Could we keep James Harrison by doing this?

It appears, based on some recent comments, that Harrison is not receptive to taking a pay cut to stay with the Steelers. His agent went so far as to call him a bargain which is a bit of a stretch for a 35 year old LBer with multiple injury issues. But instead of just cutting him, which is very well what the Steelers may do if Harrison refuses to take a cut, how about an incentive laden contract? If Harrison still believes he can play at a very high level and perform on the field then he shouldn't have an issue with it. Neither should the Steelers if Harrison goes out and regains some of his lost magic.

Why not structure it in such a way that the base contract is less than the one he currently has and is more cap friendly? If Harrison stays healthy and plays in 14-16 games, that triggers an incentive. If he has 10 sacks, another incentive is triggered and for every sack over and above 10 he earns more. You might also throw in triggers for total number of tackles and tackles behind the line of scrimmage which is where Harrison has made his reputation.


Anyway, just a thought. This may be a way to keep Harrison and to pay him only if he performs comparatively to his old self. Does anyone know how incentive laden contracts affect the salary cap? Is incentive pay treated as bonuses and pro-rated somehow? Looking for some help from some of you cap gurus.

 

i don't think he's going anywhere this year. they have gotten under the cap for now which is what they needed to do, and still kept him.

as far as this incentive laden contract or him taking a pay cut, why should he? they gave him this contract and he signed it and played through most every injury he had. woodley doesn't. where is his incentive laden contract and pay cut?

i'd restructure and give him a one year extension to help the cap hit and use the man. he didn't start playing much until he was 29-30 so the wear and tear isn't as bad as most. if the knee holds up he will again be a force.

i'd hate to face him on the ravens squad twice a year. he works to keep that old body in shape.

i don't think he's over the hill as much as most. last year was a fluke for him.

play worilds and move james next to timmons and watch the fug out. that's what i'd do. you need pass rush? that would do it.

 

Don't we have more resturcturing to do if we ink Gay and Lewis to a new deal, and allowing room for rookies? I believe Woodley still needs to get done, but I was still thinking Harrison may be a casualty.

 

there are still things they can do for money this year. woodley is one. colon is another. suisham. clark an extension. cutting justin king gets them 715,000. several 1/2 a mil. guys add up quickly. keisel an extension would help. the cap is 123 so it's more then they first thought. plus we get some carry over from last year.

 

I wonder how that King number compares to what Gay got.

 

Exactly how many games did Woodley miss in 2012?

 

After missing 6 games in 2011 . . .

It looks like he didn't suit up for 3 in 2012 (tennessee, @ baltimore, san diego) and I think he lasted a series or something in 2 others (philly and cleveland).

 

I'd like to believe that but I don't think that's the case. Back injuries are brutal.

He's missed 8 games the past two seasons.

Regardless of the sack numbers (which have declined each year over the past three years), I would guess his hurries are WAY down as well. He really has not been much of a factor the past two seasons.

 

the fractured orbital was a freak injury. 2 weeks there, so roughly half of what woodley missed. let's also talk how effective woodley has been in those games too. i don't know why you all can't stand JH anymore, but woodley gets a free friggin pass for not playing or playing subpar. the back didn't bother him this past year. the knee did. how's woodley's sack numbers looking the last two years?

 

Since you asked, two years ago Woodley had 9 sacks in 10 games. Heck, 9 sacks isn't bad for a season. Last year, yeah, 4 sacks in 13 games. I don't think anyone is giving Woodley a "free friggin pass." I think the majority of the people around here are down on Woodley.

I love JH. I think most on here do. I just think his body may be breaking down. Not just the orbital, but the knee and the back. Back problems suck and often times can't be fixed. Also, I think his mouth got him into a lot of trouble with the league. He ran off at the mouth about the commish and I don't think he's drawn a holding flag since. That's just a theory, but I don't think he'll be nearly as productive if o-linemen are bearhugging him every play. He looked like he was getting manhandled for most of last season. Just my opinion.

Still . . . I don't know that I'm ready to close the book on JH. I saw how well Farrior bounced back from an awful 2009 to star in 2010. I'm hoping JH (and Polamalu and Woodley . . . ) can do the same in '13 and we can make a final run with this core group.

