly impossible.

In this lanscape of Freeagency and salarycap restructures and extensions are a necessary evil and as long as the cap grows it works out. In years the cap stalls it's bullet bitting time. Trimming the fat is also a necessary evil but one that must be done carefully as EVERY player in the league is watching which impacts potential FA additions.

Cajun-

 

This is the kind of conversation I wish happened more on this board. I have no issue with someone disagreeing with me, but lets have a discussion... Not "I think the Steelers know better than you do" fight.




The Bengals comment was admittedly a bad one. More out of frustration than me having any sort of envy for the Bengals squad/organization. They're successful right now because they've finally hit on a few high draft picks.

I understand we can't cut the whole team and start over, I'm with you that it takes a little bit of everything... but I feel like we're restructure crazy. I think people have this false confidence that the front office has made a lot of good moves, so whatever they do continues to be the right move. It worked before, so why not now... Well before we drafted well, so we were able to have talented guys play for cheap because they were unproven.

The difference now is we haven't drafted well, so we're holding on too long to guys that are making way too much money for the production we're seeing.

I agree, we absolutely could've been a playoff team last season, and there were some bad things that happened... but I think the loss the the Packers has been downhill since then. I didn't think we were a very good team 2 years ago, and we saw that when Tim Tebow beat us in the playoffs. You can point to that game, and point to last season and say "well if the ball bounces different in one or two spots we advance, or we make the playoffs." That's absolutely true, but the fact is we were an average team, so we would've needed those lucky breaks to continue every game which just isn't going to happen... To win it all you need to be a good team, and get a little luck.

The reason I'm so frustrated right now is Mike Wallace and Keenan Lewis are 2 of our good picks, and we've whiffed on a lot lately... So to let them walk because we have no choice (because we've kicked out problems of yesterday to today) is upsetting. I know Wallace needs to go but even if he was a model citizen he'd be going (or Antonio Brown would be because Mike signed last season).

 

Chill out dude...

 

I understand Tomlin-era's response but this response needs to be quote of the month simply because it made me laugh. I wish I had the skills to post links that reflected my thoughts, then again maybe it's a good thing I don't.

Now you two shake hands and play nice.

Cajun-

 

I had no idea people here were so sensitive. I get tired of being told I'm crazy because I don't see everything as gumdrops and rainbows, but I don't get my feelings hurt... Excuse me.

 

I see it a little differently. I think we've drafted well which why we're always contenders and plus its why our cap is always so tight trying to keep all those great players we've drafted. Troy is actually the biggest cap hit vs poorest production we have but absolutly no-one is suggesting we cut him.

I think Wallace needs to go. He wants Larry F. Money and we would never pay a WR that. Actually we don't need him and we'll get a good comp pick next year for him and another good comp pick for mendy if some-one signs him like they should. RBs and WR can be had in early/middle rds. K. Lewis will be signed after the team determines his value once he hits the open market. His contract will determine if we keep James H. another year. We are currently under the cap but need some room for our Draft choices and a few FA, our own plus maybe one more from another team. We can still cut colon and get a savings there.

Like I said before, I don't like all these restructures as they put limits your future spending but if you have talent now you need to try and keep it.

Cajun-

 

I agree keep talent but only if it warrants the contract. James Harrison wasn't worth 6+ mil last season (or whatever it was).

I don't think we sign K.Lewis. I think signing Gay was writing on the wall. I thought if he came at vet minimum it might just be depth but Gay's contract will count for just over a million against the cap this year. That's cap space they could've use on Lewis... I think if they were going to bring him back there's no way they put another million on the books before doing so.

You're right on Troy, but I've seen plenty of people suggest cutting him. He's the one vet I'm against letting go, just because I still think he's a once in a generation talent, and with him on the field he makes our team way better than without him. I'm not sure I can say the same for Harrison, Keisel, or Colon. We might be slightly better with them, but not enough to be worth the fat contract.

 

I'm just saying, what the heck do you care what some random board member thinks? (i.e. me)

But this is the last I'm mentioning it, I'm here to talk football, not argue on the internet... because you know what they say about arguing on the internet...

 

Nice try with the emoticon (?) but you really needed a real cool link or something. You have it in you. That clip you had of rice in shock over the failed FG before the one you now have of keisel proves that. Come on, I know you can do better.

Cajun-

 

James earned that contract and the money he got last year by being a great pass rusher, DPOY and let's not forget his SB performance. Did his play reflect his salary last year? NOPE!! But a healthy James, just like a healthy Troy is a difference maker on the field. Part of Woodleys decreased performance is due to he's playing beside ziggy and not A. Smith and James wasn't across from him on the other side. I think James knee should be 100% this year or his career is over. Either way this is James final year.

Gays signing has nothing to do with Lewis's signing. I gave why I liked Gay's signing in a different thread. I think the Steelers will resign Lewis unless some-one offers him a Revis like contract. He was good last year, one of the most consistant corners in the league but he's not considered a shut-down corner and his int's are too low to demand that kind of money. But if the browns can draft weedon as high as they did and pass on Kirk Cousins and Russell wilson then anything is possible.

Cajun-

 

Signing William Gay has no effect on the signing of Lewis. If the numbers on SD.com are right Gay's signing will only cost 500k+ against the 2013 cap. This signing provides depth and is a CYA move by the Steelers IF Lewis leaves via free agency.

