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Diontae Johnson is Having a Great Career.........And You Guys are Missing it!

Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by TuRnDoWnForWaTT, Jun 30, 2022.

  1. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    @Steelresolve

    Reason 1 - His numbers were artificially inflated the last few years. We had a terrible offensive line, an immobile QB in a poorly designed offensive system relative to our QB’s strengths so we threw quick slant patterns. Dionte’s biggest strength is his elusiveness and ability to get open. As a result he was naturally the first choice from a target standpoint in our system over the last few years. I don’t see that being the case with Canada’s new system and mobile QB’s and a better Offensive line moving forward. Through pre snap motion, play action passing, our desire is gong to be to push the ball down field. As a result I see Claypool and Pickens benefitting from that type of system more than Dionte.

    Well DJ has only played for 3 seasons. So are you suggesting that Johnson's numbers are inflated for his entire career? That is a bit harsh. Don't you think? You say he played with an immobile QB, in a poor system, yet he still put up monster stats. I would say DJ deserves credit for that. As for "Matt Canada's system", some of you guys act like Canada is Bill Walsh. LOL. Matt Canada is an OC who bounced around the college ranks, and is incredibly fortunate to have landed an NFL job. Those of you who are expecting him to reinvent the wheel are going to be disappointed.

    Reason 2 - Our new offense moving forward is going to focus heavily on the run game with play action passing. This type of system leans on presnap motion and multiple different type of sets. In addition this type of system asks the wide receivers to block. Essentially there will be times when only one wr is on the field. So as a result by design the offense is going to spread the ball around more. All of these attributes of the new offense tells me that Dionte’s targets will be significantly reduced. His talents in fact may actually be wasted on this type of offense. He would probably be a great fit in Greenbay where they desire and thrive on a true number 1 type of WR. This offense isn’t about that and won’t be about that.

    You are speculating here. None of us really know what the offense is going to look like. As of now, we are not even certain who the game 1 QB will be, once the regular season starts.

    Reason 3 - Influx of new talent. Not to diminish Dionte's talent but we have an influx of new talent with some like minded traits to Dionte which makes him a little more expandable from an asset standpoint. Pickens is a freak athlete who has better straight line speed and a larger catch radius than Dionte, plus he is a great route runner. He also offers something Dionte does not and that is contested catch ability. Calvin offers short area quickness that rivals Dionte and is from what I hear probably better. Gunner offers strong abilities to get open and is all heart. I didn’t even mention Claypool and Friermuth and what I believe will be expansive roles for those guys in the offense (simply from their versatility from a blocking and red zone perspective).

    I also like Pickens and Austin. These guys are rookies. We have no idea how long it will take for them to be NFL ready. Could be week 1. Could be season 2. Time will tell. Both players could use to bulk up. George Pickens is a completely different receiver than DJ is. He has no where near the route running ability that DJ does at this point. You are just guessing that others will out perform Johnson. You have provided no proof to back up your claim. I have consistently posted DJ's stat progression, over his 3 seasons. You are making straw man arguments, that have very little basis in fact, other than what you think might happen.

    Reason 4 - The WR market has gotten out of hand. That is why you see teams like the Chiefs, Packers and Titans trading away their stars. If you want to build a Super Bowl Caliber team you have to spend your money on your identity and we are and this offense is not going to be a high powered offense from a WR perspective moving forward. The core focus will be around the defense and the run game.

    Again, you don't know this. If you think 3 yards and a cloud of dust is back, you are wrong. That isn't today's NFL.

    Reason 5 - We have unknown assets at QB. I would rather they focus the money on the offensive line moving forward to protect these guys and form a formidable run game as they develop their talents, than put it into a wr who may actually waste his own talents waiting for them to develop. Plus I believe if Pickens is who they say he is the mindset is to develop him along with Pickett as your pass offense nucleus moving forward.

    The unknown QB comment is valid. Again though, can we please let Pickens play a game before we label him the future of the WR position? We don't know that yet. I remember when Troy Edwards was the future of the WR position. How did that work out?

    Reason 6 - We draft and develop wr’s better than anybody. Why put money into Dionte when we can get a less expensive option in the draft and develop him up? I would rather see us spend that money on a free agent CB or OT where we are not as efficient at developing players.

    Actually we don't. Wide Receivers who were drafted in years past got to play with a Hall of Fame QB. That makes a big difference. Ben has made a lot of receivers look better than they were over the years. I bet no one would brag about how well the Steelers develop receivers had Landry Jones been the QB the last 10 years.
     
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  2. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    I wasn't ignoring you. You threw a lot out there and sometimes I can't respond right away. I honestly can't say I agree with any of your six reasons, but I appreciate the well thought out reply.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  3. Bend Steel

    Bend Steel Well-Known Member

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    Imma have to go with TDFW on this one 100%. Steelresolve is simply guessing and a little pissy that not everyone agrees with his guesses.
     
