Dick Lebeau's defense is pathetic

When Brett Keisel goes from the worst starting DL on our team to the best in the span of a couple years (and not due to development), that becomes a problem. Cam Heyward shows promise, but like our offense, our DL is the weak point of the defense. It's very difficult to scheme around lack of talent, but LeBeau makes it work. We need a better size/strength/speed ratio all around, especially on the DL.

 

Wait. Your defense allows just one first down in the second half on Sunday while getting 2 Int's and a fumble recovery and they stink like crazy?

Yes, the first quarter sealed the Steeler's fate, but the defense hardly played that poorly. You might want to look at an offense that continually stalls out in the red zone and settles for FG after FG.

The defense is NOT what it once was and probably will not be that way for quite some time, but there has been a huge turnover in players and some of the newer guys have not played up to their potential on paper.

I would agree that Lebeau is on his way out, but you cannot hang it all on his defense. And for that matter, why is it all about the defense constantly? The defense has to make the big stops. The defense has to get turnovers. The defense has to give the offense field position and so on. Yet somehow the offense gets glossed over.

rutan

 

Its posts like this and the OP that make me scratch my head in disbelief. Can we be watching the teams?

I get your frustration and passion for this team but let's take a quick look at some brief facts.
1) LeBeau hasn't been DC here for 20 yrs.
2) He revolutionized NFL Defenses by pioneering and mastering the Zone Blitz out of the 3-4 set
3) When the Steelers finally took out the patsies a couple years back it was due to LeBeau's version of Ryan's "46" defense. What made this so sweet to me was the week prior to the game Brady was bragging how he knew everything LeBeau would do and told his team--- " I got this!!! "
4) LeBeau tweaked his 3-4 zone blitz with a rover ( Troy )
5) This year LeBeau created a hybrid SS/ILB. Instead of 3 CB & 2 S ( nickel ) where you loose your NT or his "46" he brings in an extra safety moving Troy to ILB replacing Vince.
6) LeBeau- against the raiders played 3 OLBers,- Woodley,Jones,Worilds and only one DL Heyward three times to shut down Pryor and one of these plays we got a int off a bad decision pryor made while being pressured. Remember as I said in an earlier post we shut down the raiders with only 35 yds and 1 st down in the 2nd half. Defense can't get much better than that.
7) That 1st play by pryor for a TD was on Timmons not doing his job, had ZERO to do with LeBeaus's scheme.

As I also pointed out earlier these defenses are very very complicated and it relies on ALL eleven players being on the same page. We lost Foote our field general and replaced him with a rookie. I like Vince very much and he'll be much better than foote....someday but not now. We lost OLB Harrison and replaced him with a rookie. You mentioned the aints... they got our CB Lewis who replaced with Allen who's struggled to stay healthy.

Our troubles are 1st not the defenses fault, and our once great but still good defenses slight decline is not LeBeaus fault. We have much bigger fish to fry than to be worried about LeBeaus coaching ability.

Cajun-

 

While I completely agree with this I may add Keisel is not a bad DL. In fact he is one of the better 3-4 DL playing today but when you loose the best ever ( smith ) and stable probowler NT Hampton your defense will take a hit in performance.

I think replacing Hood with Heyward is a plus. I'd like to see what McLendon could do at DE if this is in fact Keisel final year. A Beast NT would really help solve our DL problems.

Cajun-

 

Cajun - I think you make some great points, but I have to counter with some points as well. Granted this thread's title is Dick's defense stinks....I think the poster may have started that as a wake-up call that the defense isn't as great as we think it is. My comments to each of your points.

Points 1 and 2 - I agree wholeheartedly, Dick LeBeau is or at minimum has been a great DC who has made contributions to the league and the Steelers, the guy will always hold a strong place in the hearts of Steeler fans.

Point 3 - Yup that NE game was outstanding and Dick deserves major kudos for game planning against Brady's offense....problem is Dick rarely applies this same thought to other offenses. It isn't just Tom Brady who has made a field day of feasting on the Steelers by getting the ball out quick on 5-7 yard slants that turn into 10 or 15 yards. So yes Dick can mix it up, but let's face it, he rarely does. Considering that we don't have the horses we used to where the defense could do what it wants to do - there is actually probably more need to mix the defense up now and then.

Points 4 and 5 - Troy has played rover a bit - personally I think I would like to see Troy in coverage more because he is a better coverage guy than Ryan Clark. Ryan Clark is abysmal in coverage and spends his time trying to light someone up instead of actually providing coverage. Ryan Clark however does cover the run fairly well and is a pretty sure tackler when playing the run.

