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Discussion in 'Steelers Talk' started by Stone, Apr 27, 2020.

  1. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    I get a kick out of how worked up people get over the draft. Let's take a look at a few things that might help a lot of panties to get a breath of fresh air.

    I have read reports that give the Steelers a B+, a C, and a D, and these reports were written by people who do this stuff for a living. One of them will be correct with the grade but not for the reasons they wrote.....just pure luck.

    For weeks leading up to the draft you hear the Mel Kiper Jr's of the world tell you exactly who is better than who.......and they are wrong a staggering amount of the time once you get beyond the handful of sure-fire can't miss players.

    The draft is not too much more skill than a coin flip other than staying solid based on need and not reaching. Keep in mind that the best, most intelligent, GM/coach combinations represent the most polished and skilled football minds in the world and they pick players in the first round who don't make the team and they also pick 5th rounders who become dominant.

    There are teams who, based on the history of their body of work, do better than others but it's because they stay solid based on need and don't reach. And then there are teams who historically do poorly, like the Browns for example, because don't properly evaluate their need and they reach.

    I would like to have seen the Steelers put more focus on O-line but that's because I think Ben is our only hope and I want him to have the time/freedom to find one of our inexperienced WR's.

    So......rather than get heated about the "person" the Steelers drafted, ask yourself "how the Steelers did with staying solid based on need and resisting the urge to reach?"
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    I'm not sure that I understand what you mean by staying solid on need and not reaching. I find that teams that focus specifically on need are the most likely to reach. For example, if you go into a draft saying that RB is your top need, so you're going to take a RB with your first pick no matter what, you're likely to reach. If you go into a draft with 5 or 6 key needs, and you take the best player that fits one of those needs and your scheme (without reaching for a single need) you're less likely to reach, and more likely to come away with good players that meet your needs and fit your schemes. I think you mean the latter, and I would tend to agree, but with one additional caveat: if your own evaluation says that a guy is head and shoulders better than anyone else available, you sometimes need to pull the trigger on a guy even if you don't need that position right now.

    One thing for sure, a team should never give a crap what the Mel Kipers of the world think. Even if the more knowledgable talking heads are right about a lot of players (which I question), they are not looking through the lens of a particular team's scheme fit or future personnel plans.
     
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  3. SDOT

    SDOT Well-Known Member

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    The way the last two drafts have gone. You and Glenn won't be having a playoff party in your backyard for a decade +.
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 4
  4. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    I don't mean need so much as by a single position, I mean need as a team. For example, I like the Highsmith pick because we know we have potential contract issues with our edge rushers and this could ease that pain. Yep, teams who draft based on one single guy/position are not looking at the overall team need.

    You are absolutely right about allowing a certain player to rise a few steps because he fits "your" need as opposed to simply drafting by pundit draft ranking.

    The point about not following the Mel Kipers of the world is exactly the point I was making, even the guys who are considered the de-facto experts are wrong 40% of the time so to get ones panties in a bunch is a waste of time.

    Other than the fact that I thought we should shore up the O-line because of the fact that "all" of our eggs are in Ben's basket, I think the Steelers did well.
     
  5. santeesteel

    santeesteel

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    ……..that's what Frankie said!
    With all the "experts" on here, and on other team's message boards, I don't understand how the Mel Kipers of the world are employed. The fans are obviously better judges of talent, just ask them!
     
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  6. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    Which do you think would be worse right now? The Steelers if they had started letting fans chose the draft picks by on-line voting, five years ago.....or the Browns?
     
  7. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    I really can give this Draft an A+ for the A+ and B+, my actual letter grade, exemplify the exact same aspect of giving out grades; meaningless.




    Team's do not start scouting in August contrary to popular belief. Team's are essentially done scouting players by the time January rolls around anyway for Teams start in May to start the Scouting Process. This was further highlighted last season when Kevin Colbert and Brandon Hunt both stated that the process starts again at some point in mid May. From January to April, that is when the Big Board is assembled for all 32 teams. In addition, as I said before, the NFL Scouting Combine is incredible for all of us to discuss but means nothing to the Scouts, Head Coaches and/or General Managers barring extreme circumstances. Why else was Brandon Hunt on record in saying that 40 times mean little?! 40 times are nothing more than eye candy for the media outlets and fans. Unless that player possess tremendous talent to go along with a blazing 40 time, the results are meaningless.




    Again everyone. Power of choice is at work here. Choose what you desire to believe but make sure to choose wisely when you do.
     
  8. defva

    defva Well-Known Member

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    They started out of the gates with a reach. Anytime, you have to talk up a draft pick or defend your pick. You may have reached ... lol
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  9. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    Wait what the heck is a playoff party? I just assumed every did like I do, hunker down in the bunker and chase everyone away so I can watch the game in peace. Of course I hate everyone so what's good for me isn't necessarily good for everyone even if it is. Let the hate flow.
     
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  10. SDOT

    SDOT Well-Known Member

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    :rolleyes:

    Steelers season was over and we all knew it but some didn't want to admit it. Stone made some outlandish claim something along the lines of "Steelers make the playoffs everybody is invited to my cabin to watch the game" Only Glenn RSVP. Party, date, or whatever you want to call it.
     