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  4. Steelresolve

    Steelresolve Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Jul 4, 2022
  5. Steelresolve

    Steelresolve Well-Known Member

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    Yep you got me.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. jeh1856

    jeh1856 Beer is good

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    Nice pink color :thumbs_up:
     
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  7. Steelresolve

    Steelresolve Well-Known Member

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    Your dogs are ugly.
     
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  8. Formerscribe

    Formerscribe Well-Known Member

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    Some of that has helped Johnson get a high volume of targets, which was the point. Brown was held back because he was blocked from a featured role until his breakout season. Johnson was given a featured role by the end of his first season due to the needs at receiver around him.
     
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  9. Brice

    Brice Well-Known Member

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    You had me at "biggest strength is his elusiveness and ability to get open." Truer words have never been spoken.

    Diontae is the only receiver on the team that has the ability to get open when playing against the top corners in the league. JuJu tried to be a #1 WR and just failed miserably with Brown gone. Claypool proved last year in his second season with 15 games played and 2 TDs he is definitely not the man to take over the #1 WR spot.

    DJ is a true #1 WR, and right now everyone else is his sidekick. Please pay the man his money and let everyone else fight for the #2 spot for the next 4 years.

    Now that we no longer have the boat anchor that was Ben's Salary, we can afford to invest in some offensive weapons.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Animus

    Animus Well-Known Member

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    My bad... you said "Hate on," which is practically the same connotation as "hater."

    Hines in his third year had a 14.0 YPC and Antonio Brown had 11.9 YPC in their 3rd year. Both were showing signs of being a gamebreaker at that stage of their careers, despite not having close to the amount of catches nor yards that DJ has at this point. DJ is a quality possession receiver. There's no shame in that.
     
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  11. jeh1856

    jeh1856 Beer is good

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    :emperor:
     
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  12. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    It is a double standard Scribe. In 2019 the offense was a mess. I would not say DJ was featured that year. Maybe at the end like you mentioned. But it is hard to say any one player was featured in that offense.

    In 2020 DJ wasn't featured. Before Ben started playing hurt, he was spreading the ball out all over the field. Let's not forget that JuJu was the leading receiver that year with 97 catches. Johnson had to share the ball with Claypool (who was on fire to start that year), JuJu, and even Ebron. The year before AB's breakout year, he had to share the ball with Wallace, Sanders, and Heath.

    The year AB broke out, Mike Wallace had moved on to Miami. The year DJ broke out, JuJu got hurt early in the season. There are a lot of similarities in AB's and DJ's early careers. I am not saying Johnson will be as good as AB. Few guys are. But I do see Johnson as a guy that can get 100 for 1000 year in and year out. To me that is a guy worth keeping around.
     
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  13. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    I have read in this thread that Diontae Johnson is a possession receiver. I have read in this thread that Diontae Johnson is not a game changer. Let's look at DJ's touchdowns.

    2021 8 TDs
    Game 1 5 yard TD
    Game 4 45 yard TD
    Game 5 50 yard TD
    Game 10 10 yard TD
    Game 12 29 yard TD
    Game 12 5 yard TD
    Game 15 15 yard TD
    Game 16 5 yard TD

    2020 7 TDs
    Game 2 28 yard TD
    Game 6 11 yard TD
    Game 6 9 yard TD
    Game 9 12 yard TD
    Game 12 3 yard TD
    Game 14 23 yard TD
    Game 15 39 yard TD

    2019 6 TDs
    Game 3 39 yard TD
    Game 4 43 yard TD
    Game 7 45 yard TD
    Game 13 85 yard TD (punt return)
    Game 13 2 yard TD
    Game 15 29 yard TD

    So in Diontae Johnson's career he has scored 21 TDs. 11 of those TD's have been of 23 yards or more. 7 TDs have been of 30 yards or more. 5 TDs have been of 40 yards or more. Diontae Johnson is not a possession receiver. Diontae Johnson is a game changer!
     
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  14. Vox Ferrum

    Vox Ferrum Well-Known Member

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    That's some compelling research.
     
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  15. Steellamb86

    Steellamb86 Well-Known Member

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    You mentioned JuJu...as I said earlier I have been out of sports the last two years...what happened to JuJu? I thought he was a good player with a big upside when I stopped watching ion 2020.
     
  16. Clive From PIT

    Clive From PIT I don't often drink...but I'm starting to. Site Admin

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    The official story is a season-ending shoulder injury. But we all suspect he lost his drive after he learned you weren’t watching.
     
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  17. Steellamb86

    Steellamb86 Well-Known Member

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    HAHA...that is funny. It was strange when I stopped watching in 2020 and I checked part way through the year and saw the Steelers were 11-0...it was hard to stay away at that point, but then I saw they lost in the first round.