 

I'm beginning to believe Woodley is nothing more then a product of Harrison's success. Teams had no choice but to leave Woodley one on one.

 

i sort of agree. the back was a disc and thats not as complicated as it used to be. they didn't replace one they just made it stop pushing on the nerve. i can tell you all about backs. 2 ruptured discs and 3 herniated in my first 7 lumbar discs. i also have stenosis like first rd. draft ranked jarvis jones, but i'm old. oh to be 35 again.

harrison got bear hugged long before sounding off to the commish too. the knee is his problem right now. he seems to think he can get it in shape enough to play well in the offseason and not on a week to week basis. my bit-- is everyone calling for JH's head and cutting his salary but nobody mentions doing that with woodley. whats good for the goose, is good for the gander.

i'd love to see this all come together again, but the years are ticking away quickly. james is getting old, but woodley's is his own doing, that's my problem with him. james works as hard as any player to stay in shape and improve, thats not the same as going through the motions and not trying to earn the big contract that woodley received from the steelers.

 

Agreed, Woodley couldn't carry JH jock and I wouldn't lose any sleep if we cut him today. JH is mentioned mostly due to his age.

 

James Harrison is the last strand of the old Steeler defense. An intimidator. Feared.

I wish something can be worked out.

This is a big year for Woodley. Guess we will see how he reacts to all the negitive press he's been getting. And he loves the spotlight, except on the field the last two years. Since he got overpaid he has been all Hollywood. We need to see the pre big money and fame Woodley this season.


Lets see if Woodley helps the team and restructures.

 

You'd think so, but people were saying the same stuff before his one bad season. Like Wallace, like Mendenhall, he just rubs people the wrong way, and so facts go out the window. I'm disappointed in his recent injury history, and like everyone else, I'm hoping the criticism he's been receiving serves as motivation for 2013.

 

I hope Silverback finishes his career with the Steelers. If they
would be creative and he is open to it, he could suit up in Foote's
spot right now. I bet you wouldn't see tackles being made 5 yds past the line
of scrimmage with him there.

 

I appreciate all of the robust conversation here, but can anyone answer two questions for me that I posed in the OP.
1) Would it be feasible to propose an incentive laden contract to keep Harrison?
2) Does anyone out there who has studied the salary cap more than me know how an incentive laden contract would impact the cap?

 

In order for them to do an incentive laden contract( more than what's already in place they must void the current one and totally redo it and there's rules regulating that. When contract are already in place its either restructing ( turning high base salary to gauranteed bonus and spreading that to later years on the books to free up current year money on the books) or extensions by adding years to the end of the contract at reduced base salary then pushing Bonus money their.

Performance enhanced contracts- Contracts that grow monetarily if said player meets on-field goals or work-out goals only affect the cap when the money is paid out. Every dime that is spent on a player must be attributed toward the cap the year its spent except signing bonuses.

The problem with restructures is the money is now gauranteed and MUST be paid even if the player is off the team which is called dead-money and that affects the cap hard as it must be paid in full in two years. Its a dangerous game, restructures, but one we must play now. Its hard to get off the track once you're on it.

Cajun-

 

Thanks for that info, cajun, that helps.

 

No-way was I gonna attempt the NLTBE & LTBE incentives conversation. I discovered them a few years back and used them in a debate with Del on the old board. MA@SIN was another member who helped explain them. I wasn't sure if the new CBA made any changes to them either.

I was under the impression NLTBE wouldn't apply to a future contract here since his performance the past couple years has been down and he is likely to meet those. It would only been applicable say after his DPOY performance. Wait, maybe I'm thinking backwards...... oh well never mind. I'll leave this conversation to you more in depth guys as I've forgotten way too much.

Cajun-

 

I'm sorry: I just do not see any upside in keeping Harrison. His play and mouth are not worth that fat contract of his. I know he's a fan fave, especially on these boards, but the guy has burned his bridges. Keisel is in a similar situation (in terms of age and productivity) but he's WORTH having around: a good guy, a good teammate, good for the community. By comparison, Harrison is dead weight.