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Game of Thrones (HBO) - Time to jump on board

Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by Ray D, Jan 18, 2012.

  1. TerribleTowelFlying

    TerribleTowelFlying Staff Member Site Admin Mod Team

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    That might have been the hardest scene to sit through of the entire series.

    I'm loving this season so far. Can someone explain the Nymeria scene to me? I was walking my daughter around on my shoulder so she'd fall asleep for bedtime, and I couldn't quite make out what happened. Was it Nymeria or wasn't it?

    How'd everyone feel about Theon jumping ship? 'My name is Reek it rhymes with meek'.
     
  2. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    That was her and her pack. I'm guessing t's a nod to the book readers about all the backstory that echoes Arya's experiences.

    I'm seeing more nods to the stories they cut out these last two seasons. Hound peeing in the river, digging the graves etc.

    Thought that was a BS move to make him do it there. I'd have liked to see a good redemption arc continue or a look she gives him signaling him to get away and report....something other than "Look see he's still broken".

    We may get that revelation next week, or not.
     
  3. Ray D

    Ray D Staff Member Mod Team

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    That was Nymeria. Arya told her she was going home and asked her to come with her. Then Nymeria turned away and left. Arya remarks "That's not you. "

    The show writers confirmed that what Arya was saying is that she recognizes that Nymeria is not a pet. She had her own pack now and will remain wild. It was meant to echo Arya responding to Ned's telling her how she'd marry and be a lady of a house one day, "that's not me."

    I'm a tad annoyed at how they pushed the direwolves pretty much out of the story, especially considering that they show that Bran isn't the only warg in the Stark family (indeed, it appears they all may be to some extent). And it leaves out what may be important to the end game for a simpler ending. Or maybe they'll come back to it later. We'll see.

    Theon jumping ship. Cowardice? Or living to fight another day? Both?
     
  4. niterider

    niterider Well-Known Member

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    Just not enough enough in the budget for Direwolves. Apparently they take extensive CGI to make it believable. Dragons are much easier.

    The actor for Theon is amazing. You could see in his face when he turned back to "Reek".
     
  5. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    Surprised there has been no talk about episode 3 yet. I was a bit let down by the long-awaiting meeting between Danaerys and Jon. It seemed a bit flat to me. Otherwise I really liked the episode. Cersei's strategy was brilliant. Eliminate a key enemy and acquire funds necessary to pay off the bank. Olenna stole the show. Even in death and defeat, she got to have the last word - and a doozy that last word was. She will be missed.

    Things are accelerating. The jump between episodes 2 and 3 must have been months.
     
  6. Ray D

    Ray D Staff Member Mod Team

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    I thoughtthe first meeting with Jon and Dany was fine. Awkward. Both trying to size each other up and assert their position without creating an automatic enemy (less so with Dany. She got a bit pushy, but I suppose from her point of view it was reasonable). Once Dany becomes convinced of the Army of the Dead, I believe things will go better between them.

    As much as Cersei deserves hate, you gotta hand it to her for creativity. Her punishment of Ellaria was as cruel as one could possibly imagine (and I'm sure, should Cersei still be in power in a year or 2, it'll get even worse). That said, their end around of Dany's Unsullied Army had to have been all Jaime. Cersei isn't that smart. Tyrion is really dropping the ball lately.

    I'll wager most of those scrolls and books the Arch Maester gave Sam to copy are important. He knows Sam can absorb info quickly and put it to use. He probably chose those tomes deliberately. I wonder what information they contain that he thinks Sam should learn.

    Euron in the books is evil incarnate. This Euron is almost... likeable? Sure, he's an a-hole, but he's an entertaining one.

    Way back in, I think, season 2, Melisandre told Arya she'd meet her again. Now she says she will have to return because she's supposed to die there. 1+1=? ;)

    Pour a drink out for Olenna Tyrell. Even went out like a boss.
     
  7. niterider

    niterider Well-Known Member

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    This episode reminded me of Season 1. A lot of meaningful dialog and I liked it. I thought the Jon and Dany meeting was great, you could just feel the tension in that room. I especially loved his introduction. LOL

    [​IMG]
     
    • Hilarious Hilarious x 2
  8. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    OMG! We've been waiting for this for a long time. The budget must be off the charts!