 

I've seen something like 1.1 mil against the cap from a few people on twitter. I liked the signing initially, but I think we gave him too much. I think we gave him more than a #4 CB makes, which is why I don't think they plan on having Keenan.

 

Thats a good question. I doubt it's that he has a contract with another team. Everyone tampers, but I think it's more feelers out there than an agreement in principle, and it'd be incredibly stupid to post about it.

If I had to guess I would say it's completely unrelated to football, but who knows. Like I said I really liked the Gay signing at first but then I thought... if they want to get Lewis under contract wouldn't they do that before putting any more money against the cap?

Who knows. Supposedly they're working with Harrison, so maybe he takes a cut and frees up money for Lewis.

 

You seem to believe that the Steeler's roster is set a long time before the season starts. The Steelers can cut Gay if they draft a CB(s), resign Lewis, a younger CB on the team steps up and plays well, or for a number of reasons. If they cut Gay there will be little repercussion to the salary cap. Teams throw that kind of money away all the time. I believe the vet minimum for a player into their 7th year is just over 800,000. The Steelers gave him slightly more then the vet minimum. The signing bonus and salary is the price of doing business with a player of Gay's experience.

Gay is better then some of the CB's the Steelers have on the roster right now. Based on that, Gay makes the team better to an extent. We will see how the Steeler's roster forms after FA, the draft, training camp, and preseason. Gay is not an automatic lock to make the team with a 500,000 bonus.

 

i agree i think they gave him 750 base plus the sign bonus and the total cap hit is 990 foor 2013

 

"young and talented offensive line"?


Well, Ill disagree. Ill mention the "young guys"

Pouncey gets hurt every year but when he does play he is above average- (I didnt think he played up to snuff last year- maybe he was dinged up and not regressing)

Gilbert- Hurt and when has played has not shown me anything to really be optimistic about,

DeCastro- Got hurt Havent seen enough of him

Adams- good run blocker- needs more time pass protection- another guy who got hurt

Belchum- looked good, good feet but he has about 60 minutes more of regular season game film than I do.

Foster- Durable, good solid lineman- probably on way out.



Well- I dont really see the O Line in the good category-- I see it as a question mark

 

Steel by Design says we would have gotten smoked by those teams. I remember we kicked Payton's a$$ during our Super Bowl run and we put together our best offensive performance against NE a couple of years ago and Charlie Batch beat the Ratbirds this past season!!!! Any given Sunday my friend...

 

Looks like I'm not the only one that feels this way. Here's a blog entry from Bob Smizik of the PG...

Steelers foolish fiscal path

FRIDAY, 08 MARCH 2013 01:15 AM
Those paying attention have maybe noticed that it's been suggested here several times in recent days that the most important thing the Steelers can do this off-season is begin the process of getting their salary cap in order. It has become an almost annual rite of late winter that the Steelers restructure multiple player contracts to get under the cap. As has been pointed out by many, this only exacerbates their problem.

Yes, it gives them temporary relief. But that temporary relief has resulted in one playoff appearance in the past two seasons, a loss, and an 8-8 record in 2013.

If ever there were proof that the Steelers current philosophy is half-ass backwards and a direct about-face from the policy that brought them so much success, it is the free-agent period that begins next week. The philosophy that served the Steelers so well for so long was to sign their own and not worry about free-agents, particularly the high-priced variety that so many teams found so tempting.

Well, here we stand on the brink of free agency and the Steelers are dead-certain to lose the player, aside from Ben Roethlisberger, they can least afford to lose -- wide receiver Mike Wallace.

The Steelers have lost plenty of free agents in the past, but rarely in positions of need. The core of their philosophy was to keep their own. But because of their policy of restructuring, restructuring and restructuring they don't have the fiscal means to do what they've always preached.
They absolutely will not be able to keep Wallace and stand a good chance of losing starting cornerback Keenan Lewis.

Imagine that: A team with no running game and a franchise quarterback allowing its best receiver to leave via free agency.

How important is Wallace to the Steelers?

According to ESPN, ``No player in the NFL has more 40-yard receptions since 2009 than Wallace (27) and his 16 touchdown catches of 40 yards or longer are also an NFL-high over that span. Since 2009, no other Steelers receiver has more than five 40-yard catches (Hines Ward, who retired before last season) or two 40-yard touchdown catches (Antonio Brown).’’

Not only are the Steelers losing one of the most dangerous wide receiver in the NFL, they have no one to replace him. Even if Brown returns to his 2011 form, and there’s no guarantee of that, he’s a No. 2 receiver, not a No. 1, not a replacement for Wallace.

The Steelers fiscal strategy is so cockeyed that their free-agent spending likely will begin and end with cornerback William Gay, a player the 5-11 Arizona Cardinals did not want.

The Steelers need to be able to use all methods of player procurement to replenish their talent base and not just the draft. Let’s not forget they have made key free-agent acquisitions in the past -- Jeff Hartings, James Farrior, Ryan Clark -- that have been highly instrumental in their success.

But management appears to lack the fortitude to make the hard decisions to get the cap back in shape to avoid the annual despertion moves of late winter.

It’s a formula the Steelers once would have quietly ridiculed and one that they now foolishly embrace.