Michael Sam

Sam doesn't fit in a 3/4 defense.

 

I'm sure there are other gay players in the NFL, but go ahead and name one. Go ahead, just one. Michael Sam is more open about his homosexuality than any player in NFL history. Sam is a mediocre to average football player at the NFL level. He's probably not the worst gay player in the NFL but he's the most open about his sexuality. It doesn't get any more open than passionately kissing your boyfriend on national television after you get drafted.

I said all of that to say this: personal feelings aside, if you're going to be an unabashedly and openly gay player in the NFL you'd better be a superstar. If not, I think most teams will come to the conclusion that mediocrity and average ability is not worth the unwanted distractions. It appears that both the Rams and Cowboys have reached that conclusion.

 

I can't believe we're back on this Tebow thing.

They won those games by the defense getting some really key stops and him pulling something out of his butt at the last minute of games. They were only in those games because of the defense.
Same thing in that damn playoff game! depleted secondary was just watching him chunk balls up for big yards! he threw one great 10 yard pass to DT who took it to the house with slow ass Ike and Troy in tow!

 

It wasn't just that play. Tebow played an absolutely outstanding game against us. I'm not saying he's a starting-caliber QB overall, but on that day, he was a Pro Bowl caliber QB. We got the unlucky roll of the dice, all the best plays of his career seemed to come on that day. We also shot ourselves in the foot on offense.

My point about Tebow is that even if you don't think he should start (who does?), he's done a lot of good stuff on the field, and has a particular set of skills. Honestly, if he didn't have a circus, I'd be thrilled to have him on my roster. He would be way better than our current #3, and also great to bring in on certain plays, like short yardage, or just once in awhile. He's a versatile, all-around player.

It was Taylor and Mundy, by the way. Troy was nowhere near.

 

I think of Tebow as more of a "football player" than I do as a qb if that makes any sense. He's just this rugged and physical dude that likes to go out there and get dirty and do as much or as little as he needs to to win. I really think the MAIN reason we lost that game though was because Ben was too hurt to "be Ben". I think if Ben had rested from the time he got hurt and was a little more fresh from the playoffs we could have won that game but who knows? Denver and Oakland just seem to be places we can't play.

 

I'm pretty sure he's not just the most open, he's the only open one. Maybe some other guys have come out to a close friend or something, but it can't be more than a few people, because if it was, it'd get out and we'd know about it. There has never been an openly gay active NFL player. They always wait until they retire to come out.

Don't you think that's disgusting? I don't disagree with that's how things went, but I think that's incredibly f'd up, and needs to change. "Stay in the closet" is not acceptable career counseling. To me that's no better than "pretend you're a mute" or "pretend you're a girl." The media bringing such attention is a major problem, but that wouldn't be the case if there wasn't such controversy among fans. So the fans (maybe not you personally, readers) need to stop being bigots. Such media attention also won't be the case once it happens a few more times, which is why I believe Sam will ultimately - years from now, after we have more openly gay NFL players actually on teams - be considered a hero, for absorbing the initial shockwave of hate, media attention, and paying the price out of his own pocket with a ridiculously shortened career. (Hopefully he gets a book deal or something to make up for the millions he'll lose.)

On the topic of whether his sexuality is what dictated his ultra-speedy exit, it's my opinion that if Sam was straight or completely closeted, he'd have been drafted somewhere from the 2nd-4th round. That'll sound crazy to some people, who see where a guy was drafted and cement it into their minds that's the only place he could have been drafted. But guys are taken way higher or lower than expected all the time. Vontaze Burfict went from a sure-fire 1st or 2nd rounder to UDFA (and then went on to play like a 1st or 2nd rounder). Mike Mitchell was a late round or UDFA prospect and went in the 2nd. I was thrilled landing Chase Minnefield in the 3rd for our message board draft, but in real life a few days later he went in the 7th. In college, Sam was considered a premier pass rusher in the premier SEC. His pre-draft workouts hurt him, and he didn't establish himself as versatile. But the DPOY in the SEC with good character and no red flags does not slide into the 7th round. We took Bruce Davis in the 3rd, and the consensus was decent value. I remember hearing "home run pick" by the ESPN pundit on draft day. Davis was not as lauded as Sam in college, and played in a generally weaker conference. Then, he went on to do NOTHING in preseason, but made the team. After another terrible preseason he was cut, but then signed by 6 other NFL teams. Six. Before finally leaving the league 4+ years after being drafted. And that guy never showed a thing, anywhere. Don't tell me other guys have nothing to do with it. The league works one way (this guy has been total sh** for 5 teams, but let's sign him!) for these hetero garbage players, and another way (ooh, we really needed to see four sacks from you in one game's worth of snaps, not three, so you'll have to go play in Canada now) for a gay player that did as well as anyone could do.

It's one thing to say "This sucks, but we have to accept it." I don't accept it, but I understand that line of thinking. I'm apathetic about all kinds of things. What I really don't understand is the complete and total denial from so many people, who insist Sam was given a fair chance and simply didn't perform well enough. I wonder what those people would have said about Warren Moon.

 

Thread closing in 3...2...1....

Seriously though. You're only picking him out of the group of guys who "didn't make it after one camp", because of his sexuality. Who says he doesn't get signed somewhere during free agency or after the draft?

Guys that don't make it after one season, go home and work on their craft to get better and come out showing what they've done to get better. What about Joe Six-pack that isn't signed right now after not making it? Does he get picked to be on Dancing with the Stars and labeled an NFL superstar?

