espy says patriots greatest team of all time... BS

I always love the placement people put on Dan Marino in all time great QB discussions. If he'd gone to the University of Kansas he'd never get a mention. He never won squat, rarely got close. He's a poor copy of Peyton Manning without Peyton Mannings playoff success.

 

What reason in the world makes you put Bradshaw in front of Brady?!

 

Bradshaw didnt play in a qb friendly era. You have to understand. If guys like Bradshaw, stabler, namath, and tarkenington played now. With a 16 game schedule and these rules. Numbers would be just as good if not better.

Can u imagine with these rules how many championships Dan fouts and the chargers would have? With the dudes he had to throw to

 

I understand what you are saying completely but there is no way Bradshaw belongs above Brady on all time list. For me, it's Brady, Montana, Unitas, Marino, Bradshaw

 

Just curious and not trying to argue but if you understand what I meant. How do you put Brady at 1? If you base it on team awards and rings then sure. He could be there. But if you are just talking about playing the position. No way on earth he is better than Marino or unitas.

 

Anyone who says marino isnt in the discussion doesn't need to participate in the discussion lol. The man was one of the best

 

I don't know but living in south Florida and born and raised in Pittsburgh I did follow Marino, yeah he had a great arm and could match up as one of the greatest but he never won the big games. He had one of the greatest coaches in Shula who listened to Marino, who all he wanted to do was pass pass and pass some more, he wanted to do it all on offense so Shula let him and tried to build a team to pass and pass and pass some more. Yeah, Marino was happy but could not win the big games. The great QBs have Super Bowls and a lot of playoff games under their belt but Marino never did get a SB win in all the years he played, so in my eyes I cannot put him up their with Brady, Montana, Manning, Bradshaw, or even Big Ben, winning the big games is what makes players great.

 

Of course ESPN would say that. That's their home team and they are basically operating as an extension of the Pats PR apparatus. They've helped cover up two cheating scandals. It may sound like jealousy or sour grapes, but I believe this 100 percent. Any team and QB could have done what the Pats have done with the breaks and help they've consistently received. I didn't watch the AFC title game this year but saw a video about it and it might have been as rigged as the NFCC game. You have a "national" sports media company (ESPN) doing constant PR for them and covering for them. You have the NFL protecting Brady more than any other QB in the history of the league. Any close call in a Pats game will go to them about 90-95 percent of the time. No other NFL teams get anywhere close to that. The Pats' "greatness" is a manufactured narrative and too many people have fallen for it.

 

I understand what you meant but at the same time if you are going to say teams offensive numbers would be way higher in today's NFL wouldn't the same be true that dominant defenses wouldn't have been as dominant in today's NFL? For example the Steelers defense of the 70s? It goes both ways. Reason I put Brady number one is because he has the numbers AND the most rings. At the end of the day, you play for championships, right?

 

They still wouldn't have any. Fouts never had a good enough defense and could ALWAYS be counted on to throw an INT in the end zone at a crucial moment.

 

Yes. As a team u play for championships. It's not an individual award. Aikman has multiple and so does young. Also trent dilfer and Brad Johnson have rings. It cant go both ways. The way you play the position has to be all the factors. I mean Jim Kelly got to 4 in a row. If he had bradys kicker he has at least 1.

 

Of course you have to have a supporting cast but the key part to that cast is a quarterback. Wins and losses are tallied for only one position on the field. Same goes for 4th quarter comebacks and so on. That's the quarterback position.

 

Why are wins and losses tallied for a quarterback and not a kicker?

 

I agree. They should be. That was one of my points. If they dont make those kicks, is Brady considered the greatest with a below .500 record in super bowls?

 

Your entire basis in this whole debate is all based on what ifs? What if the rules were different , what if Brady played in the 70s, what if a kicker missed a couple fgs here and there. The reality of the situation is none of those things happened or are going to happen. The reality, however, is Brady is 5-3 in Super Bowls with the most rings for a starting QB and is getting ready to appear in his 9th with a chance to tie the Steelers for most in NFL history. Those are the the facts

 

We will just have to agree to disagree. You want to group in team awards and I want to look at how u play the position.

If watch how the position is suppose to be played Brady is good. Not saying he isnt but he isnt the best. Arm strength, accuracy, movement, having all the throws. Can play in any offense. Stuff like that is how I judge.

 

Agreed. They both like cheating. And don't forget, they play in a division that is consistently the worst in the NFL.

 

Call me bitter or a grudge holder or whatever...….Pats first 3 super bowl wins will always have an astric *next to them...
Also im sure this has been touched on already but Brady is lucky he has been able to play in this era of football,because he would not
have survived the 70's ,80's or maybe even the 90's.He sure wouldn't be playing at this level at 40 years old

 

I've always felt like that was an overrated stat.

If a QB plays like crap for 3 quarters, and turns it on in the last 15 minutes, that is a +1 for another 4th quarter comeback. Playing well the entire game, so the other team is always down by two scores, would seem to be a better trait.

 

I don't follow college sports and I've only been to western PA once. Marino could have gone to U of East Jesus for all I care. If he'd had a defense...…...

 

Anyone who thinks Marino isnt a top 5 doesnt know football. Quarterbacks are still trying to copy his release

 

And you do? Tell us Vince, what makes you such an expert?