    Bran is ticking me off. You all know why it's the same crap we bitched about with Rick in "The Walking Dead" not telling everyone what the doctor said....

    He doesn't even need to come out and say it straight up. He could just tell them not to trust Littlefinger because...

    Last scene was cheesy and we all knew what Braun was going to do. My only hang-up was exactly what they were going to do with
    the wounding or death of one of the dragons

    Also, I thought he was black? How did he turn red all of a sudden?

    You think they're holding true to the Book cannon of the Golden Company? If so could this be a Trojan horse type plot device?
     
  9. Ray D

    Ray D Staff Member Mod Team

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    The last scene was cheesy? Are we talking about the little swim? Or the whole scene?

    The fanboy in me wants to geek out about the entire last 10 minutes or so. My cynical side wants to poke holes all through it. But I'll limit my nit picking to 2 things:

    1- Where has anyone ever seen a lake that dropped off to 20-30 feet deep within a 3-4 feet from shore? That is, when the ground around the lake is flat (not a steep mountain or hillside going into it). And there's little reason to think there'd be a glacial lake in the Reach. I suppose it could be a water filled sink hole, but those tend to be pretty well formed circular shapes. But I guess we can let this one slide. But that brings me to...

    2- Jaime Lannister is dead. He avoided dragon fire only to drown. Now, I know he's probably going to be alive and well next week. But he should be dead. DEAD. He's wearing heavy plate armor that requires an assistant to take off or put on. He has one working hand, so even if he could somehow take it off himself, less likely for him. He can't swim in that, and Bronn would have a hard time swimming himself, let alone dragging an armored knight with him.

    Lizard, Drogon is black(ish), or darkly colored anyway. But even the books describe him as having streaks of red. My guess is the wound is minor. He was able to recover and set down softly even with it still in his shoulder. All it really did was tick him off. Now had it entered his open mouth, or pierced an eye or something, yeah. Probably dead.

    Bran knows exactly who and what Littlefinger is. And if he's starting to also glimpse the future, that would explain his saying it doesn't matter - LF won't be a threat one way or another. My bet is Arya uses his own dagger on him (and perhaps Bran already knew this would happen). My only questions are how, why and when.

    Arya moving like Syrio Forel against Brienne and giving her fits. Loved that scene. Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but follow me on it. On that last little exchange, Brienne disarms and pulls Arya off balance in order to pull her face toward the sword point (checkmate). But Arya counters it nicely and at the very least, ensures they both would die with that dagger, or perhaps even gets the killing blow in first. When asked who taught her that, she says "No one." (Loved that line) But something seemed familiar about Brienne's move. I went back and looked, and it's very close if not the same maneuver Syrio used on Arya when she was first training with him. Could be coincidence. Could just be Arya learning from mistakes. Or was she implying something? Or was it an unintentionally ironic statement? (yeah. I know. But I'll never give up that ghost. Syrio lives, dammit. LOL)



    As far as the Golden Company:

    I very much doubt they'll introduce that plot so late into the game. (or at least the whole (F)Aegon thing) But the Golden Company is known to be very formidable, so they'll use that reputation (or even as a nod to the books) to give Cersei more weight. After all, after tonight, one could be forgiven in thinking Dany will win this thing in a walk. More than half of what we're seeing the last season and a half or so is - I won't call it fan fiction (even if some of it clearly is) - a heavy variation on what's to come in the books. They didn't just trim fat. They trimmed a lot of meat as well to shortcut to the end and/or save time. They know GRRM's endgame, but how to get there, they're taking their own path.
     
  10. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    Well the swim definitely. Although I'm guessing that was either the Trident or the Red Forks Which is the river running through to the Blackwater. Still they showed the column crossing at a fording point and it looked pretty shallow from the overhead shots.

    He's also got some serious leaping ability in leather armor after battling through Dothraki hordes though!

    Braun, as soon as he was horsed, you knew what he was going to do. Especially after he looked at his gold. So the chase was....meh just get there and show me how they try to do this. Why no other dummy decided to use the dragoon is a mystery. You mean the guys charged with pulling the thing didn't know what it was there for and left it abandoned and covered even when they saw the dragon coming?