  11. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    That is your perception. Just like your inability to answer questions related to the Steelers Roster, your inability to accept what can be is your choice for you DESIRE to deny what is the facts. From an opinion that is formed and then based on initial reaction by media pundits to vein attempts to explain why player A was inferior to player B, all you have done these past two drafts is to showcase to everyone that you are trapped in a reality in which no one can be right unless what you desire is.


    Have fun in your world my man! Stay tuned in that illusion of a world you live in! Me and the other members of the board will be right here in the reality in which we experience every day! :sign0020:
     
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  12. SDOT

    SDOT Well-Known Member

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    I see you changed your sig. One of the guys you wanted fell to us and we didn't even take him. Yet, you blindly support drafts/roster decisions. I use to be like you too. Steelers could do no wrong until I realized it was getting us nowhere and part of the reason we aren't winning anything.
     
  13. AskQuestionsLater

    AskQuestionsLater Writing Team

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    You are correct on my previous signature. Yes I did change my sig; make predictions on Rookie stat lines. I do that every after shortly after the draft is complete. That said, I also had Jalen Raegor as the third option behind J.K. Dobbins. Know why?! How is J.K. Dobbins taking the top off of a defense through the air?! For that matter, how is J.K. Dobbins assisting through the air as a pass catching back overall?! What does he provide through the air that the likes of Jaylen Samuels does not?!


    Again, you are letting your illusion shape your opinion; trapping you inside a world of misinformation amplified by your raw impulses and desire to pick players because you desire to have the Steelers make the choices you want. However, what you want ≠ what the teams needs.



    At some point, you are going to have to get out of your own head. It is not assisting you in any meaningful way. The only major aspect you are doing is inciting negativity and inviting misery.
     
  14. Rollers

    Rollers Well-Known Member

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    I remember when the draft was held much earlier. That favored the teams that had a good scouting department and a good front office. Now there are very few surprises out there since every kid in college is evaluated to the Nth degree. The steelers made hay during that period by being on top of kids everyone else seemed to miss. I wish we were back to those days. I think the Steelers had a solid draft and give it a B+ in my opinion. We will see how it goes over the coming years as is usual with a draft class. I think Baltimore is going to be at the head of this division for a very long time now. They have a young franchise QB and very good coaching. A fine front office as well. The Steelers are behind them at this point. We will see how that translates into wins and division titles.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. The Glory Days

    The Glory Days Well-Known Member

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    There are very few draft decisions that are definitively great or terrible at the time they are made. The statement "on paper" is very appropriate during the draft and is an extremely weak assessment of the decision's value. But the value simply cannot be determined until the first regular-season game, at the very least. Your shiny, new first pick isn't even guaranteed to play a down of football. And if he does, there's no guarantee he pans out.

    I wish they had drafted differently, but it really makes no difference at this point. If they loaded up on the OL and created the best pocket in football for Ben, an injury to him or one of the new linemen could unravel the whole thing. It's, for this reason, I don't get wrapped up in the specifics of the draft. I look at need and hope that needs get addressed. I don't think we did enough to address the glaring needs we have. But even if we checked off all the boxes on TGD's need-list, I don't have a lot of faith in our coaching staff to use them properly.

    Only time will tell if we got what we needed and were able to make good use of them.
     
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  16. Blast Furnace

    Blast Furnace Staff Member Mod Team

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    Only thing coaches and GM’s find useful about the Combine is getting to talk to some of the prospects and medical.

    As you said, they’ve already scouted them. What we fans spend time doing after the season, teams have been doing all year.
     
  17. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    I did in fact make a claim that if the Steelers made the playoffs I would host a party. I figured most people would rather watch certain members of this board than watch the Steelers one and done playoff mantra lately.

    Glenn:
    [​IMG]

    You:
    [​IMG]
     
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  18. santeesteel

    santeesteel

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    The guy who covered the draft here for the Union-Tribune gave the Steelers a B grade this year. I choose to go with his assessment.
     
  19. steel machine

    steel machine Well-Known Member

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    Speaking of the draft, from what I've read I'm giving the mighty Bengals an A+. Now will these draft picks pan out remains to be seen but if they do the Bengals could be tough team in a few years.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  20. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    That explains why KJU hasn't been seen in a few weeks. It was draft time, and he was busy pining for Metcalf (again)!
     
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  21. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    That, and the fact that it has to take a lot of time to come up with an analysis of a host of players, twist up outlandish rants about those players for the sole purpose of garnering attention to yourself, while pretending to know a little bit about football, yet proving in the same rant that you don't have a clue.

    THAT kind of devotion and dedication to ones craft takes time!
     
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  22. santeesteel

    santeesteel

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    The local guy gave the Bengals an A too. I'll be more interested in the grades on these picks a year from now. After training camp, injuries, NFL games vs. the college level they've been playing in. After all, Leaf was considered by many to be worth a first round pick and nobody wanted that skinny dork, Tom Brady!
     
  23. Stone

    Stone Well-Known Member

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    The way you post, you could have a party at your house with free booze, Filet Mignon, and live lobster and nobody would come for a decade +.:drinks:
     
  24. SDOT

    SDOT Well-Known Member

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    B when you started the deepest draft in a long time with an all pro safety is horrible. That means if you remove Minkah and look at just the draft they did like a D or C-.
     
  25. Steel Hog

    Steel Hog Well-Known Member

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    Exactly correct. IMO.
     

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