We sit here every season nitpicking the coaches decisions to keep one guy over another and wondering what the coaches see that we don't because of preseason in-game performance/production. Sometimes they miss on a guy and he goes on to be good. Sometimes they're right and he's not signed or even given a flyer by another team. Warren Moon was a different issue. Why not use someone like Major Applewhite, who outperformed Cris Simms but never got a chance in the NFL, while Simms got to bounce around the league collecting a paycheck before getting a coaching gig and eventually a TV spot?

Fact is even with all of his supposed "accomplishments" in college he was "SEC Co-defensive player" not the consensus. Also, how many Heisman trophy winners are floating around as all-stars in the NFL?

To answer the other part, I do not want the Steelers to bring him into camp just because they think he deserves a fair shot. If they don't think he fits and they can use him don't bring him to camp.

 

Of course it's disgusting, Snack! I don't think anyone should be discriminated against for any reason EVER. If they can do the job adequately they should be given every opportunity to do that job. Sam has been given that opportunity twice now and has been released twice now. I'm speculating that he was released because the value that he provides is not sufficient to overcome the distraction that he may cause the rest of the team. In the end, the Rams and the Cowboys made a decision that I assume they felt was in the best interest of the team. Or maybe they just felt he wasn't good enough. I really hope it was the latter because I don't believe anyone should be discriminated against because of their sexuality. But the reality is that the teams are going to do what's in the best interest of the team. If they believe Sam, or anyone else (Tebow, etc.) is a distraction they may opt to pass, especially if they don't offer anything special to the team. I know this much though, if Michael Sam were a superstar the distraction that's created by his presence on the team would be much easier to overlook. He's not a superstar. He's average at best and that's why he's been cut twice and he'll be attending a veterans's combine in a few weeks. FWIW.

 

first off snack, your not going to tell fans how to act or what they should think. that's being as bigoted as they are. people have personal opinions and are fans, so if it goes against you and sam's orientation then they should change their feelings to make it correct. who's to say your thinking is correct for everyone else? this isn't an attack but more of a generalization.

people have the right to feel how they want about a subject whether right wrong or indifferent. this political correct world that is trying to be forced on the masses is never going to work while people have their own ways of thinking in a free society.

one player shouldn't be given an "extra opportunity" because he is openly gay and the next guy isn't. that's just as bad for the next guy. you are either good enough to make it as a "player" or not. the rest shouldn't come into play.

I don't think it's any different than say ray lewis. for example. ben for example. a murderer and a rapist still get to play in the NFL because they are good enough. I know neither are convicted of anything but public opinion, I'm just making this a reference of that public opinion not holding a player back. I think sam falls into this same category. he's not being held back by public opinion just lack of talent.

 

Yeah, I agree with all that. It's just a massive pile of BS. "Gay Pro Bowlers, right this way. We will defend your rights. Gay role players need not apply."

 

I'm still confused as to why Sam is considered a vet, since he never actually made a team?

 

Of course, it's because of his sexual Preference but you have to look at the big picture and impact of the whole team. Yes, hopefully he realize that he's being graded on him being gay rather then his talent

 

When I was a kid I always thought a veteran was someone who'd been playing for like 10 years. Nowadays they literally use it for anyone who isn't a rookie anymore. I don't know if the word changed, or just my understanding of it. But I guess he's not a rookie anymore, so he's technically a veteran, according to whoever.

 

That wasn't it at all. We played the ONLY defense that TT could beat: 100% stacked vs. the rush, leaving no safety or deep help, and 100% one on one coverage. And even when it went to OT, Dick STILL stayed in that same D. Both DL and MT deserved to be fired for their game plan that day, and fired twice - and had eggs smashed on their heads - for not adjusting that failed game plan as everyone could see it wasn't working. Just moronic.

 

I always thought a veteran was someone who actually had made a team and played at least one season.

 

So technically he's a veteran, but that label doesn't apply to his status as far as practice squad eligibility.

 

Oh, I agree with that completely. The first half, it made sense - make him beat you with his arm. Don't let him run on you. He'll never beat you throwing, so let him take his best shot.

Problem was, he passed all over us, and instead of respecting the kind of game he was having and playing it straight, DL doubled down and didn't change a single thing, just hoping Tebow would magically start sucking. He didn't, he kept dropping in perfect passes, so we lost.

 

Of course there are other gay players. Probably dozens of them. But who are they? Why don't we know their names again? Because there's no bias against gay players?

NFL players are young, so they tend to be more enlightened on the subject. Thankfully, we are at a place in time when a guy who outs himself as a bigot (Chris Culliver) he is bashed by other players. That's a step up from the 90s. However, that doesn't mean the vocal ones like Culliver are the only ones that feel like him. It also doesn't mean that players' opinions are the only ones that matter. There are fan bases, both for individual teams (do I really want a player that most of my fans passionately hate?) and the NFL (do I really want a player that brings all this attention because he's gay?).

May be a small point, but I think So'oto's experience makes his cut more sensible, because he's not all promise and upside, like a rookie. There's way more NFL tape on him, and due to his experience, you have to give him a little less credit for beating scrubs than you do for a rookie like Sam.

 

Tebow wasn't having a great game, Ike was exposed. We believed our own bull about Ike being a shutdown CB and we paid the price. And obviously it didn't help that Clark wasn't around to clean up messes in the secondary.

 

I guess we remember it differently. I remember Tebow dropping in several long passes where no coverage could have stopped it. And not just on Ike.

 

The fact Clark wasn't in there was the problem, not Ike. I'm drawing a blank on the knuckle head playing safety for Clark, but he bit on every play fake or fake run Tebow through out and constantly left the middle of the field open. That's on the safety, not Ike.