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was Collinsworth right?

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by mikeyg, Sep 25, 2023.

  1. mikeyg

    mikeyg Well-Known Member

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    LOL
     
  2. mikeyg

    mikeyg Well-Known Member

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    Browns and 9rs may finish top 5, both of them. time will tell...
     
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  3. mikeyg

    mikeyg Well-Known Member

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    not I - he sucks!
     
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  4. mikeyg

    mikeyg Well-Known Member

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    Yr. 3 will be critical - MC has to be gone by then.

    that said,
    guys that have had quick success:


    Burrow did, in Yr 2.
    Allen did, in Yr. 2
    Jackson did, in Yr. 2 (saved Harbaugh's ASS when he replaced Flacco)
    Mahomes did - right out of gate
    Tua now......(yes, yr 3 - a little choppy, but concussed stuff....)
    dare I say Purdy and Hurts (who we whiffed on drafting for sure)

    I could go on....

    anyone see a pattern?

    we don't have all day here.....

    Kenny has PLENTY OF WEAPONS - just a dull coordinator and a HC who is too defensive minded. Not enough to go too far. He missed DJ, but all teams deal with missed key players.

    WORK the TE's into the game!
     
  5. JAD

    JAD Well-Known Member

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    Offensive line did improve some this game. Looked a little more push with more aggression. What I didn't see that most good offensive lines do is get to the linebackers to block them on running plays.
     
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  6. Steelresolve

    Steelresolve Well-Known Member

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    the Center isn’t a good fit for the zone blocking scheme either and they don’t have a replacement option for him so that’s another reason I believe they went with the power scheme.

    our right guard hadn’t really lit it up in zone either. To be honest I don’t know if outside zone is a good fit for Najee. Having him kind of flow laterally and wait to hit the hole or cut back kind of goes against his strengths.

    Najee is not fast, explosive or great with change of direction. I’m not sure if his vision is that great either. In fact I honestly would like to see them go under center more and line Najee up seven yards back and let him hit the hole running in a power scheme. If the hole isn’t there run up the OL’s back they will learn real quick to create holes after getting hit by 240 lbs with a head of steam a couple times.

    we have to stop trying to be the Miami offense, we don’t have the players, speed or coaching ability to coach that style of offense. I feel we are more built like a Philly offense. The only downside to double blocking in power is the linebackers are essentially untouched so the chances of breaking long runs are lessened. It also leaves the rb one on one with the linebacker to the hole and unfortunately Najee isn’t that quick to the hole. But if we line up 7 yards back at least he gets a head of steam to pound the linebacker and honestly I like his chances in those situations alot better than I do in the outside zone schemes where your neutralizing his power and facing him run laterally.

    but honestly the power scheme is designed to be grinding offense, truly three yards and a cloud of dust. I will be happy with that if it gets are offense in a rythym and keeps sustained drives alive instead of negative plays and third and long situations.

    we can still mix in the outside zone occasionally with Warren but definitely not for Najee.

    the other thing is with the power scheme they should utilize Washington or Heyward in motion as the lead blocker through the hole to hopefully block some of the linebackers or safeties trying to fill the gap.

    I know this is a much more simplistic concept but honestly who cares not every team has a 240 - 250lb half back or a 275 lb TE as a lead blocker.

    the other thing they need to do is be a little more creative with the underneath routes or short outlet routes to get people open so if the play breaks down KP has an easy outlet.

    I feel like every time he dumps it off to Najee it us for no gain. the rub crossing route to get Pickens open was great. We need more stuff like that because with Dionte out there and always being open it has been significantly more difficult for Pickett.
     
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  7. Steelresolve

    Steelresolve Well-Known Member

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    a lot of those QB’s were in significantly better situations than Picket, either with superior talent or superior offensive system. Yes we have weapons but they are still young and honestly most of those QB’s had solid lines in front of them with the exception of Burrow.