    That's nit picky, but it was a bad ass dragon flaming barbecue!

    Golden Company: they've been name dropping things from the books. I'm betting they made sure to drop that Tarley line about the gold early so she can get them employed. She's going to need an army after that.

    Problem is the original Golden Company was started by a Targarian bastard and that was the key to the Dornish plans. If they bring them out just to have them be Cersies' army, I'll be ticked. I'd like a betrayal angle where they take over and reveal who they are though.
     
  11. Ray D

    Ray D Staff Member Mod Team

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    The Red Fork (which is really part of the Trident) and the Trident are in the Riverlands, not the Reach. But upon viewing it again, it's definitely a river. The Trident does not empty into the Blackwater Rush, but rather a bay well north of King's Landing and even Dragonstone. The Blackwater is fed primarily by the God's Eye. That is, if I remember the geography correctly. I can't recall if the Trident feeds the God's Eye, but I don't think it does. My best guess is that it's the Blackwater Rush. Still odd, because the Blackwater Rush is navigable by ship. This river is kind of narrow. Could be a minor river or tributary not on the map. Either way, it's a river.

    Which still makes it confusing, because, again, what river have you ever seen on flat ground drop off 20-30 feet within a yard or so of the shore?

    But maybe a better question is, why do we even care? :lolol: Suspension of disbelief and all that.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2017
  12. niterider

    niterider Well-Known Member

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    I'm going to have to disagree with you there. The one thing I am loving about game of thrones is the long take during battle scenes. In fact they have been able to perfect that. Being able to follow one person through a battle gives you a better immersion effect. I feel more connected. Also, the soldiers may have known they were pulling a mechanical spear but I doubt they really thought shooting a flame throwing Dragon down was going to be a part of their day. I know I would thing twice about pointing that arrow at a Dragon who could instantly turn me into ashes.
     
  13. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    Not to mention taking your attention away from a screaming Dothraki horde that's hell bent on slicing you to ribbons. They were flat out routed, and I think most of the soldiers were in pure survival mode.
     
  14. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    I get where you guys are going with that, but it was specifically presented to Cersei as a dragon killing weapon.

    Jamie obviously took it as a precaution against dragons attacking. The one thing we know is how well drilled the Lannister and Tarley armies are. You know he had them drilled on what and how it was to be used. They were surprised, but when the order came to form a line they should have un-boxed the weapons and prepared it just in case. If not when the form line call, but when the dragon showed up. He specifically sent Braun to the weapon and it was loaded already.

    Like I said that's being nitpicky and it was to give Braun a hero moment (2 in the one battle!) again. It's hard not to like him.
     
  15. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    Well, on that note there's plenty to nit pick regarding Jaime's preparation overall. You're moving an army that size and don't have scouts and lookouts ranging a few miles out in all directions to avoid being surprised? I suppose we could just say that Jaime had scouts, and they were taken out by the Dothraki before they could report, but I didn't see anything in the episode to suggest that was the case. The look on Jaime's face clearly showed surprise when the dragon appeared. Did he not believe they really existed? Did he logically think that they would still be tiny at their young age? I don't know, but Jaime got caught with his pants down. Maybe we can connect some dots and infer that Olenna's dying barb occupied his thoughts so much that he failed to properly plan for the return trip.

    I hope he's alive and captured. It will set up an interesting dynamic with him and Tyrion.
     
  16. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    Lots of possibilities there given Jaime's change of heart when he was traveling with Brienne and how he seemed to want to rise above the Kingslayer moniker. So being Dany's prisoner might open his eyes and he would be more reluctant to blindly follow the woman he loves.
     
  17. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    Talk about fast forwarding! Sheesh! They are just chewing up plot points each episode!
     
  18. Ray D

    Ray D Staff Member Mod Team

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    Everyone has jet packs on now.

    Definitely has the stench of 2 producers getting tired and just trying to rush to the end. I'm sure there are other factors (money, keeping actors past 7 years, etc). But the story is without a doubt getting the bum rush now. Le's just hope it ends well despite the rush. We don't want another "Lost."

