A Little Something for the Tomlin Argument

This is the correct stat my bad fellas.

Still pretty bad any way you slice it.

 

Dang I didn't think the Browns had been that good. Gotta give credit where's it's due. LOL!

 

Mike Tomlin is the coach of the Steelers. Like him or not. I support his efforts. Do I always agree? No. Is he a great coach? No. Can he get this team to the Super Bowl again? Or two? And win? This will be the gauge. Greatness comes from winning more then one. Personally I don't feel that Cowher was a great coach. Once he stepped out of the Schottenheimer shadow, and Ben sure did help, he became a Super Bowl winner. Lets not forget, he didn't want to draft a QB. He wanted an offensive lineman. Plus he liked that hick Rivers over Ben.

Coaches coach the players they are delt with. Cowher coached Noll's players and Tomlin coached Cowher's players. Get over it. It happens on other teams all the time. So does anyone think that Gruden is a great coach? Madden? Common...

 

I like Tomlin... but he pisses me off like Cowher did in the 90's and early 00's... and Noll did in the 80's. We Steelers fans are blessed with great head coaches.

 

Writers claimed nolls best coaching job minus the superbowl wins was with the 89 team, he went 9-7 with some no names like Greg Lloyd, Rod Woodson, Carnell Lake and Hardy Nickerson) who were making plays all over the field, and not a one of them was even 25 years old, they made the playoffs that year after starting out losing bad, and they won their first playoff game and lost in the division round to denver, but noll coached them up and some say his best coaching job ever, plus he left some stars to provide cowher with a nucleus for his team...

 

Troublemaker

 

For those that consistently question and pair coach Tomlins success with being the benefactor of Cowhers players I submit the question:

Name 1 sport where a new coach has succeeded for 10 straight years (non losing record) with another coaches players? Again 10 years? Name the sport?

Now keep in mind that football players have a very short life span, much shorter than other sports.

I also submit the question:

Name the coaches with better winning percentages in their first 10 years of coaching?
How many ya got?

Last question how many of those coaches had great QB?

Most if not all you say?
Then shut up already about Tomlin having Ben

Also if Tomlins record is abysmal against sub 500 teams and his winning percentage is in the highest tier then dosent that mean that he has an exceptional record against teams OVER 500

How else would he get that winning percentage

 

I agree. Tomlin is not a great coach. I think he's between good and very good on the scale of coaching greatness. I think there is only one great coach in the league right now. There are a few good to very good coaches and there are some downright awful coaches. Tomlin needs another Super Bowl if he wants to be considered a great coach.

 

holy ****
who????

 

Guess.

 

Today on FS1 Terry Bradshaw said Tomlin isn't a good coach, but a great cheerleader, lol.

 

Facts are often purely quantitative and rarely tell the whole story.

Labriola makes a few claims in his article that need to be addressed, but the main one has to do with winning a Super Bowl. Yes, Tomlin did it with a full cupboard. But something also needs to be addressed: Tomlin's road to that title was paved in gold: 1. Tom Brady was lost for the season and New England was not as much of a threat; 2. The Steelers got very fortunate in drawing a 9-7 Cardinals team instead of any of the NFC powerhouses--Giants, Panthers, or Eagles; 3. The Steelers luckily faced a rookie QB at home in the AFCCG. And yet, in terms of #2 and #3, they nearly lost on both occasions.

Yes, it's better to be lucky than good. I'll take that trophy to the bank. It's the Steelers', and I won't deny that. But Tomlin didn't coach the Steelers to that title anymore than Barry Switzer coached the Cowboys to theirs.

Let's look at these numbers...

In Noll's first 10 seasons: Steelers 88-53-1
In Cowher's first 10 seasons: 99-61
In Tomlin's first 10 seasons: 101-57

Tomlin's numbers are better. Right? But you have to look closer. Let's look at the coaches' five-year splits. First five years and then second five years.

Noll: 33-37 / 55-16-1
Cowher: 53-27/46-34
Tomlin: 55-25/46-32

Noll's teams got better, Cowher's and Tomlin's not so much. But then here is where free agency can explain some of this. There was only a soft cap in the 90s--signing bonuses did not count toward the cap. Cowher's teams were seriously handcuffed financially. He was competing on an uneven playing field. Nevertheless, Cowher's BEST regular season was his tenth season, when the club went 13-3, in the more structured salary cap, with Heinz Field just opened. There was an upward curve present for Cowher. As of yet, there is no such upward curve for Tomlin. In other words, Cowher inherited a good team and then rebuilt it and won again. Tomlin...eh, not so much.

But this might be the most telling stat of all:

Tomlin has led the Steelers to two AFC title games in his first ten seasons.
Noll: led them to four
Cowher: led them to four

Just let those numbers sink in a moment.

What's more, the QBs Noll had to face to get to and through the post-season: Stabler, Griese, Tarkenton, Staubach.
Cowher: Moon, Montana, Aikman, Elway, Kelly, Brady, Manning
Tomlin: Flacco, Warner, Garrard, Manning, Tebow, Sanchez, Rodgers

You see something in those names?

 

It's funny how no one says Phil Jackson won with Doug Collins players. Odd that no one acknowledges Belicheck's 5 of 6 losing seasons before 2001 including 1 with the Patriots or that all of his winning seasons came with Brady at the helm.

 

Belichick wasn't the coach in 1995 that he was in 2001. You think he started out as a genius? Or that he learned a thing or two along the way?

And not all of his winning season came with Brady: he went 11-5 with some guy named Matt Cassel as his QB.

 

wooden spoon

 

Your framing of the 5 year splits and the salary cap, completely misses the most relevant component of the Tomlin narrative. That he was able to take a "contender" team where it needed to go, but then had to deal with the cap repurcusions of keeping that team together (aging, costly, dead cap space, etc), and effectively completely rebuilt the team (those 8-8 rebuild seasons on the back half of his split.

 

I can't stand Jason Whitlock but I totally agree with his assessment of Tomlin. However, he needs to get his head out of his butt about Haley. Todd Haley is the man and Whitlock just needs to deal with it. When Belichick calls you a genius that's the end of the story. Although honestly Munch might be the most unsung hero on the team.

 

The point is, here in year 10, there is no 13-3 season on the horizon. What exactly has Tomlin rebuilt? The sad part is that the 2016 Steelers are more talented than the 2001 Steelers. The difference: Cowher got his team to overachieve in a division with the defending champs; Tomlin's team has so far under-achieved in a weak division.

 

So, are you saying SDOT is Terry Bradshaw?

 

So, are you saying my cover is blown?

 

Not too many seasons back the AFC North was considered one of the toughest. It seems that the steelers, ravens and bengals rise and fall at similar times.

On a side note: Interesting points you raise about being lucky over good. We could also consider the Renfro non-td in 79, or getting the 9-7 LA Rams over the Cowboys.

Which is not to say Tomlin's teams aren't maddeningly inconsistent and rely on luck too much...

 

When Bens's done MT will be done. Thanks coach T see ya.