Point 6 & 7 - We shut the Raiders down in the 2nd half (in my opinion largely because Raiders played not to lose, their play selection was fairly turtle-like in the 2nd half), but the game was largely over considering the 21-3 deficit. The Steelers gave up over 180 yards rushing in the 1st half, including a punishing 70+ yard drive in the 2nd quarter with around 50 yards of it on the ground. Granted 93 on one play, but the Raiders still got another 90 averaging about 5 yards a pop to get that yardage. Also, Timmons did make a mistake...but don't you think Dick being the genius he is would teach, preach to his defense that some players need to stay home (like Ryan Clark for example)? That you can't literally leave half the field unguarded - especially against a QB who's primary attribute is his athletic ability. I mean we all know the advantage of the read option is the QB is an option - someone has to always be ready for that option.

Also, a comment on Larry Foote. If you are basing the ability of your defense to function on a guy being able to call the defense and it is that critical then maybe you need to simplify things some. It isn't like Larry Foote brings a lot as an athlete anymore to be a strong contributor. Also - how about some redundancy and getting someone else to call the defense like Timmons who has played in it for 6 years. When Foote did go down, they had Kion Wilson take over the head set - a guy who had been on the team for 3-4 weeks, WTF.

I get our offense sucks and it is worse than the defense - it does and I am disappointed in Haley thus far, but geesh that guy is dealing with a MASH unit situation for an offensive line. Dick at least has had most of his true starters for the season and yet people want to run Haley out of town, but St. LeBeau nary gets a criticism from the hardcore Pittsburgh press. People love to say if this offense could score over 21 points a game we would win most games. Well last year we lost to Denver, Tennessee, Dallas, and Oakland where the offense averaged 24 points a game and gave Dick's defense a lead mid-way through the 4th quarter and they couldn't hold it. The offense was back in the Chicago game 27-23 and Dick's defense immediately allows Chicago to move 70 yards for a TD. The team is up 16-9 with 8-9 minutes left in the game against Baltimore and Baltimore methodically marches down the field for a game tying TD mostly with short passes that were minimally defended by the defense. This defense deserves plenty of criticism.

 

What I understand from what you wrote supports Cajun's theory more. Every point you made points to the players not Lebeau. Even though I think Lebeau should retire and would be glad to get some new blood and intivative schemes in the burgh.

 

And, even with 17 TO's, the offense will score under 20.

 

When we start asking for change just for the sake of change, we are asking for trouble.

 

Your avatar made me bust out laughing! LOL!

 

Who is doing that?

Cajun-

 

The Saints don't have any pro bowlers on their defense but they find a way to blitz and sack the QB. Lebeau needs to be more creative instead of that same predictable cross dog blitz every team is expecting. The Steelers talent level has fallen off but Lebeau needs to take more chances they give every receiver a 10 yard cushion.

 

I know Lebeau hasn't been here for 20 years I was just making a point if his defense is so great why do they struggle against average QB's like Cassel he came off the bench and lit them up, the next week Cassel struggled and now he's benched. Like I said earlier there were a few teams the Steelers played in 2012 that commented after the game that the Steelers defense was predictable.

 

It's scary and that's for sure. LOL.

 

You mean LeBeau has nothing to do with ensuring that part of the field is defended on the read option?

You mean LeBeau has nothing to do with ensuring his defense is simplified enough in some capacity that it is reliant on a decrepit slow LB in Larry Foote

You mean LeBeau has nothing to do with ensuring his DB's at times recognize times to play tighter in coverage, recognizing down and distance.

You mean LeBeau has nothing to do with keeping Clark on the field despite numerous gaffes giving up big plays this season.

If you feel that way, then I would figure you would blame nothing on Haley either.

 

we dont know if Lebeau isn't telling them to play closer.

We don't know if Lebeau didn't brief them on the unguarded part of the field

we don't know if Lebeau hasn't trained Timmons on calling the plays but jus doesn't comprehend.

Now ow I agree Clark should be benched
the point is Lebeau can't make plays for these guys. They need to execute the plan like it was drawn up

 

The middle of the field has been wide open all year though. Maybe that's just the soft spot in the zone most of the time but I've seen it be very open all year. Do you think it's because Troy has to play up on the line so much?

 

we are not good at all 3 phases of the game. I can't believe our coaches forgot how to coach at a championship level. it's the players they are coaching.