    I am back now so maybe they (another WR) will start playing out of this world...lol.
     
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  18. Steelresolve

    Steelresolve Well-Known Member

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    Thats a cheap response. Pick out one thing and don’t even respond to the rest. Not surprised Turn Down for Watt liked it. Meanwhile he never responded to my recent rebuttal.
     
  19. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    I responded to your first post because it was a well thought out, organized response. I didn't agree with any of it.........but at least it was a semi intelligent post.

    Your most recent response was a maniacal pink blob of text with no punctuation.

    I liked Brice's post because, I like what he wrote. Things I like, I click the like button. Things I don't, I don't.
     
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  20. TuRnDoWnForWaTT

    TuRnDoWnForWaTT Well-Known Member

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    Yes Ben has contributed to the growth of a lot of those WR’s but we still have a proven over the years we are good at drafting and developing wr’s. You can’t deny that. But then again you do seem a little delusional. TO prove your argument wrong look at the Patriots. They have had the greatest QB of all time. How many WR’s have they developed or based on your logic has Tom Brady developed? The Patriots are notoriously recognized as terrible at drafting and developing wr’s. Your argument and logic is very flawed.

    My overall assessment of Dionte is he is very similar to Santonio Holmes. He is good but not great. He is not a game breaker or splash type player. It is very hard to give him his due after having had Antonio Brown on this team who was a mega super star or even Hines Ward who was a tone setter. DJ is neither of those guys and it is unfair to compare him to those guys but inevitably if we were to pay him like a number one wide receiver the expectations would be there to live upto those guys to a certain extent because those guys set the standard here. I just don’t get all that excited about DJ no matter how many stats you throw my way.


    @Steelresolve I see you deleted your post. Here is what you wrote.

    I will give the Steelers their due for drafting well at the receiver position. All I am saying is that Big Ben played a large role in making those receivers who they were. You seemed to acknowledge this. Those draft picks may not have turned out the same way without stellar QB play.

    As for the Patriots, that is a poor comparison. Outside of Brady and Gronk, the Patriots draft, play and win with role players that fit their system. I will say that guys like Wes Welker, Julian Edelman, and Troy Brown were developed by New England. They also do a nice job of squeezing the last drop out of veteran players like Randy Moss and Corey Dillon.

    As for Diontae, you keep posting your opinion, and I will keep posting facts. In 3 years DJ has 21 TDs and 11 of them have been for 20 yards or more. Diontae Johnson absolutely is a game changer.

    2021 8 TDs
    Game 1 5 yard TD
    Game 4 45 yard TD
    Game 5 50 yard TD
    Game 10 10 yard TD
    Game 12 29 yard TD
    Game 12 5 yard TD
    Game 15 15 yard TD
    Game 16 5 yard TD

    2020 7 TDs
    Game 2 28 yard TD
    Game 6 11 yard TD
    Game 6 9 yard TD
    Game 9 12 yard TD
    Game 12 3 yard TD
    Game 14 23 yard TD
    Game 15 39 yard TD

    2019 6 TDs
    Game 3 39 yard TD
    Game 4 43 yard TD
    Game 7 45 yard TD
    Game 13 85 yard TD (punt return)
    Game 13 2 yard TD
    Game 15 29 yard TD

    So in Diontae Johnson's career he has scored 21 TDs. 11 of those TD's have been of 23 yards or more. 7 TDs have been of 30 yards or more. 5 TDs have been of 40 yards or more.
     
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  21. Brice

    Brice Well-Known Member

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    The only good news I have seen is no Trade Demand from DJ's camp yet. Take DJ out of the WR room and we are in the same boat as Baltimore with one of the worst WR rooms in the league.

    That is why I am hoping to see DJ pull a TJ Watt type Holdout this training camp; it would mean at least the two sides are talking.

    I don't see him in a Steelers uniform for $2.7 million this year.
     
  22. jeh1856

    jeh1856 Beer is good

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    You need your vision checked

    DJ pulls a dumb arsed stunt like that and he will never see a football field again

    He has no leverage

    Think before posting
     
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  23. Brice

    Brice Well-Known Member

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    He has no Leverage??? He is holding all the cards. No JuJu, No Washington, and No Ray Ray this year.

    Take DJ out of the WR room and what do you have for 2022? With our inexperienced QB Staff, DJs 3 years of #1 WR NFL experience should be valued like Gold.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  24. jeh1856

    jeh1856 Beer is good

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    :facepalm:
     
  25. Brice

    Brice Well-Known Member

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    Is Claypool your fallback position for our #1 WR. 2021 15 games played and 2 TDs. Oh Boy, maybe he will double that in 2022 as our #1 WR. :)
     
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