    Ben was not Ben under Canadas system either. Sure he was diminished in his physical ability but all we could do was the short quick passes because our offensive line was so bad. We’re still trying to develope that offensive line. It’s not a finished product.

    the run game honestly has not been good for years. Sure we had a seven game stretch last year but we’re back to square one again. I think Tomlin was intrigued by SF and Miami’s offense so went out and got a cheap version of their offenses and that cheap knockoff hasn’t worked out. Canada is I’ll equipped to teach it and coach it to the level that SF and Miami can, nor do we have the speed or players to run that type of system.

    I will say there is nothing special about Tua or Purdy. They are in incredible fortunate situations and coached very, very well. Are they terrible QB’s no they are good QB’s but nothing special. They have amazing running attacks, awesome blocking, and Recievers and rb’s in designed plays to get massive YAC after the catch. In their systems a short pass goes a long way. Unfortunately you have to have fantastic blocking and a ton of discipline in those systems. McCafrey said he had to learn how to run within that system to be effective. I bet our backs were never taught those intricate details or coached up on that stuff.

    if the Steelers really want those type of systems then they need to approach finding the OC the same way they approached hiring the GM. Thorough and methodical and preferably pluck a couple coordinators off of Miami and SF. It can’t just be up to Tomlin to make the hire or an internal promotion because for whatever reason Tomlin has failed in that area, over and over and over.

    they also need to expand the staff at least on the offensive side beyond the OC yo Run game coordinator and Pass Game Coordinator. It is clear these guys aren’t being coached up appropriately in the fundamentals on blocking and that’s probably because are line coach also serves as run game coordinator so in effect both areas suffer. In addition when we are understaffed in those areas relative to our competitors it really seems like we are I’ll equipped to adjust quickly like other teams can either in game at half time or even in between games.
     
  8. Steelresolve

    Steelresolve Well-Known Member

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    You won’t ever see that when we’re doubling up on the defensive line in a power scheme. It’s designed for three yards and a cloud of dust. You either need to implement a cb as a lead blocker or pull the guard. Otherwise it is up to the tb to make the linebacker miss in the hole or run them over.
     
  9. Karl

    Karl Well-Known Member

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    Any Defense that has Maxx Crosby is dangerous to the QB.

    It's tough to say, 'wholesale change.'
    But they did and lot of traditional blocking as opposed to the Zone Blocking schema.
    I hope that trend continues. You really are supposed to tailor your offense to skillsets your players have.

    Harris is a 6"1" 240lbs RB, you want to keep him running downhill, not dancing around looking for lanes.
    I really like Warren, he's a really good change of pace. And he brings some pain too.
     
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  10. Thor

    Thor

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    I think you're placing too much emphasis on the 'youth' of the players. Sure, everyone needs time to develop; but the wheels move pretty fast in the the NFL and when you look at the experience of the skill players you continue to mention, I don't think 'new faces' really describes many. Johnson is in his fifth year, Pickens second; Freiermuth third; Harris third; Pickett second (officially). That your starting QB is only in his second year with less than a full season's worth of starts under his belt is significant, but otherwise these were the same players the team had last year.

    Again, what I point to as disappointing isn't the lack of a high-flying offense per se, it's the overall disarray and lack of identity they displayed offensively after seeming to be at least getting building blocks in place with running game last year. To get three games in before realizing that not only are your lineman not executing the zone blocking scheme very well, but your lead RB isn't well-suited for it either indicates a considerable disconnect between the scheme you want to run and the players you have in place.
     
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  11. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    I tend to attribute a lot of that as Tomlin wiping the slate clean every year and to use his words here " their story is still being written " in other words he is not attempting to build on a previous season with his core players. He isn't looking for plug and play guys who can play the system because he has no overarching team identity that he needs to mold his team into. It's his football season as a mystical journey belief that leads to the slow starts.
     
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  12. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    Bingo.


    In addition, inexperience does yield shortcomings. My emphasis isn't being placed on that soley. How proficient the OC can use what is available (as you pointed out) is
     
  13. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    They gave up draft picks to get him, too. Ooof.
     
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