    So Rhaegar and Lyanna were married. Doesn't surprise me. After all, the whole Tower of Joy exchange in the books implies heavily that the Kingsguard were there to do their duty. And their duty is first and foremost to PROTECT THE KING. Following rules of succession, any legitimate son of Rhaegar came first before Viserys. "Ser Willem Derry took young Viserys and his mother to Dragonstone. Why did you not go with him?" "Ser Willem is a good knight and true, but he is NOT a Kingsguard." Read: Viserys isn't the heir. We'd be with him if he was. Our job is here.

    Dany had a vision in The House of the Undying (that didn't make it into the show) of Rhaegar with who she assumed was Ellia Martell. Proclaiming that their son would be named Aegon, and he is "The song of Ice and Fire." Obviously, it must have been Lyanna. It seems odd he'd name their son Aegon. He already had an Aegon with Ellia, his first wife. I'm not sure what's going on there. But I'll wager Jon's true name is Aegon. (This could really open up things in the books with (F)Aegon, but we'll never see it on the show)

    Can't believe there's only 2 episodes left this year. But I'm sure they'll be whoppers.
     
  19. Lizard72

    Lizard72

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    Yeah, I'm getting worried that the nuance that made the show is out the window now.

    They did a good job of paring down the ends of the know from the books, but they really have started just closing them out with deaths.
     
  20. strummerfan

    strummerfan Well-Known Member

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    Could anyone read the note littlefinger hid? It appears to say something about someone is dead, killed from wounds he took in...
    Something about Joffrey and tried to steal his throne
    Swear fealty to King Joffrey

    Signed by Sansa?
     
  21. Ray D

    Ray D Staff Member Mod Team

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    It's the letter Cersei made Sansa write in season one. They convinced her that if she testified against her father, they'd spare his life. So the letter talks about how Ned (air quotes) tried to usurp Robert's heir and put Stannis on the Throne (/air quotes) after he died. In short, Sansa wrote a letter proclaiming her father to be a traitor. (I'm assuming to get the North to stand down and not march south)

    It was under duress. She was doing it to save him (or so she thought). And they dictated the letter to her.

    Littlefinger wasn't trying to hide it. He WANTED Arya to find it while making it seem that he AND Sansa were trying to keep it a secret. He wants to pit them against each other. Arya is clearly a threat, and Sansa isn't buying his BS anymore. He's running out of moves.
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2017
  22. thorn058

    thorn058 Well-Known Member

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    Knowing that the end is coming, I find the pacing to be good although you guys are right there are moments when I go ok how to Jaime get to King's Landing so quickly, how did they set things up so fast and then I let my suspension of disbelief take over and just roll with it because there is Dragons and I have been waiting for the battles.

    That being said if they drag Jon's parentage out any more I am going to scream bloody murder. I wanted to scream at Sam, shut the hell up she was just about to reveal why your best friend is King of the Seven Kingdoms, even though is was a cute scene between he and Gilly. How symbolic was the scene between Jon and Gendrey? The Son of Rhaegar and the Son of Robert standing face to face.
     
  23. TerribleTowelFlying

    TerribleTowelFlying Staff Member Site Admin Mod Team

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    I'm loving every episode. I try to look the other way when a character uses his jetpack.

    The battle with the Scorpion was awesome, but a little frustrating for me, mainly because Bronn is OP. Hopefully they nerf him in the next update.

    Exactly. Littlefinger's manipulation game is strong. Very strong.
     
  24. Steel_Elvis

    Steel_Elvis Staff Member Mod Team

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    I am enjoying the season, but I really feel like they're cramming too much in too quickly. So many scenes would have been great with more detail. Jaime and Tyrion meeting for example. There could have been way more dialogue there. It was so fast that it was a bit of a letdown for me. Or how about the battles for Casterly Rock and Highgarden. One was about 1-2 minutes, and the other was not even shown.

    So while I'm enjoying it, I feel like they're rushing and losing the level of cool detail that we saw for the first 6?seasons. They could have easily done a 10 episode season, and not cut it to 7. What could have been epic is just good.

    My opinion anyway.
     
  25. niterider

    niterider Well-Known Member

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    That's my take on this season as well. Everything feels rushed. Any explanation as to why they cut it down from 10 episodes? It can't be budget because GOT is HBO's bread and butter right now. Are the writers that lost without a book to base it on?
     

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